To discourage my friend from getting a 'Manchester Bee' tattoo

[CircleofWillis]

My friend is from Manchester but moved to London 25 years ago. She wants to get a bee tattoo to show her support for the people affected by the awful tragedy and to give financial support to the appeal. She doesn't have any tattoos and has previously stated she doesn't like them. AIBU to want to talk her out of it as she may regret such a permanent statement in the future. Instead I want to suggest she think about just donating the money. I know it is her body and her choice but I feel she is being swept up in the emotion as some of her friends from home have posted their tattoos on FB. I don't have any tattoos myself but not because I have any dislike of them but I would hesitate myself before having a permanent reminder of such a sad event on my body.

Shapely...you are totally correct, responding and attacking are absolutely not the same thing. Responding, is fine, attacking is not.

Stop defending her then.. if you agree that some thins she has said are wrong then why are you only arguing with those agonist what she has said? You have obviously chosen who you agree with but seem like you don't want to admit it. You shouldn't have to but stop trying to be impartial when you are not. Agree to disagree (using your own words) and move away from the thread.

Pain....I have not defended her. I have merely spoken out that it never feels right when a thread goes wrong like this. Yes, people can disagree with each other, but constantly fighting is not nice. This is why mumsnet hq deletes threads. Some people just seem to want to fight and it ruins it for everyone else.

And pain...I don't agree with either totally.

You have defended her. When you keep saying everyone else should stop by thavent once said she should. You say that we are attacking her but refuse to acknowledge the thousands she has attacked by calling them all chavs. You are clearly blinded by your annoyance at everyone but Hilda so I will leave you with your thoughts and I will not be returning to the thread to respond to you.

YY pain.

What hilda has done is not simply expressing an opinion: this is a fact. She has attacked, before anyone else did, and been called out. It isn't being picky to correct you when you say things that are wrong, and you're fooling nobody with these bleating defences.

They are stil raids on properties a stones throw away from my flat a week later. There was a police helicopter flying above our street for the whole of the weekend. People in Manchester are still feeling the effects of what happened now and people are scared. Nothing wrong with showing unity in the face of that.

Pain....we aren't going to agree and you all clearly want to fight. Im going to bow out now.

Like I said earlier, you don't know who is behind posts, what has happened to them etc, and I think sometimes people should think about that. You don't know who Hilda is. For all you know, she could be a victim.

Lean I made very similar comments to yours on the last thread, some people implied I was just being a twat.

I'm sorry I had to reply.

Hahahaha that she is a victim. Dear lord where the fuck did that little beauty come from?

I'm sorry if I sound awful but what does her being a possible victim have anything to do with this thread? Ok so she may be a victim of the Manchester attacks so that makes her opinion above everyone else's. Fuck sake mumsnet don't half make me laugh when we have some funny people commenting.

lean that sounds awful and terrifying really.

I know it's nowhere near the same at all in any way, but when the riots in London happened it was dark and cars were on fire near us and people hid in our garden.

It's not nearly as scary as a terror attack but even not being a direct victim is bloody scary.

I hope it all settles soon and you get back to feeling somewhat safe, it's awful for those still living with fear. Fear that people like myself wouldn't understand.

Miss .....I didn't mean you were being picky to correct me, I meant you were being picky for correcting her. It is her belief that some victims don't like people getting tattoos....you don't know if this is true or not, do you cannot say it is a fact that she is wrong. Like I said to pain, I'm bowing out now, so won't respond any more to you, you are clearly out for a fight with anyone. I just wish people would be a bit more conscious of what has gone on only a week ago. This terrible terrible thing has affected a hell of a lot of people and mumsnet is supposed to be about supporting each other, not fighting each other.

red I think it's hard to get your head around if you aren't here just how much police presence there is in Manchester at the moment and how unnerving that can feel.

I went to the Trafford centre last week on a Friday evening and it was Empty, there were armed police at the doors and an alert going off every ten minutes telling shoppers to report anything suspicious.

Call me a twat all you want but the people of Manchester aren't just 'gaining second hand grief via the media'.

Pain..."hahaha that she is a victim"....what an awful thing for you to say. I think you have just shown your true colours. Very sad.

I think whats happened is because this wasn't an instant slag fest by a few posters like the other threads then a 'tone' was set which has predictably escalated from there.

Let's not get this thread deleted - the tattoo is about unity, support, togetherness, proudness and resilience while raising a lot of money for the victims and their families. That's amazing!!

You're being ridiculous and rude, Pain. Presumably you didn't see the post yesterday on the other thread from somebody who HAD been involved in this. It was eloquent and aggressive in its dismissiveness and disgust of people trying to own griefs that were not theirs.

If you didn't see it then just accept that it was there. Other people saw it. If you did see it then you just want a pop at Hilda and that's not on. You're seemingly joining in the 'ganging up' and that's got bugger all to do with respect or solidarity, just turning on people who don't think like you. It's very much feeling like attacking to be honest.

There's room for both. There's not room for this.

Gah, I was on the other thread with you; your tone was very different on it. I've also modified mine. Whilst I don't agree with visible grief expressed by people who don't rightly belong in it, I think sensible and measured discussions can be had and it would be good if this thread didn't descend into name-calling - on either 'side' because otherwise it surely will be deleted.

Very well said lying.

Why you all arguing about it? some people have opinions strongly either way. There's no right or wrong in that (as long as it doesn't break talk guidelines).

Don't know why some people are being snotty about it. I have my bee and I don't care what others think. We have raised thousands for charity stood outside tattoo shops for hours and all because it is something that happened in our city. I love the fact that my tattoo isn't unique I share it with thousands of others in a show of solidarity, its a salute to the city I was born and raised and everything that bee stands for. I have no other tattoos and always said I would only make a permanent mark when I felt the time is right. Now is the ti!e for me, people choose to have a tattoo or not to that is up to them but as an adult she is doing what she feels is right.

Lean, I was in a shopping centre near there on Friday, then I went somewhere else with my one year old GD, then a dozen police cars raced passed to evacuate aforementioned shopping centre.
Armed raid on next street.
But apparently I'm just a hysterical scare mongering knob.

Never prouder to be a Mancunian.

Quite, although I don't recall you on that thread I do recall it had a completely different tone about it altogether than this one. Although I do recall my posts expressed the same sentiments I'm expressing in this thread - I even acknowledged at one point I was probably getting a bit boring with my unity, standing together, support etc etc stuck record!

Plus I had a lot more time on my hands yesterday. Was supposed to be going out but when I heard the place I wanted to go had a heavy armed police presence I decided against it as my DC are scared enough to live in Manchester at the moment.

I think people are maybe overlooking that Manchester has already been wrecked by something similar in the 90s and for those people especially who were part of the city then and part of it now have a sense of wanting to stand strong together and the tattoo (for some) is a visible sign of that.

Can we all remember for a moment that it's only just over a week that some people lost their loved one(s).

Here here Casschops.

No need for that either, StarHeartDiamond, I don't think anybody really needs reminding of the atrocities anywhere. Those who were grieving then are grieving still and they aren't going to forget.

The rest of us are probably just trying to come to terms as best we can with reminders that our world isn't quite as safe as we thought it was.