Can any Tory voters justify cuts to disability benefits?

[malificent7]

Or are any Tory voters actually disabled and in receipt of pip?
Just interested to find out.

I know people who've had two heart attacks and can work and do work. The system isn't saying people have not had the heart attack; it is advising that people are well enough to go to work

Wow. You're an amazing doctor. You're able to say that every person who has ever had 2 heart attacks or who may have two heart attacks in the future will categorically be able to work because someone with a similar issue managed it.

We are not all the same, are we? These assessments are not necessarily completed by doctors,or people who may be qualified to make a decision. Moreover, these people work for companies where contracts depend on results. It's like saying you're not deaf/blind/autistic/dyslexic/suffering with cancer 'cos we've already had our quota for this year when you quite clearly can't hear/can't see etc. It's insulting at best and at worst, we are killing people. Many of these people are of working age, with children, and who with support, could lead fulfilling and happy lives.

But hey ho, someone's brother's sistes's hald sister's brother in law went back to work 30 minutes after being declared dead so why can't everyone manage it?

mumtotwoplustwo
if you live in a care home you keep the mobility part of DLA not the care part and all but 24.50 a week is taken from your ESA. so please check your facts.
its bollocks like this that add to the hate.

mumto2 ESA is means tested (you can get 12 months non means tested if you've worked enough) so having ££££'s in the bank and getting it doesn't happen.

If they don't have loads of savings and are in a care home the care home will be paid most of their benefits in fees, leaving them with a small amount for haircuts etc- £20 or something. DLA isn't means tested but still, the home/NHS would take it.

If they had hundreds of thousands they'd be paying their own fees in full til they got to £23,250. Unless the NHS was paying their fees and there are very few people that qualify for that.

As I said, Play, appeals weren't running at 85% under Labour.
Mother, unfortunately, there are facts and figures to back up my assertion.

@needsahalo What I am saying is that having two heart attacks does not automatically exclude someone from working. The two heart attack example was mentioned as if it should be an automatic reason to be signed off work for the rest of their working lives - this isn't the case.

Plain and simple. Having two heart attacks does not (and never will) automatically mean you are unable to work again - I think there are a lot of people who would be very upset you would automatically use a medical condition against them in such a way.

ESA is means tested (you can get 12 months non means tested if you've worked enough) so having ££££'s in the bank and getting it doesn't happen.

Very much depends which group you are in.

In the Support group you are kept on contribution based for the length on time you are in the group.

Astickintime I think that all contractors should be prosecuted every time a decision is overturned at tribunal.

After all, if they're as integral and truthful as they make out, they'll have no problem with it will they? Like the time they scored that poor sod who was a double amputee with zero points for mobility.

If a claimant lied as blatantly they'd be consequences, same should apply to them.

Yes I agree this wasn't the thread for arguing on other issues - whoever wins, we'll all have the chance to vote again and we can also protest any further cuts if they appear.

I think there should be consequences if decisions are overturned too - in fact I'm not sure assessments should be being done by private companies at all.

I'm on cont based ESA and PIP and neither are means tested. in fact the first thing the assessor mentioned was it wasn't related to any assets and savings we might have.

Are you in a care home?

I've had to figure out what I'm most afraid of and vote from that standpoint unfortunately.
My step father is jumping through PIP hoops as I type and it's horrid.
However, more horrid to me would be living in a jihadi nation where women's rights do not exist - let alone indigenous human rights. Could happen within 10 years if certain people get in. Slam me all you like. That is the least of my concerns.

LovelyBath77 yes contribution esa isn't but income related esa is.

Phoenix there are approximately 4 million muslims in the UK which has a population of 65 million. Your assertion is ridiculous.

Tiger when i said my friend doesnt drive i meant she never learnt to start with.

She had epilepsy from birth. She didnt develop it on purpose to inconvenience higher earners.

31st March 2006 DH had trouble breathing and was coughing up phlegm while driving We made it home , he parked the car (in a straight line i might add) we got up to the flat and i started to pack the shopping away. I came back into the living room where he was sitting to see he was sweating and very pale so i called our surgery. It was 6.30pm and they answered. (pre Virgin Care days) but i could see it was much more serious so i called an ambulance. It didnt take too long to get here but i knew they would have trouble finding the place due to crap signposting so i had to go outside and flag them down leaving DH on his own (i was right, they had already driven past our road twice) Coming back to the flat and we saw that DH had crawled out of the door and was lying in the communal hallway delirious. Then he lost conciousness and his heart stopped. The paramedics had to use a defibrilator. DH has no memory of this part nor of the week and a half he had to spend in hospital.

