Quick poll - Is this the right level of punishment?

[ChickenAndSpinachBalti]

Help MN jury. DS (nearly 9yo) took something of mine. Without asking. So he stole.

Just a cheapo, silver (ish) chain which was broken and in the kitchen-drawer-of-crap. Think it was there with a vague thought I may try and fix at some time. Been there for a while years probably. If he had asked I would have given it to him without a thought.

He was borrowing (and had asked nicely) some safety pins to make a pirate costume. I pointed him to the drawer of crap. He saw the necklace and thought it would be great "treasure" for their game. Took it. Didn't ask.

DD (11yo) came and told me later.

DS now currently sent to his room for an hour. Our neighbours boys are over so he can hear everyone still playing pirates without him.

He is already under caution (and had electronics taken away) for watching Minecraft videos when told not to. (broke trust/disobeyed direct request)

So I need a sanction for the stealing. It is his birthday at the weekend. We are going out with all of us/celebrating with DH/doing cakes etc on the Sunday as DH will be there and then on his actual birthday - Monday - DD/DS and I were planning on going to Harry Potter World (it is Inset day here).

Is it too harsh a punishment to cancel Harry Potter World? For stealing? He doesn't seem to get it when he has done wrong. Says sorry but just looks a bit sulky when he does so. I really want to get the message across that twice he has broken trust (videos and now stealing) and this is really bad.

Or am I overplaying it?

AM so cross right now I am not sure if IABU or even too soft cos I love him even if he has been a toe-rag

Thank you

OP re your reply to me, in another post I recommended www.ahaparenting.com, I think you'd find it helpful. I think quite a few of the posters replying to you have genuine concerns, and are not just hurling random abuse. This video sums up ahaparenting I think:

But OP FFS he did nothing wrong! Moral fucking compass over an old worthless chain that has been in your crap drawer for years? Jesus, it's not like he broke into your jewelry box and stole the pearls you're clutching

But DS doesn't open up the same way DD did

I wonder why

He really, really doesn't have a hard time of it

That isn't how it sounds. It sounds like they'll both be on the stately home thread when they are older. He is a little boy FFS. I really feel for him.

FrancisCrawford Just because I have not expanded on what I have discussed with DD does not mean I am not dealing with it. Also that is a hugely sweeping statement calculated act of nastiness on a child you have no idea about.

Also hugely sweeping statements about my relationship with my DS and DD. You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about as you only have this thread to base that wild generalisation on. You are welcome to make judgements and opine about what has happened/discussed in this thread. Anything else you cannot, and do not have a clue.

Way way too harsh. The hour in his room is (way) more than enough for taking something from the crap drawer and playing with it. Actually, why is he being punished at all for that??

It wasn't stolen...it was outage treasure! There is a difference in 'stealing' and 'using' I think. Very harsh and over the top in my opinion.

Op, why did your daughter know he would get into trouble for using the chain for his game? Most kids wouldn't snitch on that because they know the parent wouldn't care and it would be them that got into trouble for snitching on her brother for something so stupid and was normal behaviour.

But she knew didn't she? She knew exactly what would happen to him, so this isn't unusual behaviour towards your children from you and your husband is it? And she also got into trouble yesterday didn't she over videos. Why were they not allowed to watch them? Was that another punishment?

It's not just you excessively punished himand sent him to his room for an hour whilst he listened to the others play. It's the fact you considered even cancelling his birthday treat over something so minor. The fact you even call out in your op he "asked nicely" to borrow some safety pins. Why is that so very important to you that you need to call it out on your op. Would he not have got the safety pins if he hadn't asked in a way uou deemed nice enough?

I hope this thread has had an impact on uou, because I strongly suspect your children are strictly controlled and harshly punished as the norm.

The video starts to get to the relevant point at 1.50 by the way.

Op - AIBU

Most Posters - YABU overthetopandharshbeyondbelief

Op - No I am not

Most posters - er yes you are!

Op- No I am not, you know nothing about me or my DC

ok then ...

Honestly I'd walk away from this thread and take what you need from it.

For a child who maybe goes to room once a month and has electronics banned as often he's not some poor hard done by child who needs rescuing.
You've understood why your punishment was ott but imo your reaction of anger wasn't.

