Grenfell tower exposes stark inequalities in our society.

[thinkiamgoingcrazy]

In the new luxury block some of the Grenfell residents have been rehoused in, 3 flats put together are "worth" an eye watering 5 million pounds. The same amount of money as the government has pledged for the Grenfell victims.

What is the matter with our society that such vast inequalities are able to exist? When did London become an investment bank for the rich rather than somewhere for its citizens to live with dignity ?

[Why are there some "private" squares in London where the benches have plaques on them reading that they are only for the patrons of the nearby hotel ?]

Why are we such an unequal society in general with a massive gap in earnings, and a tiny precentage of our population owning such a huge amount of our wealth?

I don't think that this is a dignified or progressive way to live. Nothing against capitalism, but ffs it can't be allowed to do its rampant worst. IMO.

Reality is, rich people don't want to live next door to poor council tenants, ( or council tenants generally ) they just don't. Because 'social housing' has a stigma. It always has had but it's even worse now.
You can moan all you like about the inequalities of life, but that's the way it is.
Can you name me a single labour politician, lefty musician / comedian / poet / 'this is all so wrong' Bob Geldof types, who live in a council tower block?
There's probably a couple at most.

iPhone with a Starbucks

Well if people stop buying this stuff the economy takes a hit.

Which side of the fence are you on anyhow? Can't have it both ways.

There's to be an element of capitalism because there does need to be a competitive market to thrive.

What NEEDS to change though is the massive divide and the difficulties faced by those on low income which aren't caused for those earning a good wage or who are born with a silver spoon in their mouth.

An incentive to go out to work would be provided if we could find a way that people could work jobs that fit around education again, jobs with contracts that state hours and working 37 hours a week on NmW paid.
When working Ft in NmW jobs got you a decent dwelling, fed and clothed your family and provided decent leisure opportunities.
When you work FT, rely on tax credits and still have a poor quality of life that's when people lose the hope and passion for life.

We have to work harder to remove the barriers to those poorer in society.

So what would you rather?

Currently, a minority of the population work and pay tax. Should they have even more money taken off them?

Why is that fair?

There's probably a couple at most

There are many, many poets, musicians and artists in social housing. The pay is shitty.

Hypothetical - You could take 10 people, give each of them £100 and tell them it's theirs to spend, freely.

One will go get her hair and nails done, one will treat her friends on a night out, one will go to bingo and lose the lot, one will pay off outstanding debts, one will take the kids on a day trip to the seaside - and so forth people prioritise according to need - but one of those 10 will see a market opportunity, eg buy a load of bankrupt stock and triple her money on ebay - that's the difference between people and why some people are wealthy. Simply because Mary prioritises getting her nails done over Jane who pays off her mortgage early or Sue who speculates to accumulate.

Hmm, I bet they don't stay there once they get rich.

People are already talking about this incident in the past tense, like as if victims family members are still not missing and bodies are still not being recovered. On over 60 people have been rehoused in those luxury flats where are all the other victims. That block is reported to have housed at least 600 residents. Over 70 have been confirmed dead and then over 60 rehoused in these flats. Where is everyone else being sent or are they all gone? A survivor of the fire was saying people are being rehoused in other cities. There was some poor guy dumped in an old people's home when he wasn't even old enough to be there. I'm just cynical regarding where the rest of these people will be rehoused and where. Also those luxury flats are likely to cost a bomb in upkeep is the government going to help those victims with that!

The wealth inequalities in the UK are increasing at an obscene rate yearly.

This is because government policy since 1979 has been to direct money towards the already wealthy and reduce opportunity, well-being and dignity for those who are poor.

Arguing that one individual is rich because they 'worked hard' and that another is poor because they didn't is very inaccurate, but exactly what a capitalist economy relies on people believing.

There are plenty of people who work the clock round in three jobs, live in housing which is unfit for purpose and still need to use food banks to feed their families.

optimisticollie, there is a lot of tax coming in; there are choices to be made about how we spend it. Furthermore, corporations like Starbucks , amazin etc should be the ones who start paying a bit more, don't you think- rather than effectively taking our money and sending all the profits back to the US and not making the appropriate contributions .

