Children of the opposite sex in changing rooms

[Gatecrasher61]

OK - firstly I am not a parent (probably shouldn't be on here, but hey ho) so I am happy to be corrected.

Our local swimming pool has open changing rooms, no cubicles. I tend to go swimming after work, which is just before the kids swimming lessons. When the kids arrive, I am normally getting dressed in the changing room after my shower.

Often women come into the changing room with their sons who are between 8-11 and are often greeted with the sight of me starkers! Probably not a good sight as I am middle aged and a size 14 on a good day, but there is no where else to go!

Now I know that other women have complained about this but have been told that the Mums are not happy for their boys to go into the men's changing rooms are they are not able to dress themselves and also don't like them being there with male adults who are strangers.

I learnt to swim when I was six and a half. My Dad used to take me to a swimming club where I had lessons and I had to prove that I could get dry and change myself and also sort out my kit.

Now I realise that boys are different, but is it really appropriate for boys of that age to be in the women's room? Surely they should be able to dress themselves at the age of six or seven?

Having cubicles for all seems a better way forward than these open rooms that many people of both sexes don't like anyway. Remember when changing rooms in shops had a fashion for communal changing? That died out.
Although my ds is old enough to change without me, the public pools here all have unisex changing so he is in the cubicle next to me. When we were on holiday last year was the first separated changing we'd come across. He dutifully went to the mens bit, changed and then spent ten minutes wandering around reception as he couldn't find his way to the pool (dyslexia and no one else around not helping). I hadn't equipped him for this situation as it had never arisen before, I know as mothers we are meant to think of everything but we are more likely to train them up for situations we meet regularly.

winchester I know they're children. I mean immature for their age, obviously.
Not as in immature as compared to adults. Immature as compared to other 8 year olds who are perfectly capable of getting dried and dressed by themselves.

Males over 8 don't belong in ladies' changing rooms. It's your privacy/dignity that is being impinged upon, not the boys'. I'd complain to the management.

FanjoForTheMammarie

its a fucking minefield, this man befriended me and my 13 year old friends. he was very handsome so we got all swoony. disgusting creep he was

With doors, when DH used to take DD2 to some lessons, she used to just wait politely for someone else to use the door (or ask). For lessons you know others will be coming and going at about the same time.

I have to admit I can't help wondering why a swimming pool needs such a good fire door. Are swimming pools really a high risk fire area? What with all the water and everything.

You might think so, but wasn't there a fire in a council pool somewhere in Devon?

Teen That is one idea. The problem is that this isn't mass lessons in a big pool. This is one group of 4-6 kids in a gym pool. So far less people around. And Dd is a fairly anxious child and is already worried about it.

If it was ds I'd be less worried - him getting stuck in the changing rooms would be a great opportunity for him to attempt to switch all the showers on simultaneously and gleefully try (and fail!) to run in and out without getting wet.

For Dd just the thought of it is enough to keep her up at night.

I prefer the model with single-sex change-rooms and family / disabled change-rooms. The pool I go to has these and the showers and toilets are in the same area. No boys over 7 allowed in the women's, although of course this does not happen in practice. Apparently the women's is favoured over the family room because it has multiple showers and the FR only one and so it's quicker to use the women's. I don't want unisex because I strip off in the shower in order to wash my bathers and me properly (skin issues). I'd also be worried about being perved on or filmed. This did happen to me once and it has left me very wary. I like the set up where I go because there are two doors with a blind trap in the middle, so no one can even see in from outside. I used to go to a different pool a few years ago and was witness to a situation where a woman brought two boys in. Two girls refused to get changed as a result and there were words exchanged between the mothers. Both the mother of the girls and I complained to reception, but they shrugged and said there was nothing they could do and told us to change at home. Boys' rights rule apparently. :(

You might think so, but wasn't there a fire in a council pool somewhere in Devon

Pool chemicals burn.

How and why are we teaching girls that they should feel shy about others seeing their bodies. Why are we teaching them that there is more reason to be shy if a child that sees their body is male rather than female?

If we want adult men to respect girls and women more, then shouldn't we start by not telling boys they aren't allowed to see female flesh? Or telling girls they should not let boys see them naked? Surely all this othering is the direct cause of men seeing women as 'other'?

The victorians kept women's legs covered due to the idea that any visibility would provoke uncontrollable outbursts of sexual desire. So what happened when women started showing their legs? Did all the men suddenly go mad with desire or did legs stop being sexualized?

Imagine if we all just got changed in the same room, mum's dad's children with and without any disabilities and of either gender.