And don't think your DD telling you your ds has taken an item of jewellery that doesn't belong to him is terrible either.

Imo from what you've said you do far too much talking it through when actually quick and natural consequences are far better - I've found especially with boys!

And it sounds like the talking it through doesn't work if you've already discussed boundaries with ds and he doesn't adhere to them.

because I strongly suspect your children are strictly controlled and harshly punished as the norm

Agreed Bluntness '

Some poll.

Might be a case of informing child protective services if the parent is this abusive to the child.

Whoever said this....Seriously?? WTF are you talking about? You really need to calm down and stop over-reacting.

OP has agreed she needs to reflect a bit on whether there are better ways to do it. She has agreed an hour was too long. She's thinking about other ways of doing things. She's made up with her children, and talking it through with her husband.

Leave her be now!

By the way, Aha parenting is great! Well worth a look.

Hi OP!

Hope you are still reading.

You've taken quite a bashing on this thread, and you've taken it with mostly good grace.

You're clearly an intelligent, thoughtful parent who is trying to do the right thing.

It's great to see that you have taken on board people's comments and are looking to make changes.

I have to agree with others who have said that your later posts still have some ... how to say this... there's something slightly off about the tone of some of the things you say. I'm really not trying to attack you here (I know I was quite blunt earlier). But when you say things like "he had to win back our trust" - I'm paraphrasing for speed - it really does sound unusual, and a bit ... sinister? Too harsh? Like you, I'm not finding the right words.

I hope you know what I mean. Parenting is, as you say, very difficult. But please, I urge you to give some thought, not just to your parenting style, but also to look back at your own childhood, and that of your partner.

It can be very difficult to unpick our own experiences, and identify what was wrong or even unusual about our own childhoods. I think that is why posters have recommended parenting classes: not to make you feel awful, but because it does sound as though - despite your obvious good intentions and ability - some of your core beliefs are a little out of step with modern parenting.

It is obvious to us, as outsiders, but it doesn't seem as though it is clear to you exactly what it is that we are reacting to. As mogon says, people are genuinely a bit worried that your son is being treated too harshly. Don't forget, your home is where he lives, he lives by your rules - he has much less freedom than an adult, and too heavy a hand will really blight his little world. It does sound like you have experience of living with strict parents - try to look back on that and remember how it felt.

If you are having problems with your son, then yes there are other boards that can offer more specific advice - but I really think that you should start with yourself and your DH, and then see how you feel when you've worked through that a little.

I hope this doesn't sound condescending or hostile. I really hope it helps. Good luck

A good book to try is, "How to talk so kids will listen and listen so kids will talk."

It really helps you as a parent to see things from a different perspective, and tons of role play situations/examples. It's American in tone but I think the best parenting book there is.

You could ask school nurse to refer you to a parenting group too if you fancied it. There are some really good ones, and it can be good to work it out with others - but if not the book is a good start.

No, it doesn't sound condescending and thank you Deadgood and Pickle. I am still reading. But reeling a bit as well.

I have suffered quite horribly from anxiety in the past. Which, if you know what that feels like means you can have an tendency to be over-controlly. I have had counselling about it. Mostly about how it used to impact on my parenting. Particulalry of DD. About 2-3 years ago. When she was 8-9 years old. I think, reflecting back here, I seem to struggle with this age. It is a time when children take the next step in independence an forming more of their own individual characters. A bit less naturally compliant.

It was a time my mother really struggled with parenting - particularly with my older sister. I had counselling to stop me making the same mistakes she did.

I am not going to go into the details. But in many ways it does make me probably too soft on punishments. I know, I know that seems mad given this thread. But seriously I have seen enough of those to last a lifetime. It just means that when I do feel the need for a sanction (ignore, please the electronics - everyone takes those away for transgressions and as above not going into it) I am a bit lost as to what is appropriate. Punishing them does not come naturally (my mother used physical punishments which I have never, ever done and I don't really have an arsenal of what else to do/use. To be honest, most sanctions have only ever been electronics based. Or a chat/discussion. Sometimes if the anxiety reappears a bit (it can - it never just disappears) then, yes, I probably do lost my way a bit and the need to control rears it's head. Something will happen and I'll see it for what it is. One of those times has been today.

