To not understand how any parent could not vote for Labour, our kids need the NHS don't they?

[April2013]

I just don't get it, our children need the NHS, me and my children would probably all not be alive if it wasn't for the NHS, and if we had to pay for private I probably wouldn't even have children....and even if you have private healthcare we all need our police force. I just don't get it. How do people justify this to themselves?

Because when Labour nationalise all the industries they want too we'll go completely bust?

Oh, and labour started the privatisation.

I also want the NHS to thrive - one of the reasons why I am going to vote Conservative this time. The NHS must be seriously remodeled and I believe only the Conservatives will have the courage to tackle it.

On New Year's eve my youngest dd took 40 paracetamol. She topped it up with a handful of Night nurse capsules (also containing paracetamol). She washed them down with half a bottle of tequila.
Any nurse/doctor will tell you that 40 paracetamol is not a cry for attention.
Today, June 6th she saw a mental health worker. Said mental health worker might be able to provide some sort of funding via a small budget for her to access some private counselling. What sort of budgeting is that?

Six fucking months

There is no way I'm going to vote for a party that has cut services to such an extent that it takes six months for someone to access mental health services. Six months. It's so bad that our area was on Panorama for providing the worst services. I'm not voting for someone to who will privatise services leaving the most vulnerable to die on the streets. Yes, it needs a shake up, but not that sort of shake up.

What sort of shake up does it need then?

Oh, well let's start with providing CAMHS with some funds shall we.

Biker47 - look at the budget defecit through the labour years then look at it through Osborne's tenancy. The conservatives were brilliant at promoting labour as being the cause of the crash - and because labour went into analysis gazing for 6 months they got away with it.

The Conservative party has an ideology that thinks private sector is more efficient than state - because of that they will dismantle the NHS. Whether labour started the rot or not is irrelevant - they are not promoting it now.

If you look at how hospitals spread tentacles you'll understand that selling off land will destroy their flexibility and the cost of building updated/new facilities will spiral as they try to buy back the land that was sold.

Yes reorganisations are a massive problem - they are never funded so the costs come out of operational spend

Providing more funds is not a shake up, it's just throwing a plaster in the vague direction of a problem and hoping it sticks. It's keeping the status quo, it's not changing anything.

So, what shake up do you want to see?

Sorry about your daughter, Dawn, but I must say six months for six sessions has always been about average for counselling, regardless of who is in power.

Hope she's feeling brighter now Have you/she got Samaritans details?

Chardonnay, I'm not a politician, nor am I a manager. I want, like others, an NHS that is efficient, that works and that isn't privatised. At present we have none of those things. From the point of view of somebody who has worked within the system, there are currently too many managers, too many pointless targets and not enough funding. It's not efficient, but has been significantly less so since funding has been cut. Getting the Red Cross in to help, private ambulances, inefficient and expensive. Providing more funding isn't just about stopping something from haemorrhaging, it's about an holistic approach. That's one of the things the Labour party has been discussing, as have the Lib Dems.

Thank you Calyrical. I'm not sure if I made myself clear. Today was the first time she was seen by the mental health team other than her assessment in hospital. Even the Crisis team didn't turn out, they rang.
No, she's not better, she needs a lot of help. I do have the Samaritans details. I look after her at home, so if she's bad, like last night, hot chocolate and snuggling in my bed at three in the morning!

I don't believe labour will save the NHS. It needs complete reorganisation and I do think for starters GP appointments need a deposit system where you lose it if you don't attend. It is so so irritating that where I am it's impossible to get an emergency appointment and the earliest a routine one is a few weeks away, yet each month they publish hundreds of appointment no-show. Such a waste when so many people need appointments. Many others have expressed frustration with the same situation in other parts of the country. Yet people shirk away from any suggestion of people having to part with any sort of money.
There needs a complete restructuring yet labour have just published lots of promises, lots more spending in many areas, yet seem to think all the money is coming from the 'rich'.

No, I understand that but I have to say it was just as shambolic under Labour!

Mental health is famously under resourced, always has been.

