To think she's probably not in a minority with her views?

[LauraMoon]

Foolishly talked politics after many proseccos with my True Blue sister.

Now, she wouldn't air these views in public but she knows she can say it to me because I know and love her for the cunt she is.

She thinks that the only reason food bank usage has rocketed is because poor people are lazy and just want free food.

That poor people need to learn to manage their money better and not smoke, drink or have sky telly.

That everyone can afford to buy a house if they really want to, but people waste money.

That anyone can get a decent job if they really put their minds to it.

Unemployment benefits are unnecessary because people should just have insurance.

(My 'favourite') that natural selection would breed out poor and stupid people and that by having a welfare system we are fucking with the natural order of things...

The background to this is that she left school with zero GCSEs and has then worked her way up from an office junior to finance director for an international (massive, household name) company. She bought a house in her early twenties with a loan from our parents and has always been well off. She says this is because she has a good work ethic, and doesn't see anyway that it could all go wrong for her.

Conversely, I am on ESA and have never really had a career, I've been a LP on benefits and lived in a HA house. I'm married now and dh earns £££ and we own our home, but I know how tenuous that all is in reality. She left her dh a few years ago and has her dc 50/50 and doesn't understand why other lone parents would struggle.

Anyway, I feel like I've had an insight into how some other people think and I'm pretty sure her views aren't even all that uncommon.

Does anyone here want to admit to thinking like this? Or maybe you know someone who does?

It's all a bit depressing really.

It is very depressing. It shows a complete lack of understanding of endemic problems and realities within the education system, healthcare (MH issues/substance abuse), employment, childcare, the benefits system, housing etc. It really is very ignorant.

Just going to pull up a chair...popcorn anyone?

It's the 'I'm alright Jack' mindset at work, isn't it? People do tend to believe that bad stuff won't happen to them and that people to whom bad stuff does happen must somehow deserve it. Because the alternative to thinking like that is accepting reality - that anyone can have a life-altering illness or a very serious accident. Anyone can lose it all no matter how hard they've always worked. And that is a deeply scary thing to accept. Not everyone has the mental strength to do it.

People who are successful like to imagine that their success is down entirely to their own merits, and that if people are poor or sick or disabled, it's their own fault. It shows at best a lack of imagination and at worse a profound sense of insecurity.

She sounds a bit dim, really.

that natural selection would breed out poor and stupid people

That's your sister fucked then

BlahBlahBlahEtc PMSl

It's funny because she is actually very intelligent, but a bit lacking in emotional intelligence I think.

There's only a year between us and we've always been very close, but we are about as different as two sisters can be.

But I think Hackmum has nailed it.

Your sister is, to put it politely, a bit of a twat.

She clearly has no experience of the benefits system, food banks, mental health, employment or anything like that.

Perhaps she would like to come down our local foodbank where we volunteer and see if she still has the same views?

Is she aware you can't just walk in off the street to a food bank and pick up some shopping? You have to be referred by the CAB, a Health visitor or doctor, or signposted to one by the JobCentre if they think you're in desperate need of one, and believe me, they don't just hand them out willy-nilly.

I wish the natural selection thing was true - perhaps we'd get rid of people with nasty opinions like this.

Is your sister American? This is a very common view in the US - that everyone can pull themselves up by the bootstraps if they really want to, so anyone who doesn't manage to do so just isn't trying hard enough

Start calling her Scrooge until she gets the message...
"Are there no prisons?"
"Those who are badly off must go there." "Many can't go there; and many would rather die." "If they would rather die," said Scrooge, "they had better do it, and decrease the surplus population."

She had no idea about food banks. I did put her right on that. She literally thought you could just rock up and grab freebies.

"natural selection would breed out poor and stupid people and that by having a welfare system we are fucking with the natural order of things..."

That is seriously fucking dangerous thinking. She would be no friend of mine after that gem.

Sometimes I think we're back in the early 1930s. That all ended well...

Oh absolutely! She's worked very hard but can't seem to grasp that she's also been incredibly fortunate.

And she does think that my troubles have been of my own making (MH problems, abusive relationship, poverty) and that I've been very fortunate to 'marry well'. I agree with the latter but not the former.

I think there really are lots of people who think this. I am surprised your sister has aired them to you given your past but there are so many selfish people. As a poster said it is the "I'm alright Jack"

When I hear the view of people about SN - and they are unaware that I have a child with some, I am depressed and angered. There is such a lack of understanding of those less fortunate and able.

Obviously some people take the piss/swing the lead etc, but mainly I think people don't. That said, I was a lot less considerate before I had kids.

People do tend to believe that bad stuff won't happen to them and that people to whom bad stuff does happen must somehow deserve it.

completely disagree. The most opinionated (for lack of better word) people I know are the ones who had massive step-backs (health, or financial for example) and bounced back richer than when they started.

It's the same with many expats: they are the least understanding about refusing to integrate somewhere, having it done themselves without refusing to accept the local habits and customs.

Is there a chance she is just trying to wind you up? She's clearly bright and must be reasonably socially competent if she's done so well in her career without a single GCSEs. Whilst she might generally believe what she says I suspect the ridiculous and inflammatory sweeping statements might have been made for entertainment and wind up purposes.

She is probably delighted that she has succeeded.

People who are successful like to imagine that their success is down entirely to their own merits, and that if people are poor or sick or disabled, it's their own fault. It shows at best a lack of imagination and at worse a profound sense of insecurity.

And that's Trump to a fault.......

Seriously though, I'm childless, own our house, both have really good jobs, but neither of us think like that, cause we're not stupid twats, and have some empathy.

On a lighter note I've just been shopping, and on the back of another thread picked up several packs of tampons & towels for the food bank. The donation bin was overflowing, I didn't want to leave the stuff on the floor so went to customer services. Her comment was What? Again, really? Vera, you're going to have to go sort the food bank bin again. .

Apparently in the last few days they can't keep up with the donations

Oh she was definitely on a wind up, and it was a weirdly hilarious conversation. But she does actually think like this, I know her very well.

The interesting thing for me is the people I've seen this in have been poeple who have come from poor backgrounds and worked their way up.They see it if they can do it why can't others.

But even she has had a loan from her parents to buy her first house?

thewireless.co.nz/articles/the-pencilsword-on-a-plate

This kind of explains it.

"That everyone can afford to buy a house if they really want to, but people waste money."

And yet the only reason she was able to buy one was with help from mummy and daddy...

She said that without the loan she would have just saved for a few more years. They loaned it to her so her and her DP could move out of their loft room. She doesn't get that they lived almost rent free with them and were able to save both their incomes.