So, now I know. 10 minutes is enough. And for what he did a "please ask next time" would have been more appropriate. Not sure why I felt the need for more. I shall examine that too. But not on here.

DS, DD and I sat down and talked about it all at tea-time this evening. DD is mortified at what she did. And apologised to DS. I apologised to DS for over reacting. DS apologised not thinking through taking something from my drawer. We all accepted apologies. All more to it than that. All ended fairly well. Considering. I shall review the contents of my "crap" drawer. It used to be a no go area as it had needles/drawing pins/a few medically bits that we didn't want the children to mess with. Now they can use half of it without having to ask - so you are right - it needs to be clearer what the boundaries are. Pretty much everything else in the kitchen/downstairs is full available for them to use - so why just the odd thing in one drawer.

Fuck me. What a truly shitty day. I think it actually ended on a much more positive note than it could have done. I will have to have a heart to heart with DH about softness/too soft as maybe (with my fucked up role model - thanks mum) I can veer between being too soft sometimes and then go overboard. Or if I worry he thinks I am too soft (which I don't think I am) then I go overboard the next time round.

Please be reassured DS is very loved. And his sister is normally the best big sister going (I understand why on this occasion she lashed out with the snitching. I am not going to explain it.)

Thank you to the constructive people. Thank you in a way to the harsh people though I do wish some could be a little less harsh - I am just a mum trying my best.

Well done! Sounds very constructive. If it's any consolation, I had a dreadful patch with my DCs. I had therapy, worked on myself and read a load of great books. We turned it around and have a great relationship now. Articles about relationship based parenting are really helpful. The more you read, the moe sense it makes.

You've taken great steps from this thread. That's really all that matters in the long run.

Wow. Using his imagination and initiative to create treasure from detritus found in a drawer and you send him to his room? A simple correction in a firm voice would have sufficed. Pick your battles. Don't stop his trip...he is nine ffs.

Just seen your response. As they get older you will be challenged more. They need to understand the house rules and learn by their mistakes instead of you being on their case for every minor indiscretion.. the road is hard but your teatime discussion looks as if it was constructive.

for you OP.

Sounds like you are now on the right lines.

Remember, that more than anything, children neeed consistently in the disapline they recive.

There is no shame in asking for help.

Hi again OP.

Thanks for your update. Aaaargh, the mumsnet massive has put another struggling mother through the wringer - I'm sorry for my part in it. A mob mentality can really take over in threads like these, and have everyone baying for blood. Only a complete submission from the OP will satisfy people, and even then, not always...

Moving on. I don't mean to blame your husband here, but I think lots of us can identify with that "feeling unsure about something, then partner weighs in, making us doubt our own judgement and getting it weirdly wrong next time round" feeling. That wasn't very well-expressed, but I hope you know what I mean.

The thing is that when we try to apply someone else's judgement to a situation, it tends to go wrong and probably won't even be what that other person would have done in that situation! Does that make sense? We overshoot.

Probably worth deciding on you own attitudes to things, and not allowing his to sway yours. Easier said than done, I know.

I won't post again as you probably don't need another 3 pages of comments from people who have only read your OP. But it sounds like things will continue to be happy and loving in your home, and maybe even better than before. Shame it had to happen in such a harsh way (on here) though - onwards and upwards!

What??? I thought I was harsh!
For the "stealing" (it wasn't stealing)

• if I was in a good mood "oh that's a good idea for your pirate pastime darling, well done"

-if I was in a bad mood "you can't just bloody take my stuff you know!! Fine, just keep it"

No punishment

Op - you seem to have taken the comments on this thread and reacted in a really positive way. Well done - I can imagine that it would be very tempting to storm off!

For what it's worth, I work with children of your ds's age and I often think it's better to have a quick word "don't do that again " "that's not acceptable because. .." and then move on. Going over and over behaviour until you get the reaction you are looking for can be quite "oppressive", for want of a better word.

You sound like a thoughtful and caring person though - keep going and don't lose heart!