Man on the train

[HunterHearstHelmsley]

I was travelling to work this morning on the train. All table seats and I like to sit in the aisle seat, I feel a bit trapped if I'm by the window. I had my handbag on my lap so the window seat was free.

A man got on and grunted at me and pointed at the seat. I tried to stand so I could get out and he could take the wondow seat. He said he was getting off in three stops so he'd sit in the aisle, I said so was I and tried to move out again. He was really insistent that I should sit by the window. After about a minutes debate and me saying that I just didn't want to sit in the window seat he shouted 'for fucks sake' and stormed off to another part of the train.

I didn't think I was being unreasonable at all. But starting to wonder a bit as the day goes on!

@bbc

Why should people have to 'ask' to take an available seat that they have paid for? It is irritating to have to request to occupy a seating space when there are other people squashing on behind you. Its just consideration to others. For three stops, as is the case here, it just seems so entrenched not to be able to move up. Really, I just cant understand why it is difficult to understand.

stormtreader
Yes, come to think of it you are totally right that the ettiquette is that the person clears a path, not moves seat. That just never happens.

@Pop

No it would not cancel out my experience, what a ridiculous statement. I am just saying that, in my experience, this is not an ideological or feminist point.

It's just a seat on a train. In the grand scheme of life, is it really worth the hassle either way?

YANBU op.

Don't move.

Very true @DismalDaphne, it's a shame the man had to make such a fuss and palaver over it, and swear and stomp off. Being so childish over such a simple thing.

My train is often so packed that its difficult for person in aisle to move so other person can go sit in window seat and aisle seat people tend to be oblivious to people standing like sardines around them.

I don't buy that women are frequently assaulted in window seats on packed commuter trains.

Would he have asked a bloke to move? And even if he did, would he have argued the toss with him?

Probably not.

Exactly, assassinated.

@Dismal - just a seat on the train? My God are you a daily commuter on packed commuter trains? Trains which if you are lucky enough to actually be able to board, a seat would be like god dust to you....

I've squeezed past people seated first a zillion times and thought nothing of it. The man was an entitled dick for expecting the OP to move and then swearing and making a fuss.

Shocked by the sexist nature of the responses. It amazes me how the average conversation can be dumbed down so quickly by such ridiculous correlations as this one to a sexist agenda.

Oh, and OP, YABU to argue you would feel trapped in the window seat, yet the train was so busy that you could not stand up to let him through, however you were feeling fine in the aisle seat.

I was punched in the face once, by a drunk girl who wanted my seat.

There were other seats she could have used. I think she just felt like hitting somebody.

I think you did the right thing OP. You were already seated, and you've explained why you don't like being trapped in the window seat, and from his behaviour he's not someone I would like to feel trapped by.

He had three choices, take the window seat, remain standing, or look for another aisle seat further down the train.

He didn't have a fourth option to insist you move and then shout at you when you refused.

A seat was available for him. He should have taken it without the tantrum or left it without the tantrum.

I don't understand why people think that his preferences beats yours when you were there first.

Or why his getting off in ten minutes matters. If he's getting off sooner than you (which apparently he wasn't), you'll move again in ten minutes. If you're happy to be disrupted again so soon there's still no issue. If you're not happy to be disrupted a second time you have the choice then of either keeping your aisle seat or taking the seat you won't be disturbed from. As you still preferred the aisle, he gets the window seat that was available and empty.

Regardless of all of that, he arrived after you, had a seat available to him even if it wasn't his preferred seat, had no better claim to your seat than you did (less of a claim since you were already sat in it), and chose to stamp about shouting and swearing like an idiot rather than sit down and behave.

YANBU.

Also nobody has to be charming to someone who's making demands to be accommodated above and beyond everybody else.

Of course it's not unreasonable to feel less trapped in the aisle seat. It's the OPs preference, and is based on how she feels, which doesn't need to be logical. It's her choice. There's no need to give her seat up to this man who demanded she move for him.

"Oh, and OP, YABU to argue you would feel trapped in the window seat, yet the train was so busy that you could not stand up to let him through, however you were feeling fine in the aisle seat."

Where are you getting that from? The train wasn't too busy to stop him from storming off, in the OP's words.

She tried to stand up, he told her to just move over. She said no, she'd stand up for him to go in and sit by the window. He stood and argued and then stormed away to another part of the train. She said she tried to move out to let him in twice, it sounds like the only thing stopping her doing that was the man himself.

If the train was that crowded that she couldn't stand up, he wouldn't have been able to storm off anywhere, he'd have been stuck in the aisle next to the OP and the seat she'd every right to keep.

*Would he have asked a bloke to move? And even if he did, would he have argued the toss with him?

Probably not*

Exactly.

I could be this man except I always ask politely. Wary of outing myself here but I had a spinal injury about ten years ago. Metal holding my neck vertebrae together now. I have limited flexibility in my legs. I simply cannot get into the window seat. If the only available seats are window seats I'll ask someone politely to move across. Usually they'll move across. Sometimes they'll get up and offer me the window seat. I then politely say I can't get into that seat and ask them to move across. Most do. Some refuse. Some are verbally rude. If there are other seats I will then thank them and ask someone else. I don't actually mean it when I thank them. but I do say thank you. Sometimes someone else at this point in an aisle seat says they'll take the window seat so I can sit down. I am very grateful to them. Sometimes I just have to stand. So if I ask and you decide to refuse then I am that arrogant patriarchal prick who had the temerity to ask you politely to move across. Hope that helps.

I can't understand why people think this isn't sexist

It reeks of it.

I have seen more arguments and blow out between males on trains over commuter type pains than I have ever seen arguments between males and females. Therefore, to suggest that he would not have got annoyed with a male is just speculation that is being bandied about in order to justify the argument that this is about sexism.

We are not talking about arguments or elbowing

We are talking about someone insisting they have a seat that another person is sitting in becuase they feel intitled to sit there

@Fulmerspot, that's not what happened here. He didn't explain that he was unable to access the available seat due to a disability, which is a perfectly reasonable request.

On my very busy commuter train people like the op are a big pain in the arse. A big queue forms as everyone has to shuffle around

I had a woman on ryanair give me a mini-speech about how the window seat made her claustrophobic. Yeah, me too - that's why i PAID EXTRA so i wouldnt have to sit there. You can do the same - you ain't havin' my aisle seat.
OP, you were in the right. Sorry you had to deal with a nast aggressive prick

"So if I ask and you decide to refuse then I am that arrogant patriarchal prick who had the temerity to ask you politely to move across. Hope that helps."

Do you shout "for fuck's sake" at women and storm off down the train though?

Or expect them to know all of this about you without any explanation whatsoever?

Because otherwise, what you've described isn't anything like what the OP has posted about.

@marinade

And I'm just saying that just because you had one type of rude experience on a commute, it doesn't mean that there can't be a different type of rude experience on a commute.

You basically said, a woman was rude to me once therefor male privilege doesnt exist. And that is a ridiculous statement.

And it's not one dimensional to say that male privilege is a factor. It looks like there were sprinkles of commuting rage, this guy being a dick, different views on seat etiquette all at play. But the way sexism (and the other isms) work isn't ALL or NOTHING.

You saying that someone saying there is sexism at play here is one dimensional basically undermines how all the ISMs work in society