To wonder what you would think if your OH said that

[Poisongirl81]

Before being with you in his life he has had sex with men! A couple of times just for the sex. He's also had long term things with women and fancies me very much. Just don't know how to feel.

Where are we saying ALL women should accept ALL penises? No. My point was rather different.

I do think that your declarations that gay men are 'less manly' are rather disturbing, though. And idiotic.

The parallel with racism isn't would you have sex with a black man, but would you reject someone you previously fancied if you found out that they had ever had sex with a black woman.

That's not to say that you should ever feel pressure to have sex with anyone, just to say that if you find the thought of them 'balls deep' in a black woman so offputting you could never think of them attractive in any way then you could quite possibly have an issue with race.

I'm really shocked people would end a relationship if the partner was bi. How homophobic. What difference does it make exactly ??

No it wouldn't bother me. Liking anal might since I don't like it. But that's it.

Preferring anal sex doesn't make him "more gay", like some posters seem to be saying...

Clearly, nobody is saying anyone should have sex with someone they don't want to have sex with- if you suddenly find your husband unappealing because of someone he had sex with before you even met him then of course that is your prerogative. But if the person he had sex with before was male, and it's the idea of him having had homosexual sex that's suddenly making him unattractive to you, then I think you need to seriously question why that is? As other posters have said, he is still the exact same person. If it's the fact that it's homosexual sex that you don't like then I am struggling to see how that isn't homophobic, sorry.

I think most of us who're saying this is an issue have duly questioned ourselves, and don't find ourselves too wanting.

I appreciate this comment seems somewhat goady, and I apologise for that. But at this point, what else is there to say?

We've been reprimanded, we've thought about it, and our feelings remain. I'm answerable to no-one but myself on this.

I will be sure to let my gay brother, other family members and close friends know that I'm now homophobic, and they can make their own decisions about me, based on this.

To reiterate, the 'less manly thing' is total bollocks from my point of view. Anyone putting forth this view speaks only for themselves.

I don't see why the need for sackcloth and ashes. It's just a bit odd to have such a strong reaction and no idea where it comes from. I can see why you'd (hypothetical you) not want to date someone who was gay, although that shouldn't really come up as a scenario. I can understand a bit why people have concerns about being 'enough' for someone who fancies both men and women, but to say that anyone bisexual or who has ever had a gay sexual experience is just flat out unattractive to you really does suggest that you think men having sex with men is wrong.

Your equivalences seem to me to ethically wrong situations. Visiting a prostitute or having sex with a much younger person are both to me about abuses of power. there is nothing unethical or abusive about finding both men and women attractive.

If you wanted to ask your brother about an equivalence then you could ask him if he would ever have a relationship with someone who was bisexual. I'd not be surprised if he said no too though.

If I found out my partner had had same sex encounters before we met it would be a total deal breaker because they wouldn't be the person i thought they were. The mindset and thought process they'd have to have to lead up to doing that would be so different to what I'd thought and would feel like a betrayal, like they are a different person. I would find it completely unattractive. Wanting anal would be a deal breaker as well.

But if the person he had sex with before was male, and it's the idea of him having had homosexual sex that's suddenly making him unattractive to you, then I think you need to seriously question why that is?

I don't need to question it. It isn't because of some homophobia -
which is what you are saying. It is because I don't find it attractive that my husband would have had sex with a man. No problems with gay sex, no problem with gay people. I do have a problem with the most intimate sexual connection I have being subject to some sort of societal standards of correctness. If I want to be less attracted to my husband because he had gay sex I knew nothing about I bloody well will be and no amount of people telling me "but it is nothing" will change that. Similarly if he had a threesome, had sex with a 17 year old when aged 30 etc. I would find him less attractive sexually. I don't mind if people want threesomes. I think in some circumstances a 30 year old with a 17 year old might be ok (god knows if someone posts concerns on here there are hundreds of posters who were 17 when they met their 30 year old husband and have been now married for 30 blissful years). It just isn't for me. Is that too hard to understand - that people have different ideas of what they find attractive?

I'm staggered that a minority of posters simply cannot grasp that it is no way homophobic for a straight woman to have a sexual preference that does not involve sleeping with men who have have sex with men.

It's been explained perfectly well by numerous posters many many times.

It's funny how it's only women who appear to face this judgement. No one would repeatedly cry prejudice if a homosexual man did not want to sleep with a straight woman or found the idea unappealing. In fact I would speculate that it would never cross people's minds the other way round and yet a few posters are incapable of appreciating their own misogyny.

The double standard is shocking.

No one would repeatedly cry prejudice if a homosexual man did not want to sleep with a straight woman

That's not 'the other way round'. A homosexual man is attracted to males.

A heterosexual woman is attracted to males. Sexual orientation is a protected characteristic. Losing all attraction to a man you previously fancied and enjoyed sex with upon finding out he previously engaged in anal sex with another man is... not part of a sexual orientation.

You're entitled to have a preference to not sleep with men who have slept with, or been attracted to, men. No question. You're entitled to whatever preferences you like. But just as a blanket statement of 'I won't sleep with any black man' bears further scutiny, especially if it's phrased along the lines of 'I won't sleep with any black man, ewww', so does 'I won't sleep with men who have had sex with men' and the associated sentiments expressed by some on this thread. It doesn't change your right to have a preference.

