AIBU? IHBU? Are we both BU?

[GigaBite]

I was wondering if PPs could read the following text conversations between XH and me and say which of us are BU? If it is me, could you say how you would handle things differently/what you would say? The exchanges are usually about contact with the DC and maintenance.

Text convo 1:
XH: What the fuck is he doing taking my daughter in to a bookies tell him he doesn't take her again ('him' is my BF)
Me: Don't know what you're talking about. Kids aren't allowed in bookies - over 18s only.
XH: DD says she was in 1
Me: Well that's impossible so she obviously wasn't.
XH: We're was she filling football coupons in then and then going home watching football to see if they won any money
Me: They were allowed to pick a few teams but they never went in a bookies, they didn't fill in football coupons, they didn't watch TV, we just told them their teams hadn't won.
XH: So you encouraging gambling now well done
Me: Oh fuck off being a sanctimonious bastard XH. No, I don't encourage gambling - they didn't know what it was, it was only a one off. You play the lottery don't you? Let them pick the numbers sometimes don't you? Fucking hypocrite! I'd be more concerned about the message your attitude to casual and excessive drinking will do to them as they grow up. Not to mention your relationships with drug and alcohol abusers.

Text convo 2:
Me: It's coming up to the end of November and you still haven't paid me any money back. You also haven't paid for the school photo. I need you to pay me back as well as your half for DD's party ASAP. When can I expect it?
five hours later
XH: I'll sort it I'm taking kids to local town lights switch on and I've booked them in to get there nails done can you make sure they dressed suitable and there hands are clean please
Me: tonight? They're not allowed nail varnish on at school so can you remove it before you bring them back in the morning.
XH: yes
next day
Me: Listen carefully XH. I specifically said to you yesterday that you would need to remove any nail varnish as the girls are not allowed to wear it to school. I don't have time in the mornings along with everything else I have to do to get them to school. You didn't listen. You also (yet again) didn't bath them and their hair is dirty and Dd2 is covered in pen. Time and time again, you are neglecting their basic needs. You are frequently late for picking them up and get here for them so late that I have to give them their evening meal - yet the fact that you have them overnight means that you reduce your child maintenance payments. Dd1 frequently returns home tired and angry which leads me to believe you are putting them to bed late. This is not working for the children. I am letting you know that this is your LAST CHANCE to prove you can look after the children properly. That means turning up on time for them, bathing them, ensuring they go to bed at a reasonable time and paying your fair share of their expenses (including paying me back the money you already owe). If you continue to neglect your responsibilities towards them you will leave no alternative but for us to reexamine your mid week contact which will probably go along with what is standard for the vast majority of other separated parents, ie. you collect them from school once a week and keep them for tea and return them home in time for a bath and bed. Additionally, I have to pay the entertainer for dd2's party on Saturday (your share is £82.50) and your half of the cost of the food, party decorations/plates/party bags/cake which will be in the region of £150 (your share £75). I expect you to pay me this by Sunday at the latest.

Text convo 3:
XH: When am I going to see the kids it's getting behond a joke now
Me: I don't know. They say they don't want to go.
Me: Also, you didn't turn up for them on Boxing Day or Tuesday. (his scheduled contact days)
XH: I couldn't I didn't have a car well there coming it's taking the piss now they won't get a choice when it goes to court why were they at your mums today you knew I was coming to pick them up
Me: Ok, because you can't go anywhere without a car? What about taxis? Actually the courts will take their views into account. I'm not sure why you're blaming me? They don't want to go so short of forcing them kicking and screaming (which i won't do to dd1 the way she is at the moment) then I don't know what you're expecting. You don't give a shit where they are the rest of the time but if you must know, I'm at work today. You know, so I can earn money to feed and clothe them since you don't feel any obligation whatsoever to help with that.
Me: You were meant to come for them at 10. You weren't here by 10 past so I took them to my mum's because I had to work. You didn't even get in touch until 10.45 so you were 45 minutes late. I have to make a plan b whenever you're meant to have them as you're so unreliable.

