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AIBU?

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Original poster

To ask for a summary on the Tory v Labour stance on what to do about terrorism?

347 replies

Bearbehind · 04/06/2017 20:20

This is looking like being the most critical issue of our times at the moment despite my thoughts that Brexit was the crux of this election.

Can anyone cut through the waffle and tell us what the 2 main parties are offering to do about extremists and terrorism?

OP posts:
YouTheCat · 04/06/2017 20:23

May is all talk and no substance.

Corbyn will increase the police force and emergency services and also talk to the different communities where radicalisation is a problem.

Original poster
Bearbehind · 04/06/2017 20:25

That pretty much where I'd got to you.

May just seems to talk shite but Corbyn hasn't been tested on anything so it's difficult to decifer?

OP posts:
BertrandRussell · 04/06/2017 20:27

Corbyn is making a significant speech tonight.

Two4One2017 · 04/06/2017 20:32

In the past Corbyn has called for police not to be armed and McDonnell has called for M15 to be disbanded. I'm sure that won't be in his speech now as it won't win any votes....

And Diane Abbott will be in charge of our security.....😱

I think it's really important to tackle the internet companies and social media. I have done research in this area. The amount of propaganda and recruitment that goes on over the web is shocking. It is a worldwide issue. The government are spot on to focus on it.

acquiescence · 04/06/2017 20:34

May's stance on last nights atrocities was 'enough is enough'. Empty words. She appears to have forgotten that it is her government that has been in power for the last seven years during which time the people who committed the events in London and Manchester have been becoming radicalised. She has been Home Secretary for much of this period. She is committed to making cuts to many many areas of communities which contribute to people feeling increasingly marginalised, vulnerable and disenfranchised.

Labour are committed to investing in public services including education, police and mental health. Corbyn is against the UK trading arms with other countries and believes that countries such as Libya where there in an increasing risk of people becoming radicalised should be supported. He appears to be looking at the bigger picture. It is a no brainier to me!

acquiescence · 04/06/2017 20:35

*brainer!

Bombardier25966 · 04/06/2017 20:37

Theresa May says "enough is enough". Unfortunately it has taken her seven years to realise that, and as a result we're in this shit storm.

CivQueen · 04/06/2017 20:37

He mentioned the Saudi connection and the report into their funding of terrorism that is too 'sensitive'.

May won't do that, it would cost her far too much money.

I know who I trust to put our lives, our safety and our vital services ahead of cold hard cash or 2 billions worth of arms deals

PaintingByNumbers · 04/06/2017 20:38

tories: sell arms and suck up to biggest source of islamist extremism - saudi, meanwhile tell uk populace a load of crap about enough is enough and cutting police numbers

Original poster
Bearbehind · 04/06/2017 20:39

In my heart I know the Torys are just paying lip service to this but, on the other hand Dianne Abbot appears not to recognise her arse from her elbow so the prospect of her as Home Secretary is not appealing.

OP posts:
BTG3385 · 04/06/2017 20:39

She is cupable for me. Police numbers cut dramatically including PCSO's whilst she was Home Secretary. I am not voting for them this time based on that. I am no Corbyn fan either so not sure what to do yet.

Enough is enough is just words. Its actions that people care about

ajandjjmum · 04/06/2017 20:41

May wanted tougher sanctions when she was Home Secretary, and she wasn't supported. Maybe she'll get more support now.

Ankleswingers · 04/06/2017 20:41

There is the petrifying prospect of having Abbott as Home Secretary, who blamed her former hairstyle on her views towards terror groups.

The same Diane Abbott who as a result of the car crash interview on the Andrew Marr show, has now been banned from the Labour Party prior to the 8th June from doing any solo interviews.

You couldn't make it up. ShockShock

CivQueen · 04/06/2017 20:42

Personally I think that if/once the rest of the PLP realises that Corbyn an actually make it, that they'll be movements behind to scenes to 'reshuffle' her somewhere nice and quiet Grin

I don't like Abbott, but I don't think she'll be allowed to do too much damage before being moved on.

