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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Are you a feminist?

999 replies

NoLoveofMine · 06/08/2017 02:03

Yes or no...

OP posts:
CockacidalManiac · 06/08/2017 16:03

When I hear the 'equality for all' response to feminism, it reminds me of the 'all lives matter!' response to the Black Lives Matter campaign.
I.e. it spectacularly misses the point.

Longtime · 06/08/2017 16:06

I don't understand why certain posters say we don't need feminism anymore. They seem to be concentrating on certain aspects of life in 1st world countries only. There is a whole world out there beyond education and life in the UK where girls are treated far from equally and feel some posters are being shortsighted.

cuirderussie · 06/08/2017 16:06

cockacidal yes and bizarrely if you make that point you are told you're being a "white feminist" Hmm

BoneyBackJefferson · 06/08/2017 16:09

SeekEveryEveryKnownHidingPlace

You think there is a secret, singular, goal then?

did I say that it was a single goal?

You cab strive for many things.

pongoismyhero

I don't say that. I hate that saying.

Then you are one of a few.

BoneyBackJefferson · 06/08/2017 16:10

CockacidalManiac

then why do some feminists say it?

Mumof56 · 06/08/2017 16:11

"I know kids with their mums surname. I'm at one.
Doesn't change anything. "

It does apparently. It means you mother owns you.

LassWiTheDelicateAir · 06/08/2017 16:13

"Why is it so important that the whole world and her wife knows your marital status?"

Why don't you ask women who choose to use Mrs or Miss over Ms?

You are spectacularly missing the point. Setting the aristocracy aside "Mr" is adult males. Why does Mrs exist now other than to announce to the world you are or have been married (it used to be an honorary title for any older woman but that meaning is gone)

What is the equivalent of Mrs for a man? There isn't one.

muchomo · 06/08/2017 16:13

Amendment: Yes: i am a Black feminist. I make that distinction because I have different experiences and struggles due to being a woman and Black including racism by White males and females. Something that is often minimised and ignored on these Feminist chat threads.

Mumof56 · 06/08/2017 16:19

@lass

No I think you are missing the point. Women choose to use Mrs. over Ms. because they want to use that title. A pp earlier said why would we need to know someone's marital status unless we are going to marry them. Why do you need to know either a woman or a man's marital status by their title? We don't. So whywould we introduce one for men. It would be equal if women used ms. So we need to stamp out Mrs and Miss. The only thing that's continuing their use is those women who choose to use it.

How do you suggest we stop them choosing to use it? Hang them at dawn?

itsbetterthanabox · 06/08/2017 16:32

Mumof56
No we tackle it by normalising women keeping their names so doing it ourselves and challenging the status quo. A lot of women don't even realise they have the choice. Challenging that will slowly change things.
Men also often insist kids have their name and refuse to double barrel and want women to take their name. We need to challenge men who have this attitude. There's a lot of them.

BertrandRussell · 06/08/2017 16:33

Have we been told what we're striving for yet?

LassWiTheDelicateAir · 06/08/2017 16:38

You really don't get this Mum56 do you?

Why do British married women want a special title to show they are married?

No one is suggesting we use a special title for men. That point is to show how utterly ridiculous a concept "Mrs" is.

The point is what is this obsession certain British women have in changing to Mrs when they get married ? Other nationalities don't do this.

Painfulpain · 06/08/2017 16:40

shit hole country???

You fucking racist prick Mrs

Mumof56 · 06/08/2017 16:41

"A lot of women don't even realise they have the choice"

What? You have to actively change your name. Renew passports etc. Chaneg what you call yourself when you introduce ypurself to people, change your name at the bank, produce marriage certificate. How could they not know. Where do all these uneducated women live? In the UK girls are afforded the same education as boys. Why make out that women ae too dumb to know oy'
it's not compulsory? Ypu are doimg women no service bu clsiming they are too dumb to realise they have a choice.

Painfulpain · 06/08/2017 16:41

mum not Mrs

Mumof56 · 06/08/2017 16:42

@pain

So what would you call a country where fgm is normal. The Bastian of enlightenment?

Mumof56 · 06/08/2017 16:44

I never mentioned a race. You are prescribing a race to a country. All people from country x are the same race are they?Hmm

It seems it might be you that's a racist, because you don't think people of different races can live in the same country.

Icantreachthepretzels · 06/08/2017 16:53

You are spectacularly missing the point.
she seems to be doing that quite a lot. The idea that some traditions started hundreds of years ago, were quite derogatory towards women, and have been continued unthinkingly into the present seems quite beyond her.

Marriage, name changing, title changing was all to do with ownership. Men didn't do any of this because they weren't owned, they were people in their own right. But the fact that some of us know this and so object to the tradition is terribly amusing for some reason.

SmileEachDay · 06/08/2017 16:55

Have we been told what we're striving for yet?

Betrand I think we'd need a man to tell us, right? I don't feel qualified

CockacidalManiac · 06/08/2017 16:58

then why do some feminists say it?

You've lost me?

Mumof56 · 06/08/2017 16:59

lol, @cantreach

the fact we no longer live in historical times and these days it is a choice women make seems to be beyond your grasp.

You describing women as "unthinking" is bizarre. Many women choose to change and just as many don't. Just because you don't think changing their name is "right" doesn't make them unthinking. It means they have made a different choice to what you think they should have.

CherryChasingDotMuncher · 06/08/2017 17:05

Have we been told what we're striving for yet?

Is it ladies nights in all nightclubs??

Takes the family court thing being in favour of men has been debunked I'd like to point out that sentencing for crimes being in favour of women is also bullshit.

And if you're interested in hearing why father's rights being at a disadvantage is also bullshit, looks into how Fathers 4 Justice were invited to be official stakeholders in a consultation to improve rights for men in the family court, and they did Sweet FA to contribute. Far more fun to whine about how they shouldn't pay for their kids and dick about dressed as Batman in Buckingham Palace.

Icantreachthepretzels · 06/08/2017 17:12

No, i understand that our history and our traditions help to define who we are and how we think. And if something has always been done a certain way then people will often accept that, without question. Not questioning a belief or a tradition that you have been brought up with does not make you 'unthinking' full stop, it means you haven't thought about this, because it just is. That isn't me making things up, entire, very powerful religions are based on people accepting tradition without question - its what people do, they have other things to worry about and changing your name or not is not going to rank high on people's worry list.

I have already stated I don't care either way what people do to their own name. but the fact that women are generally expected to change their name, and will give it some thought on getting married - whilst men won't even stop to consider such a move - can tell even the hardest of thinking that there is a societal expectation that is placed on women from without, and many just go with it.

I know if I got married when I was in my early 20s I would have changed my name, i practised my new signature and everything. Because i hadn't thought about it, it was just what you did. Now I've thought about it and its not for me. Both my mother and grandmother changed their names without thinking about it and went on to regret it.

My opinion is neither here nor there, my point has always been that it is not a free choice made in a vacuum. it is a choice made heaped with societal expectation, negative reactions to going against the grain in some cases and centuries of tradition. Those traditions have misogynist origins. The fact that women routinely follow a societal expectation and men don't bother is sexist, and this societal expectation has been brought to us through the mists of a patriarchal past.

PotatoVegQuery · 06/08/2017 17:14

Am I for equality? Of course, but whilst I know there's different types of feminism, what I see on the threads by a few well known feminist posters I can't get behind their mentality and disagree with it

pongoismyhero · 06/08/2017 17:16

what I see on the threads by a few well known feminist posters I can't get behind their mentality and disagree with it

What mentality is that?