XH: Why couldn't you drop them at mine then on your way to work
Me: see my message above
XH: I was there at quarter past 10
XH: waiting outside for ages
Me: I messaged you at 10.11. Scroll back and have a look. You messaged at 10.40.
XH: I not arguing all the time u want to see them tomorrow what time you going to work
Me: You think I want to argue? I just want you to be a good dad and someone they are happy to visit. They deserve that but you seem more bothered about point scoring. You haven't given me a penny since May for them. That's 7 months where I've had to provide EVERYTHING for them. You don't know the half of it. You don't have to worry about half the crap I deal with yet you think you're hard done by? I will talk to them about going to yours tomorrow but every time I ask, they say they don't want to. I will let you know.
XH: You don't want to argue but you mind filling kids head slagging me off all the time
Me: Yeah, that's exactly it XH 🙄 Never mind that they are bored shitless at yours, complain to me that you don't take them anywhere, shout all the time, have insufficient clothing for them, don't brush their teeth and tell me all you do is shout, it must be because of me? When are you going to stop make my excuses whenever something in your life goes wrong? There's one common factor to all this and it's YOU.
XH: Change your getting boring now
Me: Wow, I didn't see that response coming a mile off 🙄 I tell you what's boring, having the same fucking conversation with you over and over again yet you ignoring everything I say anyway. Nothing is going to change until you accept some responsibility for the way the girls feel and stop blaming me. That's the reality whether you want to accept it or not.
XH: Just tell me what time I can pick them up in morning

Obviously these are taken completely out of context, but on the face of it, who is BU? Before I get accused of drip feeding, I will explain the context later.

You are both awful to each other. Petty childish point scoring on both parts. You need to evaluate what you want to achieve from all this bs.
Couldn't even finish reading it tbh.

Then you really shouldn't voice such an uninformed opinion.

You're right Nanny Ogg and Hissy, but I think you're dealing with a load of professional bitch-ploppers here .

I think you're in the right about most of it. Taking her to get her nails done when she isn't allowed to wear nailpolish at school is just arsey, and he needs to pay you what he's due. The only one where I think you could be in the wrong is regarding the gambling one. Kids shouldn't be encouraged to be involved in gambling in any way whatsoever, and your boyfriend was irresponsible.

He's messaged me with the following and I could use some help with a reply or whether I should just ignore? This was his response to me saying the girls didn't want to see him yesterday which was true. It's got my back up because there's the implication that it's my fault that they don't want to go or that I'm lying. It's true that there was a period about two months ago where DD1 wanted to go to his all the time because he bought her a phone but she has since changed her mind and doesn't want to go anymore. DD2 has refused to go the last two of his weekends, the last one he wouldn't even get out of his car to comfort her or encourage her as she stood at the front door crying. His solution was to shout at her to hurry up After, I messaged his sister to say that I was coming to the end of continuing the arrangement, not just because of the way he behaved over dd2 not wanting to go, but a culmination of lots of things over the last few months. I've also not insisted he could not see one without the other but historically he favours dd1 and has many times left dd2 but taken dd1 which really pisses me off as it's totally unfair. Also, the money was me asking for half of their uniform as I've had to pay just short of £1k for childcare over the summer holidays which he won't help with either.

Message:
I find it a bit funny that you say kids don’t want to come just after everything got sorted out with them and I find it funny they don’t want to come just after you have been asking for more money. Also you have told my sister your not going to let me see them again?

It was ok the other weekend when DD2 didn’t want to come and I had DD1 on her own and it was ok when I was picking DD1 up for you when you couldn’t cope with her and she came on her own. It was ok when I had DD2 on her own too when DD1 didn’t come so don’t give me the bull shit of saying you either have them both together or none at all because it you have never said that before. You cant just make the rules up as you go along.

How should I respond?

Just reply with:

"Next contact date is X at X time, please be on time."

Don't get sucked into the argument.

You then need to focus on making the visit as positive as possible to your children. Not easy, I know, but you need to make sure that you can't be accused of brainwashing the kids against their father if it ever does get to court (not for a second saying that you are btw). Try to encourage them to see their dad. If they still don't want to go then you tried.