CivQueen · 04/06/2017 20:44

I truly think she's only there because everyone else ran and distanced themselves from Corbyn.

If it's shown that he can be popular I'd imagine the more competent ones would come crawling back in to the fold.

acquiescence · 04/06/2017 20:45

ajandmum you know, tougher sanctions don't tend to be much of a deterrent for suicide bombers.

ajandjjmum · 04/06/2017 20:48

So what would be? Nothing seems to have worked so far!

Bombardier25966 · 04/06/2017 20:48

In the past Corbyn has called for police not to be armed and McDonnell has called for M15 to be disbanded.

Corbyn said he was "not happy with the shoot to kill policy in general". Laura Kuenessberg represented this as him opposing shoot to kill, when what he meant was that he was not happy to be used in general, it shouldn't be used if other options are available. I doubt many would agree with that. The BBC Trust upheld a complaint against her for misleading reporting.

John McDonnell was pictured holding a letter which called for MI5 to be disbanded. He thought it was an anti austerity poster, and admitted he hadn't read it. In his own words, he made a cock up. He stated the idea of disbanding MI5 was "bonkers".

Ironic that you say you have researched propaganda, but then fall for it yourself.

Bombardier25966 · 04/06/2017 20:51

I don't for a minute think Abbott would be Home Secretary. She's more than aware that she's out of her depth, as is the rest of the leadership team.

But then she couldn't do any worse a job than May could she!

acquiescence · 04/06/2017 20:52

Sanctions do not work for terroriats who expect to get killed or kill themselves as they will not be there to receive the sanction. I don't really think this needs explaining!

I don't know what will work for sure, but increased public community services to reach out to marginalised groups is a good way to go. This is what the tories have been cutting and wish to continue cutting further. Early help and early recognition and appropriate intervention before someone becomes radicalised rather than a threat of punishment.

YouTheCat · 04/06/2017 20:54

If May had wanted tougher sanctions maybe she shouldn't have cut 20,000 from the police force so that these could be enforced.

She's an utter idiot who sells arms to ISIS albeit indirectly. I wouldn't trust her with anything. She is lining her pockets.

AllThePrettySeahorses · 04/06/2017 20:58

Corbyn voted against bombing ISIS 2 years ago - www.newstatesman.com/politics/staggers/2015/12/jeremy-corbyns-speech-against-military-action-against-isis-syria

One of the consequences of bombing ISIS was that they were starved of funds as here edition.cnn.com/2016/03/04/middleeast/isis-finance-broke-lister/index.html

Corbyn has repeatedly spoken against a shoot-to-kill policy www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34832023 because he would rather consider all the options, which is fine but bear in mind the three terrorists last night were dead within 8 minutes of the specialist unit being called in so not much thinking time. Corbyn's apparent u-turn on this, therefore, rings rather hollow and smacks of political expediency www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/06/04/jeremy-corbyn-forced-defend-past-opposition-shoot-to-kill-policy/

John McDonnell's attitude towards security is here www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/labour/12005431/John-McDonnell-signed-letter-calling-for-MI5-and-armed-police-to-be-disbanded.html

Diane Abbott has similar form news.sky.com/story/diane-abbott-distances-herself-from-1980s-quote-in-support-of-ira-10896181 . There is also a video out there somewhere of Abbott saying no one at all's DNA should be held on file

I would never, ever vote Tory tbh but nor could I vote Labour now.

CivQueen · 04/06/2017 21:03

AllThePrettySeahorses Corbin said he didn't approve of a general shoot to kill policy. He thought it should only be used if thought proportionate by the officers at the time.

He fully supported the actions of the officers in Paris and London.

Where is the uturn and what is the problem with that?

I'm not a fan of Abbott but May's comments in the debate the: her comments on not wanting anyone's DNA on file are being investigated. As no one else appears to have heard of them.

John Mcdonell was carrying a letter he had been handed. He hadn't even looked at it at the time of the photo and said the idea of abolishing mi5 was 'ridiculous'

And Corbyn preferred to cut off the funds directly from Saudi without having to blow up innocent women and children.

Again what is your exact problem with that?

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