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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Man in ladies toilets

662 replies

ItsAHardKn0ckLife · 26/07/2017 10:23

Okay I'm not sure if I'm being unreasonable here, husband works away, have an unwell toddler and I'm a little sleep deprived. So not sure if emotions are getting the better of me.

Popped into our local M&S, DS (2yo) in tow. Needed to use the toilet before shopping. Walk into the ladies (small bathroom, only 2 cubicles) to an older man and woman (late 60's at a guess) changing a babies nappy. I stopped in my tracks, confused, checked I'd definitely walked into the right toilets.
I said "you are aware this is the ladies?"
"Yes" the woman replied, "have you got a problem?"
"Erm, well yes actually I have"
Cue lots of tutting and huffing and puffing whilst I waited patiently for him to leave.
On their way out of the door I was told I was being "absolutely ridiculous" and "totally unreasonable".
In hindsight I probably should have ignored, but I was feeling pretty pissed off so I went to inform a member of staff.
The couple were standing near me and they were shouting that I'm a hypocrite as I took my DS in there with me. Again repeating that I was unreasonable etc and what did I expect them to do? They then walked off.

I ended up crying Blush

The staff were lovely and offered me a very nice cup of tea. I apologised for being an emotional wreck and causing drama.

So was I wrong for being unhappy about this? Would you have said something or just turned a blind eye to him being in there?

OP posts:
Gileswithachainsaw · 27/07/2017 11:35

Exactly delete

There have been so many excuses as to why the man needed to be there. Everything from disability to not knowing or refusing to change a nappy himself yet no one thinking the op could have been through things.

Unusual for MN the they are usually suloirtibe of women's rights to not have men in women only spaces.

Gileswithachainsaw · 27/07/2017 11:35

Supportive

RatherBeRiding · 27/07/2017 11:56

I'm with the OP on this one. It really doesn't matter why the man felt he needed to be in the women's toilets. The fact remains that they are purely for the use of women, and that should take precedence over whatever inconvenience this couple might otherwise be put to.

They always had the option of approaching a member of staff if they were really incapable of changing the nappy without both of them being involved in the process.

Whilst the man was obviously not a pervert and would appear to have a good reason to be in the women's toilets, that really doesn't matter. Where do you draw the line? "These toilets are solely for the use of women. Unless you are a man with a good reason to use them." Define "good reason".

If we are so ready to accept that a man with a good reason can be in the women's toilets it won't be long before men with questionable motives start inventing good reasons to be in there.

Why should a woman wanting to use the women-only toilets have to ask why there is a man in there? Male cleaners - not a problem. There is always a sign outside to that effect. Other men - No. If you think your reason is good enough, approach a member of staff to verify your right to enter the women's toilets and accompany you if necessary.

allegretto · 27/07/2017 12:42

Define "good reason".

Why do we have to define everything? Can we not just use some common sense for once? Hmm The other day I took DD into the men's loos as there was a huge queue for the ladies and she was bursting. I just said "sorry" and nobody batted an eyelid. Of course, someone may have posted a snippy comment on whatever the male equivalent of mumsnet is but I am blissfully unaware.

Bigoldsupermoon · 27/07/2017 13:03

Why do we have to define everything? Can we not just use some common sense for once?

Define common sense. To me, common sense doesn't look like a man going into the women's toilets then getting huffy when a woman has a problem with him being there.

crumpet · 27/07/2017 13:07

I would have assumed that it was grandparents changing a nappy, and possibly not too used to doing it, hence needing a hand. Lone man hovering in the loos, a problem. Pair of OAPs changing a nappy, wouldn't have occurred to me to worry.

allegretto · 27/07/2017 13:14

Why do we have to define everything?

Define common sense.

GrinGrinGrinGrinGrinGrin

Morphene · 27/07/2017 13:37

At least people have stopped claiming the legal right to penis free toilets. That's a step forward.

Floisme · 27/07/2017 14:31

I just said sorry
Exactly. But this man didn't.

User843022 · 27/07/2017 14:37

'And this couple have no idea why the op and other women might feel uncomfortable with the presence of a man in the ladies. It goes both ways, '
Exactly. The moral of the story is to be nice to be people, whether in the wrong toilets or finding someone in said wrong loos. It's never going to happen unfortunately.

