To be so so sick of financially controlling DH

[raininginjuly]

I know I'm not being unreasonable but it does get me down.

I was in a part of town today and I said it was near a large supermarket and I could nip in and get some bits we needed. Cue moaning from him about it being a waste of money and can't I go to Aldi (which isn't that much cheaper.)

It's SO annoying. He's always been a penny pincher but has got so much worse over the years. I really worry about the kids being bullied because of him refusing to buy them decent stuff (luckily I do stand up to him on this.)

It sometimes feels as if we can have no fun as even if we do manage to do something nice it's like you can constantly feel him breathing down your neck.

I just don't know how to handle it or him. My own parents were the same! We have no money issues by the way - he's just stingy.

OP, there is no need to say sorry.
I agree with you when you say that you need to step away and maybe re-post in a few days.

Can I make a few suggestions?

Post in Relationships where you will meet a plethora of folk who have walked in your shoes. You posted on AIBU and then became exhausted replying to posters who leapt on you regarding working.

It was very telling reading your replies tbh - all justifications about why you're not working, childcare costs, tax stuff etc. I'm betting you're in the habit of having to justify your costs a lot at home? It must be exhausting for you.

Also, because you became so defensive (and I understand why), you missed the more reasonable posters who tried to gain more relevant information from you. It's these posters who will help you see whether your DH is or is becoming financially abusive - and will support and advise you OR on the other hand, whether your DH had his own unhappy little issues and can suggest ways that your sanity (and relationship) can be saved.

You came here for a rant and a hand-hold and you were over-whelmed with perhaps more of the same that you get at home.

You don't need to justify your decisions to anyone on this board.

Maybe come back in a few days and repost. If not, sift through this thread for the posters asking reasonable questions about other parts of your home life/other aspects of finance.

If you just wanted to rant about your stingy, whinging old man who you love to bits, well that's fine too

Hope you're ok

My husband and I both own our own buisness. I run & own a salon, he's a builder/jack of all trades.

Yes we have a joint account and yes we consult each other about spendings.

But the people on here saying they discus everything with their other half? I find it hard to believe you call to ask if it's okay to pop to the shops for bread & milk.

OP I have no useful advice because I'm crap at it. But I'm sorry people have been unreasonable towards you.

OP, I understand about the job thing. There's no point getting a job to cover the cost of putting children in nursery, and possibly paying more on top, so that you can work - I find that totally pointless too.

Your husband sounds like a twat.

OP ignore all the work militants on here who think people not working are getting off scot free and yet most of them do not want to stay home and full time parent.
It makes no sense to work to spend all that extra income on child care.
You are in a tricky situation but if you intend to stay in the marriage you need to understand each other's money spending viewpoints better. Your partner may be a saver who just does not want to spend on anything he deems unnecessary. He may well put you both in a position where you can retire at 50 on that kind of income. Talk to him and try and draw up a list of things he can compromise on and things that you can.
Enjoy the fact that you can choose to stay home with your little ones due to your partner's high income. I returned to work after a long spell at home and if I had not had to do it financially I do not think I would. This is not because I do not enjoy my work but because of the stress it puts on the family- calling in last minute as one of you has to stay off with a sick kid. My dd is tired every night I collect her and cries when I leave on a morning. Me working full time is not best for her- I do not pretend that to delude myself. You see a lot of that on here.

Find a way to be with the compromise, if your dh is a good person with this undesirable flaw- we all have them. My husband is generous and also a big shopper and that irks me-I don't want to work till I am 67 thanks. If you save it is possible to get out of the rat race sooner- maybe your husband is aiming for that?
anbu though- it is irksome to say the least to be questioned- could he be a little ocd?

Actually OP, I posted before getting to the end of the thread (or maybe they posted whilst I was typing so slowly ).

You've had some excellent posters since midnight and clearly the others are sleeping or hounding someone else. Particularly pleased to see mathanxiety and a few others posting. Have a think about her questions - this is the support you need.

Again, I hope you're ok.

OP if you really feel your husband is financially abusive as opposed to just penny pinching, please contact Women's Aid to discuss it.

www.womensaid.org.uk/

In my earlier post I mentioned counselling but If he is abusive I would not recommend counselling with him. Plus if your situation is abusive then it doesn't matter that you will have less money when/if you move to two homes.

It's quite hard to judge these things as a reader, I know my own dh is penny pinching but I know he is not abusive. Luckily, because I have not been subject to abuse in the past I am hopefully quick to spot it.

But some people who have had abuse from parents/friends/bullies/former boyfriends etc can normalize difficult and abusive behavior and accept it.

Only you know exactly what is going on but Women's Aid can help you interpret this all.

Good luck, and agree about re-posting in relationships. You will get less traffic but you will get more targeted answers.

I also find AIBU quite brutal and frustrating as an original poster, and when I have posted there as the OP have sometimes felt that people have misinterpreted what I said, which can be exhausting.

