Is DH too overprotective of DD (14)?

[suri80]

Eldest DD (14) has currently barricaded herself into her room because DH will not allow her to go to a "hang out" at her friend's house. The friend is a boy from her school who we don't really know and apparently his parents are away. I tried to compromise by suggesting to DH he could collect her at 10pm if he was worried, but it turned into a huge argument between him and DD and now he won't allow her to go at all. He says it's because this boy has an older brother and no doubt there will be older boys there, alcohol and probably drugs He says he trusts DD, but she is too young for all this. Now he has stormed off to help his brother with something.
AIBU to think she could have gone for a while and DH is being over the top here? Or is 14 too young as he says? I'm not sure what to think anymore.

Sounds like she is behaving like what she is: a child. Back up your DH. They are not 'arguing' - she is being cheeky.
But DH is also behaving like a petulant child and at least DD has some reason to get arguments. He is being completely unrealistic and quite controlling of her - not in this specific incident alone but in his general approach towards he as described by OP.

OP, have you considered overuling DH if at any point in the future he is unreasonably overprotective?

I wouldn't overrule him in front of the kids. I would need to persuade him privately. But yes, as PP have pointed out, it probably is time for a conversation. DD and him have always been so close and it would be a shame to alienate her.

I bet she would have been allowed to go if she was a boy. OP-You need to sort this out and quickly. It's only going to get worse. And no, you don't have to support him if you think he's wrong. Which he absolutely is. As soon as she is out of way for a decent length of time, sit down with him and make proper plans for what she is allowed to do. Which you agree with as well-he is not in charge here. You must not allow him to control her.

But as soon as your DD is 16 your DH legally cannot enforce any of his draconian rules OP. So all this talk about not going on a date until she's at least 17 is bollocks. He physically cannot stop her, whether she's living under his roof or not. So what will he do? Chuck her out if she disobeys him? That's great parenting, and the one thing that would guarantee she would be more likely to take drugs/sleep with inappropriate people to find a bed for the night/be in danger.

I just think that a parents job is to gradually allow their child to become independent one age-appropriate stage at a time, while always providing a safe space to fall back on if something goes wrong. Not to mollycoddle them until their 18 then be surprised when they go overboard.

To me, spending a few hours over a friend's house, and going to a park in the middle of the day is about as age appropriate for a 14 year old as it is possible to be.

For those saying you can always check up on her to make sure she's telling the truth - how? Firstly I think the fact that he's got the spy app on her phone is fucking creepy, but even so, can't you see how easy it would be for her to say 'I'm going to the park (true), with two female friends (true) for a walk (true).' You can drop her off at the friends house and pick her up there 5 hours later and the creepy app will show you that she's exactly where she said she would be. Except unless you literally stalk her there, jumping behind bushes whenever she turns around, there is no way you can establish whether she also meets up with some boys, goes in a boat, or sneaks behind the pavilion and takes a load of coke. Which is why you have to trust her, particularly if she's as sensible as your poor dd seems!

Trifleburst - seriously, the dd is never allowed to disagree with her parents? Shouting, swearing etc - fair enough that's disrespectful, but making a reasonable (to be fair she's probably right in terms of the possible dangers of a friend's house vs major shopping center hours after a terrorist attack) point that he happens to disagree with is still naughty?

It will be interesting to see if your DH lets his ds mix with girls when they are your DDs age. I'm going to hazard a guess and say that he will

You need to discuss this with DH. If he sees himself as vetting a suitor for lunch when she is 17 he is unrealistic.

Mine went to regular social gatherings of the 'hanging' type. They went to the park, each others houses to listen to music, they were gaming, going shopping etc. They were not parties - parties were clearly defined as a distinct type of event.

Not being allowed to go rowing in the afternoon is ridiculous. Your DH would be on firmer ground saying 'no' to a gathering in someone else's house if he wasn't anti her doing absolutely anything at all. Say 'yes' to events like rowing and you are on stronger ground to say 'no' to events you really are worried about.

We would probably have dropped them early in the session and picked them up mid evening (no later than 10pm).

I would also challenge DH to say if he plans to be equally restrictive when your boys are this age. If not why not? What is it he really has a problem with?

Just re read the OP-hang this was a whole class gathering from 5.00, you wanted to let her go for a bit and he over ruled you so she wasn't allowed to go at all?

That is absolutely outrageous.

onceandneveragain

It isn't that teenagers are never allowed to disagree. From my point of view, though, both parents have a role in presenting a united front. I would be saying, "Okay, you disagree, we will discuss it further later." I wouldn't stand there and say "They are arguing" like they are peers. He is the adult and she is the child. Whether or not she is right isn't the point; he has the authority in the situation.

Hate this assumption that boys are always a danger.
As someone else said there is a big chance they won't want anything to do with op's dd and her friends.

newdaylight

Hmm. It sounds to me like he was perfectly polite and reasonable to her this morning and she is giving him a load of cheek. He may be overprotective but as her father he has the same authority as the OP. They should have come to a decision together (none of this "overruling") and told her their joint decision, and that should have been the end of it. By allowing her to argue and to continue arguing, the OP is potentially undermining her DH. The whole approach just sounds wrong.