What if we just ditched the idea that naked bodies should never be seen by members of the opposite sex, just as we ditched the idea that ankles should never be seen by members of the opposite sex?

Sorry for all the posts, but that door sounds bloody dangerous. Children, mobility impaired people and elderly people might be trapped in the event of fire or other dangerous situation. Have you discussed this with management? Are you in Scotland? There seems to be a thing about multiple and heavy fire doors in Scotland....

I for one hate my son been alone in a male changing room but at 13 I have no choice. While hes in there I have no control on strangers talking to him and perhaps even taking pictures or more. There are some sick people about and they dont have a look/sign round their heads.

If we want adult men to respect girls and women more, then shouldn't we start by not telling boys they aren't allowed to see female flesh? Or telling girls they should not let boys see them naked? Surely all this othering is the direct cause of men seeing women as 'other'?

Well given there are reports of 10 + year old boys (NT) who are so immature they can't even be trusted to get changed by themselves I don't think that's going to happen is it.

It's not even about forbidden flesh just people wanting to not have their bit class mates see them naked and boys going through puberty are probably not really wanting to be around naked women either surely?

Just had a thought I know people keep talking about girls being uncomfortable but I know my 9yr old ds would hate to get dressed in a woman's communal changing room. He wouldn't go in one even if it was all cubicals because he wouldn't step in the door. He's the same with toilets he says they are for girls not me. He can't be the only one like this can He?

Morphene, its because it's not socially acceptable to be naked in front of others in public, it may be in other countries, but not here in the UK, and is not always safe. We need to focus on keeping children safe. My daughter has a learning disability and is vulnerable, so it is my job to protect her, not encourage her to strip off where she would potentially be at risk. Of course this also goes for any child.

I'll be more comfortable around men when hell freezes over when pornography, prostitution, rape, sexual assault, men filming women in vulnerable situations, indecent exposure, men's violence against women are bad historical memories and roundly condemned by all men.

Me too nicknanehelp and mine's onlyn8. Somethiing happened a few weeks ago when he was changing after his swimming HG lesson, which had his friend in tears and DS barely able to speak. Manger is investigating. I've been asking about family changing rooms for years, but they mIntain there is no space and are reluctant to give up the unused crappy soft play area. (I think the incident was someone shouting at them rather than anything sexual).

morphene if you want to strip off in public then feel free. You're not going to persuade many other people to do it.
Of course there's a difference between being naked in front of the same sex and the opposite sex. And young girls are perfectly entitled to feel 'shy' getting undressed in front of males - why on earth shouldn't they be? Their bodies are not for public display. That you seem to think they're not makes me question if you have an agenda,quite honestly. I seem to remember you expressing similar views on other threads about female changing rooms - as if there's something wrong about wanting privacy.

YetAnother Despite my chemistry A-level I didn't know that.

Still - good to know the fire door isn't just there as "one of those things that make life hard".

A family change would be ideal though.

And will anyone affected/ outraged here, actually even write a letter to the venue, council and MP to complain?

^ re the door - I'm not convinced it has to be heavy and hard to open. There are ways to put electronic openers on - I go through a few doors like this in one bld I work in. Family change rooms should be a given.

So I just called the pool. Explained to the woman the issue and she said she didn't know what to advise me so she would put me through to the manager.
Explained the situation to the pool manager.
She confirmed the age for separate changing is 7.
She suggested I came with DH one weekend and do a trial run so he would know what to do. I explained that this wouldn't really help and it's not safe to leave him alone.
I asked if there were staff supervising the changing rooms. No - there's the cleaning lady who does a continual round of all the changing rooms but she wouldn't have time to check on him/its not her job.
I asked what she suggested. The answer is that I take him with me until people start complaining. That people will notice he is different if they watch and speak him so she doesn't think it would be an issue. Although she did say they had the same situation with a mother and her 19 year old son and they got complaints.
I asked if they had a third entrance/disabled facility and no, it's only the ones in the changing rooms.
All she could say was to keep going and make sure we use the swimming changing rooms, not the gym changing rooms.
No answer for what to do once people complain...

Although she did say they had the same situation with a mother and her 19 year old son and they got complaints.

No shit, Sherlock. What did they think was going to happen?!

Is that really the best solution they can come up with?

So basically leave parents and carers of disabled people open to abuse from other people.
Doobree do you realise how much time the above already spend fighting for basic things. How many hours it takes to sort out an ehcp for example. Our mp is also well known for not giving a shit so I wouldn't even bother going there.