Good luck.

Op sorry about some of the horrible posts from people with their own agendas who clearly have no interest in exploring how to support you, and don't bother to come back at me cos I couldn't give a flying fuck.

There are many people that try to use guilt, fear or obligation to control others. Financial control is an easy one to use. By also undermining your confidence, it makes it difficult to see a way out of it. However, if you really think about it, there is nothing he can do if you shop at Morrisons (God, what would he say if you ventured into Waitrose!). He moans, but you need to come back at him calmly. I am an adult and I choose where I shop within a reasonable family budget. I will not justify every item of expenditure. We have agreed I will be a SAHP for the foreseeable future, I don't tell you how to organise your work, please don't tell me how to organise the household arrangements. And repeat, EVERY SINGLE TIME, until he gets the message. If he threatens to take you off the joint account, or have his pay put into a personal account, then you will be sure it is financial control and you may want to consider your future away from him, But really the only way to address it, is to refuse to let him control you like this. You can see how it has already eaten away at your self esteem. By the way, you're doing really well to have your own business while doing absolutely everything in the home and having small ones.

Yes of course lone parents have to do it all, but then they don't have an undermining bastard to have to deal with while they do it all, and they don't have anyone to justify their decisions to, either, which can be really energy-sapping. Plus I admire them for what they do, but it doesn't give them licence to slag others who are looking for support.

If yin can't access fam

If you can't access joint money and have to ask for it then that is my definition of financial abuse. If you have to justify the smallest purchases because the partner is overbearing then I think that's financially abusive. If you earn money on top of being the full-time carer, and you're not allowed to manage that money, how are you being 'remunerated' for your work contribution(s) to the home?

Why if you had

*The aim of a man like this is to keep you constantly on the back foot, wondering if indeed you really are bad with money or stupid or immature or not as sensible as you should be - so you spend a lot of time second guessing yourself, and your confidence in your ability to make a plan or a decision drains away, from the decision on what laundry detergent to buy, and where, to you turning to jelly when facing the decision to leave and fend for yourself.

It is soul destroying and it is intended to be.*

This.

I cannot believe that some posters cannot understand the difference between a couple who are on a tight budget and where one is more aware of this and so makes sure their partner considers the family budget before spending and OP's scenario! You're either out for blood or your terrible at putting yourself into someone else's shoes and imagining how it feels to constantly be undermined financially for no real reason other than your partner feeling they have more of a right to decide how money is spent.

OP, please get this moved to the Relationships board so people can try and help you

It sounds awful op. I couldn't live like that in a marriage. Is he controlling in other ways too? In an ideal world you would have equal access to the money.

I'd sit him down and insist on going through the finances together and work out a reasonable budget for yourself, including a clothes allowances for you and the kids, present money for their parties and any other incidentals. Make sure that is paid into an account for you so that you have complete freedom to send that how you like. If he won't countenance that at all then I'd seriously be thinking of an exit strategy. The way you are living at the moment is no way to live.

OP, if you're still reading, can I suggest you have a look at a budget programme called YNAB? (You Need a Budget)

I have been in a very similar position to you, with high earning spouse/small children, no support. I even had my own little business, although it brought in a fraction of what yours does. My kids are at school now & I have a part time job that I love & who are v flexible. I can take kids into work/work from home. I started doing six hours a week 5 year ago when my youngest was at preschool, working up to 28hrs a week now.

For us, when we were living on one income, there was a definite feeling for both of us that the other was frittering money away. DH didn't really appreciate how much food cost, or how the cost of the kids. I tended to forget his huge commuting costs & the costs associated with the cars. Now, it's all right there in the budget. For example, we can see that Aldi would be a bit cheaper, but also that it needs me to actually go there, whereas a Tesco click and collect fits in better with our busy weekends. It has given us peace and put us on the same page financially. There's a free trial period. (I don't work for them!)

I think women are too hard on men.
IME most men don't want to be the sole provider. They don't like everyone having fun while they work FT and don't enjoy the stress and pressure of it.

Contribute and he can relax and your relationship will improve.

Childcare can be sorted just change your attitude.

I agree most men would like their partners to work too as it takes the pressure off them. However, there is a percentage of men who like the idea of the extra salary, but don't actually want to put any extra effort in to actually do anything else, eg help around the house or help with childcare. The OP has already said that her husband expected her to constantly sort out the children , take time off when they were sick to the point it was affecting her work. He wasn't sharing that responsibility with her at all.

I think both partners working can be done if both partners are reasonable about it, OP's husband clearly isn't. So if he is not going to take responsibility for helping the OP with equal childcare, then he needs to accept that they are living on one salary and that she is facilitating his ability to earn. In return she needs to be able to have fair access to the family money.

Also, all those people saying that she should have gone to Aldi as it is cheaper, she says she was close by to the other supermarket. Would you really not pop into the closest supermarket , but make an extra journey to a different one just because that one is a few pence cheaper? Surely the amount it costs in time needs to be taken into account. Spending a couple of extra pounds to make your life easier is not exactly a crime.