Not all of the flats in Grenfell Tower were council tenants, many were privately let, at over 2K a month.
I guess we need the successful people in society to be able to afford to put up people in accommodation of such value.
I doubt many of the excellent firefighters (again provided by the state) would have been able to afford to live there.

Can you name me one country on Earth where every single person is equal in terms of their wealth / housing / access to free medical care?

Have you been to Rusia? I have, and talked to a lotnof people there. One lady showed menher flat, and explained it used to be hers but now there are 3 families living there together, sharing all communal spaces and one room each (each family not each person) to sleep.
Would anyone be happy for this to happen??
And stop with property, let's just ask the state to tell us what our job is going to be from now on, with no right to create our own business of course, so we know everybody earns the same.

Sorry, but you either accept capitalism or you don't. I personnally believe the majority of people in the UK are happy with it, including a deregulated property market.

There will always be inequality, it's just part of life.

If everyone had the same, there would be no effort and we would all suffer as why work so hard to become a doctor, surgeon, solicitor etc if you could do nothing and still have the same.

Tax credits didn't make people work harder, they just worked less and made lifestyle choices they couldn't afford so obviously throwing money at people doesn't work. It doesn't change the persons views, work ethic or morals.

The term " the deserving and undeserving poor" comes to mind with this thread due to some of the comments. There is an acceptable type of poor people that richer people are willing to accept. However the beer swilling, fag smoking, anti social poor are unacceptable. Although this is not pleasant we have to consider how these people became this way in the first place, place in support, rather than labelling them and throwing them on the dung heap.

There will always be inequality, it's just part of life.

If everyone had the same, there would be no effort and we would all suffer as why work so hard to become a doctor, surgeon, solicitor etc if you could do nothing and still have the same. WTF

There is a big difference breeen reducing inequality and us all being the same which people don't seem to grasp. No one is talking about communism

The flats that were privately let in Grenfell had been bought, usually by buy to let landlords. One of the reasons that they were so expensive is that social housing has been systematically sold off, increasing market rents and house prices.

The main thing buy to let landlords are successful at is exploiting other peoples' need for housing.

I knew about such inequality before. The worth of some places to rich overseas investors. Benches that can only be used by certain.

I know not what to do. But the recent tragic tower fire doesn't change this.

Exactly christinarossetti and youarenotkiddingme

It's not about begrudging people their success - I am not sure why some people are taking it this way?

No one can say that the nurse on a 1% pay rise doesn't work hard or isn't a necessary part of society?

I also think that there is a culture of excess at that very top - why do some CEOs actually need salaries that run into the several hundreds of thousands?

Why are some people seen as so unnecessary in terms of wages and "market forces" and yet we really need them? The key workers etc....

Why do so many people who are in work not have enough money to live?

Sweden is a great example of a place where there is reduced inequality, a strong economy and a great welfare state which looks after all citizens. I have no idea why we don't not strive a bit in that direction.

Yes! Advocating that everyone should have access to housing which is fit for human habitation is hardly flying the red flag.

This is a good abstract regarding in income inequality aspect:

www.res.org.uk/details/mediabrief/4417531/Greater-Income-Inequality-Demands-A-New-View-Of-Recent-UK-Economic-Performance.html

Of course that's just one part of the puzzle;.comparing with other countries I'd expect Tory taxation policies and Cross-party housing (and associated taxation) policies to be driving factors.

Also....I have absolutely no problem whatsoever with very rich people.

My problem is with the fact we neglect our genuinely poor, disadvantaged and vulnerable. When as a nation we are more than capable of taking care of them as well as ourselves.

*don't strive to go in that direction

No one is talking about everyone having the same amount, or people not being allowed to strive and make money. Or about communism.

It's about a society where there is more middle ground. Where everyone can live with dignity. Working in the jobs they choose. So if you are a nurse you won't make as much as someone else in a different job perhaps, but you will make enough not to worry all the time.