To give up on 8yo DD?

[ByeByeTether]

I have 3dc, a DS17 who despite being born to a teenage mum and having a useless father who has barely bothered with him, has turned out really well, is sensible, kind and funny. A dd6 who is lovely but clingy and accident prone (suspect dyspraxia). And dd8 who this thread is about.

During my pregnancy, abusive XH was having an affair with a 16yo girl and then had many affairs since, so things have never been easy. She was a fractious child and then went on to have some behavioural problems as a toddler - would hit other children. Despite the difficulties, I threw myself into motherhood, putting my career on hold and completely living for the children.

At around the time I left XH, dd1's behaviour deteriorated. She has no self esteem and will not accept compliments. She is violent and destructive and has 'meltdowns' every day. She's obese and very tall so I cannot physically control her.

After 3 years of begging for help but being turned away by all the professionals, the school stepped in and we now have a social worker, she's seeing CAMHS, has been accepted on to some other schemes but it feels like too little too late. The professionals are basically blaming me saying that I behave as an abuse victim and she has become the abuser. I have raised the possibility of an underlying condition such as ASD. They don't seem interested in exploring this avenue.

My problem is, I have nothing left emotionally or physically, to try and sort this out. I am quite ill with a chronic condition so I have barely any energy. I do not enjoy my DD's company and our bond is severely fractured. I don't know if I can get that back. I hate my situation and motherhood, it's now affecting my relationship with dd(6) and I am withdrawing further and further.

Their relationship with their dad (XH) is complicated. He's controlling and abusive to me still. He's seeing them EOW at the moment but has gone through phases of not seeing them at all and doesn't take proper care of them all the time. He would never have them full time as his girlfriends and his social life come first.

I have a week off work this week to spend with them. Usually I would be planning our time to pack in as many activities as possible but this time I don't want to do anything or go anywhere. I've spent the last week being battered by DD and I am dreading a week of the same. She's already kicked off this morning over her hair.

I have begun an online parenting course and signed up to emails from a parenting site but I feel like I'm past the point of being able to turn it around. I feel totally and utterly trapped with just one way out but I don't want to leave my DC without a parent and I could never do that to my family. Does anyone have any advice about where I go from here or has experienced similar? What do you do when you are at the end?

And I agree with whoever said don't focus on getting asd diagnosis. The diagnosis won't change DD or in most cases the support. It's helpful to know and has future protection as is a disability. But you need to focus on strategies that help DD and you can try asd ones without a diagnosis.

Also good advice from Maryz!

It sound like attachment disorder- regardless of what it is, you are still responsible for dealing with her behaviour so what difference would s diagnosis make anyway?

Part of the problem is knowing where to start when everything is so bad. My health is terrible but my GPs are crap - I haven't seen a doctor in two years despite having a chronic condition and everything is dealt with on the phone. My sleep needs are around 12/13 hours which I obviously can't get so I'm chronically exhausted. I've no idea how to improve my health. I have anxiety and depression but the various meds I've tried have given me terrible side effects as well as make me even more tired.

I am on s low income in a job I hate but it's close enough that I don't have to rely on more childcare and I don't have the energy to resolve this.

My XH is controlling in that he will not communicate by text or email despite me saying I don't want to talk to him. He withholds financial help although is now paying via cms attachment of earnings. He's about to love his girlfriend in so he can pay less (according to dd).

Whole life is a big steaming pile of shit and I've no idea where start. I've detached just to survive. It wasn't always like this as my DC were my entire life at one time.

Can you change DRs? You should be able to get an appt to see a dr. If you can't I'd consider that a very good reason to change surgeries.

My daughter has ASD she likes her hair perfect. I was told by an ex CAHMs worker with a PHD definitely not ASD. She was diagnosed immediately when she saw an ASD specialist.

Camhs will say it is all your fault. That is what Cahms are there for. I wouldn't go through them if you want support. Go through NHS diagnosis

OP there are some tips on here you might find useful.
www.supernanny.co.uk/Advice/-/Parenting-Skills/-/Discipline-and-Reward/Dealing-with-a-very-angry-child.aspx

The cygnet course is what helps for autism. As soon as we got a diagnosis all difficulties stopped within 3 months as now the school meet her needs.

Afternoon, folks, so sorry to barge in. We can see that the OP is getting a lot of advice and support on the thread, but we always urge MNers in cases like this to seek professional advice in real life too.

Waybalooo in some areas, camhs carry out the assessment. I don't work for camhs now but it's still the case in lots of areas where I do work.

Some CAMHS services are good. It's about who you see - it's about seeing an experienced diagnostician (apologies if that's a suspect term🙄) who knows how to tease out subtleties. Also having a DISCO instead of relying just on ADOS is very helpful. DISCO has an algorithm for PDA, too - the problem is that it takes longer to administer and fewer clinicians are trained in its use.