OP, being a SAHM is a totally valid choice and does NOT mean you have no say in the family finances. I was a SAHM when my DC were little and our money was completely shared.

Would it help to sit down with a third person (e.g. a counsellor) and discuss attitudes to money? Things can't continue as they are, it's not right.

Some good (recent) posts on here. You are not being unreasonable, op, to want to have some say in how family money is spent; if you can, sit down with him and discuss how his behaviour is making you feel.

Limon - you are either very lacking in empathy or deliberately being unpleasant.

This post really rang a bell for me, I'm a SAHM too and my husband is the sole provider financially. I dread coming back from the shops to the question 'How much?' and the inevitable shitty mood that follows.

There was a poster on MN many years ago they had a private helicopter - that level of wealth. He would buy NOTHING for the house and let his wife had a measly monthly budget. There is another poster her partner buying a flash sports car like £30k worth, going on holidays, eating out whilst she and the DC had the income support level to pay for food and activities being told how many items of uniform she was permitted to buy.

Financial abuse is degrading and well abuse.

OP I hope you have the courage to leave.

I'm not getting a feel from this thread as to whether the financial control is actually about control or whether he is a man who is anxious about money or just naturally careful with it.

DP is in the naturally tight category: he will not spend anything on himself, hunts around for the best price for things, loves a bargain but is generous when it comes to gifts etc. He does the shopping as often as I do, and knows what stuff costs, but never says anything about how much I spend. It's not a control thing, he just gets a kick out of getting something for as little as possible.

Do you actually know what money comes in and what it gets spent on? If there are savings, pensions, life insurance etc? How much the mortgage and other outgoings are? I knew someone who thought her DH was controlling and, when she challenged him on it, it turned out that running the home cost shedloads more than she realised and things were actually very tight.

OP, I think you need to sit down with him and explain how his frugality is making you feel undermined/stressed/undervalued etc. Get a feel for if he regards his salary as his or family money. Try and see if you can agree a budget for shopping, children's needs etc and that will give you more autonomy. And if it turns out that he's keeping you on a shoestring while buying Savile Row suits, running an expensive car and having fantastic lunches, then LTB!

@raininginjuly. Wow people are cruel on here. I've only joined mumsnet recently and did not realise there were so many judgemental fools on here. Clearly there's a bigger issue here for you and I believe you need to sit down with him to discuss this and if you really can't then maybe you have to decide if that's what you want for the rest of your life. It should be a partnership you're in not a controlled relationship. Whatever you decide to do I hope it works out for you and you get your confidence back.

I get what you're saying Lakielady. It just seems to me the difference between careful expenditure and controlling behaviour is how you appproach your partner. The OPs partner seems to just lay down the law, belittle and criticise rather than having an equal discussion as respectful adults. I'm sure the OP would be happy to sit down and have a discussion about the need for budgeting, if that was necessary. But it needs to be s proper discussion with compromises and respect.

Okay so I read some of the posts then decided I couldn't take anymore and wanted to throw my opinion in...

I have 4 children, the youngest is 14months and I am 5 months pregnant with no.5.

Guess what? I work and I don't pay childcare and the family do fuck all nothing to help.
Yeah working evenings isn't fun, isn't what everyone wants to be doing with their 'relax' time but I definitely couldn't not 'add to the pot' at all then complain my OH has an opinion on how to spend the money.

You can't moan that your OH is financially controlling and you have to watch what you spend when you're not doing anything about it either.

If you don't like it you have many options-

-speak to him and tell him you want things to change,
-suck it up and live with it
-leave him
-earn your own pocket money to do as you please

You say your household income is 80k... you must have life pretty cushty. I'm moaning that I don't have money to spend, your moaning about how you spend it. Sometimes I think people should count their blessings.

Yeah working evenings isn't fun, isn't what everyone wants to be doing with their 'relax' time but I definitely couldn't not 'add to the pot' at all then complain my OH has an opinion on how to spend the money.

But that is you. The OP has said that it won't work for her for whatever reason. Her DH is happy to have her at home doing all the domestic stuff, but wants to control how she spends the family money. This makes the OP feel belittled. That is a valid feeling and she is not wrong to complain about it.

Can I ask- if you are working evenings, and presumably looking after DC during the day, when do you have time off to relax?

What MrMessy said.

We don't need to know exactly how many hours everyone else works user...653 and how many children they have. The op is in an unhappy situation with a husband who criticises and undermines her - that is not the same as him "having an opinion" about money BTW - and is asking for help and support. If you really can't see past the end of your own nose, then maybe don't post.

I think a lot of people on here would benefit from reading the definitions of financial Abuse.

I'd never not work. I know too many people who have been divorced by their husbands in middle age and now have no pension of their own and are living in poverty.