Drugs? How rich are these kids to manage to get enough drugs to split between an entire class.

Be thankful your DD told you the truth. Would have Ben easy for her to lie and say she was just going to hang out with a friend.

I wouldn't overrule him in front of the kids. I would need to persuade him privately.

If you always acquiesce to his view in front of them and have to persuade him privately then your children grow up knowing that the man calls the shots and has to be pandered to and you are not an equal partnership and DH is in control of all? That isn't a great model for your DD or your boys.

14 is too young - no way would I let my dd go without adults present.

I would have let dd go. I let dd go to any party or get together. Trust has to be given at some point. Better for you to have a talk about drinking and drug taking and her having her wits about her .

FWIW last get together dd went to involved pizza and watching the Minions movie with all her college friends. She is 17 and the youngest. DD doesn't drink or smoke.

Only girl I know who's father was this protective drinks alone in her bedroom and went a bit wild when she turned 16.

The thing is, unless you trust your teens and keep communication open, they will start lying and going behind your back. You have to allow them a certain amount of freedom and at the same time provide a safety net for them when they make mistakes. Respect and communication is key.

Her reward for being honest about the get together at her mates house was your DH treating her like she is a rebellious liar, sneaking off to drink with older boys. Why would she bother telling the truth the next time?

"He may be overprotective but as her father he has the same authority as the OP."

Well, obviously he hasn't- because he over rules her.

Have DD aged 14 and DS aged 16.

DD has an almost exclusively female group of friends. Does sleepovers etc but parents are there. Daytime trips, picnics, open air swimming pool visits etc absolutely fine with her group of friends. We wouldn't allow her to go to a mixed evening do with no adult present, but would allow her to go to a mixed evening do with an adult present until a reasonable hour.

DS has a very mixed - but rather geeky - group of friends. He has been to 'hang out' at friends' houses with the group with no adult present, for example after a GCSE, and has been out in the evening to specific activities but never to 'just a party / gathering', just because that's not his thing. If he did want to go to a party, we'd let him if we knew the party-giver, but would again collect him at a given time.

(Tbh, both of my dc happen to have extremely time-consuming evening hobbies, so partying and 'just hanging out' time is very rare! I suspect we have all these joys to come in a few years, though....)

Her reward for being honest about the get together at her mates house was your DH treating her like she is a rebellious liar, sneaking off to drink with older boys. Why would she bother telling the truth the next time?

This is what I would worry about in Op position.

When I was at school the girls who were most restricted by their DFs were the ones bringing vodka in thermos flasks at the end of term, who lied to their parents about where they were and went generally wild. Those whose parents were (cautiously) liberal remained pretty steadily on track. My parents were in the latter camp and they didn't find it easy - my DFs instincts were entirely to 'protect his little girl' and I don't think I fully appreciated it until I had my own children.

I took the same approach with my own children as teenagers. Not without the odd heart in mouth moment but they did trust us enough to call to be collected if something wasn't going right.

In regards to the "gathering" I'm inclined to agree with your DH. I was in nightclubs at 13, I wasn't doing drugs but I was definitely drinking and I think it's quite naive to think she (or her friends) won't be doing that. Maybe I'm wrong but she must be able to see that without parents there at age 14 it's not unreasonable for her dad to think that.

Insofar as the extra bit about your DH's view on boyfriends you really need to speak to him. She's 14 now. It may seem young but age 17 to only go on lunch dates seems ridiculously extreme. You definitely need to speak to your DH and get him to see sense here and you do need to trust your daughter more in this respect. He needs to compromise and hopefully this should restore some peace in the house. Also he should avoid antagonising her today the day before her exams start. They are more important than petty arguments about hypothetical boyfriends in the future today at least! Good luck!

I would have allowed the day trip and maybe a bit of time at the gathering but would have checked it out and picked up at 9.

I think you are naive to think there wouldn't be drinking etc though...

I think, by the way, that your DH is right about this particular event, but that is being lost in the context of his general approach / remarks.

If he had reasonable boundaries - e.g. meeting up in the daytime is fine, general hanging around in a cafe after school is fine, no grand sweeping statements about boyfriends - than indicating that this particular event happens to be beyond them for reasons x,y and z would be much easier.

BertrandRussell

I mean in theory. Neither of them should be overruling the other. These issues seem to stem from their approach to each other as partners, ie not presenting a united front.

Parenting as a united front is not about not challenging each other in front of the children.
It's them knowing that whatever decision it's a joint decision by the parents.

He needs to start talking to you first. And you need to talk to him about these things first. Decide together on a strategy and what boundaries you are comfortable with.

And your own boundaries should be that he doesn't make any decisions without consulting you. In which case, at least for me, the consequences for crossing those boundaries would be that I'd challenge him in front of them and over rule him.

BTW, I'd allow a day time gathering (although if they really wanted to mess it up, it wouldn't make much difference) for a couple of hours, but not all evening and not for a long time.

But this is a discussion for you to have with your husband.