I would just warn you dont trust cahms op they are there to save money and not to help. Go through the NHS and rule it out first, otherwise you will just cause problems and upset for your family that could be avoided

My cahms worker believes all asd is the parents fault anyway. It is all caused by poor parenting. I wish I had never laid eyes on him. I am so glad there are people like meesh out there. I can't fault the NHS team.

Sorry x post. Maybe I shouldnt extrapolate to all areas. Sorry I am very bitter about my experience!

Whatever is going in with her health, she sounds highly anxious. She would probably still be quirky if you removed the source of her anxities but she would be manageable.

You sound very resigned to uour fate but you have more control than you think. Remove the ex if he's an abuser (seek legal advice). Find alternative, cheap childcare, seek which benefits you may be entitled to. Deal with each problem 1 at a time

It sounds like she's just reacting to you and the abusive environment she has been brought up around. She must be able to sense your lack of bond with her etc. She must be feeling like shit and so confused.

I think you'd all benefit from family therapy and the children probably need individual therapy to help them work through the abuse they've witnessed.

Have you thought about therapy for yourself? It soundly,e you have a lot of serious issues yourself, these are reflected in your daughter, and you are hoping for an unassoiated medical diagnosis to explain how your problems are affecting her, rather than admitting that she is a product of her environment and that you have made a series of bad decisions. If the experts are saying you are behaving like a victim and that is co tribute get to her problems they are probably right.

Youve obviously been through a lot and getting some coaching on how to cope, deal with your ex without staying under his thumb, and how to parent robustly and lovingly is what I think you need.

It is not acceptable to write off a child at 8. Don't give yourself a free pass on that.

To clarify - there's some confusion over terminology fur services here. People are advising the OP not to use camhs but to go through the NHS.

Camhs IS the NHS. It's the child mental Heath arm of the NHS. In some areas, diagnosis of autism in children is tasked to camhs.

Also - it's not necessary to see a psychiatrist, though a psych may be part of the team. NICE guidance says it should be a team rather than one person. In my experience, it's more often a psychologist or paediatrician than a psychiatrist, but there are local variations.

I get a break if they go their dad's but I don't trust him to care for them adequately

No break is worth letting your children spend time with a parent who is abusive, controlling but also highly inconsistent. Do you think being exposed to that environment could be contributing in any way to your dd's problems? It sounds as if you need to stop unsupervised visits.

You sound completely overwhelmed, OP and I feel for you, but you've got to start prioritising and taking steps urgently, starting with not sending your children to your abusive ex.

I wouldn't necessarily accept what the 'experts' are saying kimmy. You'll be surprised how many misinformed people you have to get through before you get help. Not to mention the areas of the uk currently being discouraged from giving asd diagnoses. It is a minefield and parents have to constantly push for help.
Yes the abuse will have been horrific but if the op is to properly help her daughter she needs to ensure that there isn't something else at play

The OP has two other children who do not have serious behavioural issues, so while her 8 year old's behaviour probably has been affected by the environment in which she's been raised, there is probably something else going on that makes her more vulnerable than her siblings to stress and to the chaotic/ abusive relationship with her father.

A lot of learning and behavioural disabilities are inherited. It is of course possible that her father has some sort of behavioural disorder (an adult with kids who has affairs with 16 year olds definitely has some serious impulse control issues or has difficulty understanding social norms ...).

Nice bit of mum-blaming going on in this thread, half of the UK seems to have had an empathy amputation in the last few years.

OP, can't give you any sensible advice but having had one incredibly difficult child (who is now an amazing teenager) you have my total sympathy. But don't give up on your little girl.

I agree with jelly and seal

I also think you need to be more receptive to professionals suggesting it is partly your parenting. I don't mean that's my opinion, other than perhaps learning methods to deal with a very disturbed child with possible asd on top, which I can't imagine comes naturally to any parent. However as it stands, they appear to believe it is you and as a result aren't taking your pleas for help seriously. So rightly or wrongly I think you'll have to go along with their reasoning first in order to get the help. Because at the moment the stand off between 'help me what is wrong with her' and 'it must be bad parenting' isn't getting your dd or you anywhere.

To someone without expert knowledge, some abused dc and some dc with autism can share some similar surface behaviours. And to play devils advocate if you are shifting the blame for her obesity on to others, when that is partially your responsibility, it's possible they are adding 2+2 to make 5 where her behaviour is concerned and blaming that on you too. Obviously a professional who isn't an expert in autism or abuse shouldn't be taking it upon themselves to diagnose which it is, they should be referring to the experts, and fucking off to boil their heads if they think they personally are the experts. But my point is that it isn't personal to you op and you don't have any other practical choice but to cooperate.

On a practical note, if she doesn't already have them can you give her a safe place to escape to and a better outlet for the anger asap? I'm not a professional and don't have asd but personally bolt holes and a safe way to deal with rage and frustration were really important to me as a child.

There have been comments about 'mother blame' and 'cahms will tell you it's your fault'

Where has the mother been blamed/told it's their fault?

has I can only speak for myself but when I refer to blame it's because I get the impression from op that services in general see it as purely a parenting issue, rather than the cumulative effect of a lot of complex issues.