Dawn i was a mental health nurse for 20= your right mental health services are dire at the moment everywhere but under labours cuts i was redeployed twice in 12 months my trust closed down the mental health rehab ward, day hospital both elderrly and acute between 2005/6 and i agree conservative have carried on ,but i also blame ineffcient managers who throw away the money they do have ,they will quibble over booking an extra person on duty to ensure the wards are fully staffed and safe but think nothing of throwing millions away on refurbishing wards to then close them down i dont know what the answer is tbh but something needs to change

Because labour can't afford everything they have promised but will drag the country into a massive deficit trying! The structure of the NHS is unsustainable imo. Trying to shoe horn a system developed for the mid 20th century into the very different demographic landscape of the 21st century is beyond naive. Just think of all the different treatments now available. It's completely irrational to think the extra money labour might find will make these perfectly available to all. Much of their additional funding will probably go on making up the increasedminimum wage of many health service workers. We need someone brave enough to say the NHS is no longer fit for purpose here is how things are going to work going forward. Then yes we can put in more money but at the moment it's a money pit. It angers me when people see the only 2alternatives as a US style system or a cradle to grave free NHS. Most countries operate great healthcare systems. We need to stop putting sticking plasters on the NHS and get to the route of the problem

I think one of the big problems with MH nursing and treatment is that it's so intense and exhausting for the staff. They end up getting signed off with stress but someone still has to do their job, so often double salaries are paid.

and yet, here, under Labour stbxh had weekly support, a monthly visit from a CPN, a six monthly psychiatric review and I could get him into a local hospital bed in a matter of hours if need be. All things that changed, noticeably so, once the coalition were in power.

How is providing more funding holistic? What do you mean? Holistic as in more money for everything across the bread, no questions asked?

It's just trowing good money after bad.

We have to ask the questions. Do you want the referral system changed? Do you think you need more therapists in house or in the community?
In the mental health hospitals or not? Do you want to be able to choose a specific counsellor? Do you think there ought to be different services dealing with different matters? how do you expect after care to work?

You are also telling me you want a shake up, and you are not happy with the one you think the Conservatives want to do, except you don't know what shake up you want yourself. So, why are you so convinced a privatised service will be worse, if it's still free at the point of delivery?

I will admit that I don't know whether a privatised or a partly privatised NHS will be better or worse. All I know is that I want to be able to make an appointment without waiting for weeks and I want good care.

Chardonnay. I was up until three this morning with dd. I have AS. Sometimes it takes me a while to process the answers somebody requires. Apart from which, I'm not in a classroom, and I may be reading wrongly, but it seems to me you are demanding immediate answers, as a teacher would a child.
At the moment, an holistic approach does not necessarily mean throwing more money at everything. I rather thought I'd made that clear.
I'm voting for the party I feel will be more inclined to do things the way I would want them done. I have a disability and I'm a carer. Dd has a disability, as does her twin. The tories aren't helping us.

mental health services have always been the cinderella service of the NHS but they were a damn sight better when i qualified in the mid 90,s they have been getting worse and worse since around the early 00,swe were able to offer service users so much more iused to love my job but the endless paperwork and more and more pressure on nurses made me ill i ended up hating it

I'm not demand anything. I'm a random poster asking questions. You are posting, I am posting. Lots pf other people are posting as well.

For me, a holistic approach , to use your expression, means to reassess everything, decide what's needed and reform the whole service accordingly. Not throw an unspecified amount of money at the whole thing, and then still have the same bloated dinosaur.

I vote conservative as an exNHS employee, it's not money it needs its reorganisation and taking it out of the political sphere so it's not kicked back and forth like a football, Oh and don't let medics run it, give it to private companies who will run it like a business and not spunk money up the wall doing dodgy deals for short term gain (because they are clueless) and paying over the odds for everything.

More propaganda...this place is depressingly predictable

totally agree Twinkie they need proper managers not some jumped up HCP who hasent a clue about managing or budgets

It is true that we spend much less on healthcare than other developed countries.