He wants to goad you. this you know.

So don't let him. Take a breath, rant and rail and scream if you want to, but not on text.

BREATHE

then do NOTHING.

There is no question here, no request, no point that is relevant to the kids. it's just him pondering.
Let him ponder.

Don't communicate with his sister about things, unless she's doing 3rd party handovers. It's none of her business and best to assume none of his family are on your side or will advocate for you.

Ignore his insinuations. Do not attempt to answer or justify, just ignore completely.

Have a think about what the parameters of contact are and have been, write them down and decide what's reasonable and what works.

Take your time, do not respond to him until you are calm and objective. Then lay out terms of contact that will suit you from now on. If he argues, just respond that previous arrangements were not working, and be prepared for a lot of bluster you don't rise to after that.

Don't respond. And you shouldn't have involved his sister either. You're just stirring up more drama involving more people. Disengage means disengage. It doesn't mean tell other people the message knowing they will tell him. It means stop engaging altogether. Ignore him, don't involve his family for them to pass messages on. Stop all discussion about it. Ignore him, ignore any messages form his sister, parents whoever tries to get you to discuss it. Ignore them all. The only thing you respond to is a solicitor letter from him asking to arrange contact.

Thank you everyone. I appreciate having a sounding board here. My instincts are to point out that this is coming from the DC for reasons I've already made him aware of.

I should have mentioned before but it was his sister who got involved. She messaged me out of the blue trying to reestablish contact. Initially she was working with him to parent better by taking him shopping for the kids' clothes but after a very brief improvement, things went down hill. I messaged her after the last weekend to keep her in the loop. She's much more reasonable than him but still very much on his side.

I'm not sure what else I can do to encourage the girls to go. He's broken too many promises to them and they don't believe he will do the things he says he will. I do gently encourage them to go but they are adamant and without his cooperation or willingness to change some things, I can't see them ever wanting to go again and I'm limited in terms of changing their minds.

He's so caught up in blaming me that I feel stuck. Should I message him back saying that social services have referred us to a facilitated contact thing? Or just leave it for now as we'll be on a waiting list? I honestly don't know what to do about contact in the mean time as we're going round in circles with the girls refusing to go and him blaming me.

Don't reply. It really is that simple.

Or just set up a new email account and just reply 'From now on please send all communication via xxxx'.

Then block him on your phone. (You can unblock later if you need to).

Should I message him back saying that social services have referred us to a facilitated contact thing?

NO!! You really need to commit to either carrying on as you are or totally disengaging. Which is it? If you keep doing what you've always done, you will always get what you have always gotten. You really need to break your habit of wanting to contact him. You are keeping this shitty dynamic going every time you do.

I honestly don't know what to do about contact in the mean time as we're going round in circles with the girls refusing to go and him blaming me.

The children don't want to go. What more do you need to know? You don't need to do anything. They just don't go, don't need to explain that to him or ask him for alternative arrangements or to take one at a time. They just don't go and that's it. Ignore every call, text, email from him or his family. The only thing you respond to is a solicitors letter asking to make contact arrangements.

please dont reply. Just get on with your day. Did you set up the email address for him to contact you or another phone? If not perhaps you should look at that now.
Earlier on you posted that you felt responsible for the relationship between your DC and the wanker who is their father - it is not your job to ensure this.
Try and take control back bit by bit, it will take time and be hard but you can do it.

Thanks MeanAger. I think that's the crux of the matter - making a decision one way or another. I genuinely do not want to be in contact with him. For a brief time, everything was done through his sister and I was much calmer and happier not having to speak/communicate with him. If I completely ignore him, he will start turning up at the house like last time but I suppose I then have to call the police.

I still haven't come to terms with the fact that his relationship with our DC is over for the time being. I never wanted this. I just wanted him to be a good father. I've always had this idea that at some point he will realise and start doing what's right but I think the penny is starting to drop (thanks to this thread) that this is never going to happen.

I know this stuff must be so obvious to others but I have been so well conditioned. Is it ok to support my DC's decision not to go or do I keep trying to encourage them?