YetAnotherSpartacus · 27/07/2017 15:06

Definitely YANBU. No men in women's spaces. Also, his audacity in thinking he had a right to be there and that the OP should not have a problem.

ArcheryAnnie · 27/07/2017 15:19

Late to the party, OP, but YANBU. You weren't rude or unreasonable at all, they were. Men should not be in women's loos.

Arealhumanbeing · 27/07/2017 16:19

So a woman who doesn't want to partially undress and use the toilet with a man in close proximity is now automatically unreasonable? Just unreasonable, no other affecting factors at all?

I swear some people are just plain thick and will argue black is white as long as they don't have to challenge or disagree with the entitled behavior of men.

VestalVirgin · 27/07/2017 16:22

Define "good reason".

That can be defined on an individual basis by the women currently occupying the space, I'd say. If they all without exception consider the reason good, then it is good, if not, then not.

I agree, "good reason" is nonsense if the person who gets to decide what constitutes a good reason is the one whose actions are excused by the "good reason".

The only way a "good reason" should ever show up is if it is stated clearly that the goodness of any given reason is decided on those whose comfort and safety are compromised by the exception.

And really, one doesn't have to talk about it.

If a fireman enters the women's toilets in a burning building to rescue the women trapped there, then zero people will complain.

Good reasons that really are good tend to be self-evident.

User843022 · 27/07/2017 16:27

'I swear some people are just plain thick'
You have such a lovely way of talking to people AReal. Are you as unpleasant irl or just anonymous internet forums?

Arealhumanbeing · 27/07/2017 16:38

MyrtleMaracas

In real life I don't tend to converse with such a range of individuals and I'm not friends with anyone who doesn't understand the problem with men being in the women's toilets.

My real life group of friends don't always agree but to answer your question, no. I'm not as unpleasant in real life.

I would be interested to know if I have said anything else you found unpleasant because I enjoy posting and unpleasantness isn't something I want to be known for.

PollyPerky · 27/07/2017 17:11

Another one late to the party but my opinion is:

As they were grandparents or similar, THEY ought to have decided pre-shopping how nappy changes were going to be managed. THis could have meant choosing another store with a separate room for baby changing.

It was THEIR responsibility to sort this without bending any rules.

If they cannot physically manage to change a nappy by themselves (ie takes 2 of them) they ought to choose a cafe or shop with different facilities.

It's not just about overhearing someone weeing or pooing- women change pads and tampons . I would not be chuffed if I knew a bloke was listening because most cubicles don't have floor to ceiling doors or side walls- there is a big gap.

As a woman I expect privacy and women-only in the women's loos.

Cubtrouble · 27/07/2017 21:51

People are going to be really disappointed when gender neutral toilet facilities are the norm here.

In France we saw lots of places (McDonald's being one) they had one room for men and woman.

Mumof56 · 27/07/2017 21:55

My tampon never makes noise when I change it? Confused

busyboysmum · 27/07/2017 22:38

My mooncup does. It makes a slurping noise as the seal pops. Then I emerge with blood all over my hands unless there is a little sink next to my toilet. I look like Carrie sometimes....

hazeyjane · 27/07/2017 22:46

My tampon plays 'Ode To Joy' when I take it out. It's magnificent.

Rufustherenegadereindeer1 · 27/07/2017 22:51

busy

Thats what i was saying to my dad about this thread the other day

If i come out with blood on my hand (and no I wouldn't be flashing it and i would wipe it on tissue first) i would be more comfortable washing in front of a woman

And with blood on trousers etc

Mumof56 · 27/07/2017 22:58

hazyjane are you sure you haven't mistaken it for usb key? Grin

blood on your hands? Any you expect other people to touch the door handles and taps after you?Angry Come on, get some wet wipes and sort your self out.

As for blood on your trousers, sure everyone in the cafe/ shopping centre etc can see that..Unless you're wipping your trousers off and washing them in the sink?

I use the ladies regularly and have never seen anyone emerge from a stall dripping with blood like you too ladies seem to be

Rufustherenegadereindeer1 · 27/07/2017 23:04

mum

Why are you making stuff up

No one said covered

I have two hands...so bit of blood on one hand and open door with the other

How to you think people manage with shit...literal shit

busyboysmum · 27/07/2017 23:05

😆😅 sometimes if I'm bored I play noughts and crosses on the cubicle door in my menstrual blood....

Of course I wipe my hands. Blimey.