I suspect the way heart attacks are portrayed on television has a lot to do with the attitudes on here.
e.g. I dont watch the soaps anymore but when i did there was a storyline where Phil Mitchell had a heart attack in Eastenders. It was the classic clutching of chest and he only spent 24 hours in hospital. He was out by the end of the next episode. I was fuming because it doesnt happen like that and because i also knew it would feed the narrative of the anti disability benefits brigade. DH has ischemic heart disease now and permanent breathing problems. Hes 67 and our new battle is the DLA/PIP transfer.
I think there has to be a proper TV and internet/magazines/papers campaign on the symptoms of a heart attack because too many people are taking what they see in TV/soaps/dramas at face value.
The writers/producers need to start doing their research properly. DH never once clutched his chest He brought up phlegm and had trouble breathing and has been left with lifelong problems as a result.
There needs to be more awareness raised of the actual range of symptoms involved in a heart attack because the level of ignorance is absolutely astounding.

Some people have been watching too many soaps as well as reading too many right wing rags.

Dangermouse - You are wrong. If you get Contributions based ESA and get put in the support group it does not stop after 12 months it can continue indefinitely. Therefore yes there are some people who can still get it indefinitely despite having large amounts of savings or capital.

I think there has to be a proper TV and internet/magazines/papers campaign on the symptoms of a heart attack because too many people are taking what they see in TV/soaps/dramas at face value.

*HelenaDove^ I agree. In fact my Dad was convinced ut was his asthma when he was having a heart attack. Only things he had was shortness of breath and palpitations. He'd rang 999 when he'd took his reliever inhaler and it hadn't worked. He actually said to the paramedics on the phone in-between gasps "Asthma attack". When they got there, they quickly bluelighted on and blue lighted him to hospital.

He still works too. He has no choice. Just because one person can and still doesn't not work doesn't mean everyone else suffering from a range of illnesses can do the same.

Agree my dad's main symptom of the 2 blood clots that caused his attack was back pain and as he has a bad back anyway he took painkillers and went to bed, he's very lucky to still be here.

It seems the main cuts that might happen may be moving to universal credit for those who work and are disabled (working disability element on tax credits will go) and those on enhanced disability premium for tax credits (enhanced care PIP) I believe those things are not going to be there on UC? In fact the changes on UC seem to be not mentioned as much in comparison to PIP / ESA itself. But then, I don;t think anyone has been changed over from tax credits to UC yet, it's new claims at the moment.

Well Lovely Bath Going by the sharing of right wing articles and commenting about ppl on benefits showing up on my fb the justification seems to be alive and well. Some of them will be cheering UC on.

I hope that the changes to UC will possibly mean the disability elements are transferred across. it is a worry.

The cuts are severely affecting genuine disabled people. Fraud is only 1% according to the DWP. I've lost my PIP 3 times now and had to wait 6 months, 9.5 months and14 months to get it back at tribunal. The effects of living without enough money were dire, both physically and mentally (luckily I have friends who could lend me thousands, so I didn't end up homeless). I doubt I'll make it through the next round - I was suicidal for weeks at a time last time. I'm far from alone.

This thread is two years old @Waylay44

@lovelybath Disabled tax credits go away when you switch to UC. They're different to SDP (Severe Disability Premium ~65.85/week) and EDP (Enhanced Disability Premium ~16.80/week), both of which go away when you switch to UC.

You get SDP if you're receiving Income-Related ESA/JSA and PIP Daily Care, live alone (with some exceptions) and nobody gets Carer's allowance / UC Carer's component for you. EDP is given to people in the Support Group of ESA (i.e. not going to be able to work or prepare for work anytime soon) or Income-Related ESA/JSA, and/or who receive Enhanced Daily Care PIP. (There are some other eligibility rules.)

However, it has become incredibly difficult and stressful to get ESA and PIP. The assessments are often unfair, assessors sometimes lie on reports, assessors and Decision-Makers don't bother to look at your forms/evidence, and stupid observations like, "Neatly dressed, hair combed, no body odour" are used to deny that you have mental health problems (as an example). They don't consider that you might have had help with bathing and dressing on the day of the assessment, or that you were so anxious that you forced yourself to bathe because you couldn't bear to see an official when you hadn't bathed for 3 weeks.

People

Ty @Boneshere