He actually emailed the above message I've spent 18 months telling him to email me, I don't want to talk etc. but this is the first time he's actually listened.

I will ignore the message and work out what to do next.

Ignore the message. Be strong and don't crack. If he turns up ignore him knocking on the door. If he gets aggressive, call the police. But do not engage with him at all. The first he should know about it is when the police car pulls up outside your house.

Think of yourself as a castle, protecting your children. Pull up the drawbridge and surround yourself with reinforcements. The only way he gets access is when he starts doing what is best for them - regular, agreed contact in a safe environment.

I've had a similar situation with XH. He now has DS1 once a fortnight for an overnight (court ordered) and he knows he's got 30 minutes either side of pick up time to turn up or not to bother. He plays no other part in DS1s life at all, no money, no being involved with school, doctors, clinics, clubs, anything.
If he tries to be aggressive or goady I just tell him that I'm not engaging and will only discuss things civilly that pertain to DS1.

I've always had this idea that at some point he will realise and start doing what's right but I think the penny is starting to drop (thanks to this thread) that this is never going to happen.

Oh I hear ya loud and clear! I was exactly the same. I always thought that after enough time of seeing the Dc he would develop an actual bond and want to see them. When I failed to turn up I would send messages like you have reminding him of the agreement etc. It always led to squabbling and both of is being pissed off. Thanks to a frankly awesome social worker I have realised that I cannot make him the parent he should be. I realised a few months ago that my ex has been a parent for 12 years and still wasn't managing to actually parent. He was always full of excuses as to why he didn't turn up or was late or hadn't fed them etc. Well if 12 years isn't enough time to get the hang of it I don't know what is. I've been managing it from day 1 when I was a clueless teenager. My ex failed to turn up for his last contact and hasn't seen them in 9 weeks. He lives 10 minutes drive away and he has passed us in the street in the town we live in twice and beeped the horn and waved. after both those times I expected him to get in touch to arrange seeing them again....nothing. He missed our eldest's birthday. no card through the letter box or anything. That's says it all. And I'm leaving him to it. I'm not texting my anger about the situation. Been there, done that, it ends up with me stressed and him making promises he won't keep. So I'm done. I thought if I didn't get in touch he would eventually but he hasn't. I have no idea when or if he will. It's sad but it's what he has chosen to do with his life as a parent. I'm doing my bit and more. The only thing I can say is that these nine weeks (and the several month long periods in the past) have been utter bliss with no contact from him. The Dc are happy and not worrying about whether he will turn up or not or whether he will shout at them or if they are getting dinner.

If he turns up ignore him knocking on the door. If he gets aggressive, call the police. But do not engage with him at all. The first he should know about it is when the police car pulls up outside your house.

Yes!! This^. It's very hard not to react but it is so important and sends a really strong, clear message.

I would support the dc sort of like this :

• I love you and I will always be here for you no matter what.
• You are allowed to decide if you want to go to your dad's or not.
• if you decide you don't want to see your father right now, that's ok, I won't try to make you.
• I will help you and I will not be upset whichever decision you make.
• You are allowed to change your minds.

You have taken on the job of trying to bridge the gap where his parenting should be.
And as long as you go on doing so, he will continue to let you.

Your only responsibility is to your children- not to be their surrogate father, but to be an excellent mother.

Do what category12 says.
Ignore him.
Get on with your own life with zero expectation that you will have support from him.

Hi all, so I've been much better st putting the advice here into practice and ignoring his goady messages and just responding with factual short messages.

However, XH came for them as scheduled yesterday but neither DD wanted to go. My youngest then agreed that he'd spend today with her if she could be returned home that evening. He promised to take her out to one of her favourite activities. Told her he'd pick her up between 10 and 11.

He didn't turn up and absolutely no word from him as to why. He's messed the kids about like this before but not without a call or text to give some shit excuse. DD was really disappointed and wanted to call him but I distracted her instead.

I want to ask, in this scenario would you have emailed to ask why he didn't show? Would you have let DD call (she's 6)? Should u just wait for him to get in touch?

Apologies for typos!

And name change fail