Losing all attraction to a man you previously fancied and enjoyed sex with upon finding out he previously engaged in anal sex with another man is... not part of a sexual orientation.

But it is part of your unique sexual mix - who or what you find attractive.

I might say to you that I love 50 shades of grey and find it very arousing and you might say (i bet you would) that you find it utter shite. Are you entitled to say "thanks but no thanks" to a sexual partner who reveals to you that he/she finds 50 shades of grey arousing? Or should you say "it is a protected characteristic I must look beyond this"

And for the record I don't find any of the things people do with each other disgusting.

I just don't want to do them or do them with people who have done them and don't want to be called homophobic for feeling that sexual preference.

No double standards from me. I'd say exactly the same thing to a man who said that he'd immediately cease to find his long term sexual partner attractive (especially with a yuck/ no longer womanly type reaction) because they told them that they had in the past had a sexual encounter with a woman.

However I do recognise that some men would do the whole 'can I watch/lets have a three some' thing, which is also really problematic.

I might say to you that I love 50 shades of grey and find it very arousing and you might say (i bet you would) that you find it utter shite. Are you entitled to say "thanks but no thanks" to a sexual partner who reveals to you that he/she finds 50 shades of grey arousing? Or should you say "it is a protected characteristic I must look beyond this"

I didn't mention protected characteristics as a reason to dig deeper. I was attempting to point out that not fancying men who've touched a penis because you find it such a turn off is not the kind of thing where any questioning of underlying reasons can be somehow turned into some kind of discrimination. As some here are trying to spin it. 'Don't ask me, it's my body, DON'T YOU UNDERSTAND CONSENT?'. You're on a discussion board, discussing the issue. Not being pressured into leaving your straight male partner for someone who's had sex with another man. People are usually able to attempt to scratch the surface here.

If my DH said he actually really liked 50 Shades of Grey I'd be a tiny bit turned off by it. But I wouldn't object to being questioned on whether there was a reason. There would be a reason. Most likely to do with thinking people who like 50 Shades of Grey are rather dim, and it would change how much I respected him. Obviously that's my own intellectual snobbery at play. So why are you so keen to pretend that your distaste for engaging in a relationship or sex with men who have had sex with men is based on absolutely nothing? Just because, because, because? It seems so disingenuous. You know that anyone reading has to assume it's based on one or more distasteful ideas about men who have sex with men, subconscious or otherwise.

Oh Dixieflat reread your comment. You said a woman is "entitled to have a preference to not sleep with a man who has slept with men" yet a woman can't say "I won't sleep with a man who has slept with men."

What?!? You just said it's ok, then it's not ok. You just want to label people who don't bow down to your pet definition for your favorite judgmental term.

It's none of your business if a woman says she won't sleep with a man who has slept with men. Get it? You don't get to define your little pet name-calling for everybody else. You don't get to command all women that they must not say "I won't sleep with a man who has slept with men" or else they will be labeled with your little insult across their foreheads.

Most people have had enough of this politically correct garbage. If women don't want to sleep with men who have had sex with men, it is their right to say it loud and clear.

You know, a man having sex with a man is not appealing in any way to MANY women when looking for a partner. If you can't accept that, if you can't accept that people don't agree with you, and you are shocked or whatever, who cares what you think? You're shocked? Shock away, nobody gives a mouse's behind except you. You've labeled them a "homophobe" ? So what? I think people are sick and tired of all this garbage.

Oh my, you have another post that is even more obnoxious than the one before.

I think you have issues that none of us can help you with.

You declare you're an intellectual snob? Hahaha!! Yeah, right.

Oh Dixieflat reread your comment.

I think it is you who needs to do the re-reading.

You said a woman is "entitled to have a preference to not sleep with a man who has slept with men" yet a woman can't say "I won't sleep with a man who has slept with men."

Of course she can.

What?!? You just said it's ok, then it's not ok.

No I didn't.

You just want to label people who don't bow down to your pet definition for your favorite judgmental term.

What term would that be, then?

You don't get to define your little pet name-calling for everybody else.

Huh?

You don't get to command all women that they must not say "I won't sleep with a man who has slept with men" or else they will be labeled with your little insult across their foreheads.

They can say it all they like. And again you refer to 'my little insult', 'my favourite judgmental term', 'my pet name'. You're going to have to tell me what term I've used so much that you've gathered it's a favourite.

If women don't want to sleep with men who have had sex with men, it is their right to say it loud and clear.

Of course they can say it. However, this being a thread that centres on a discussion of whether it would be a problem, you are not entitled to be shielded from any and all questions about why you think it would be a problem. It's your right not to explain. But other people are entitled to be dissatisfied with that, or unconvinced. If you're not interested in a discussion, stop discussing.

You've labeled them a "homophobe" ? So what?

Umm. No. I haven't. You know, you can't spout off with this political-correctness-gone-mad nonsense focused entirely on the use of 'labels' if a person hasn't... you know... used any.

Oh my, you have another post that is even more obnoxious than the one before.

Just what I thought when I read your first response to me!

I think you have issues that none of us can help you with.

Right back at you.

So why are you so keen to pretend that your distaste for engaging in a relationship or sex with men who have had sex with men is based on absolutely nothing? Just because, because, because? It seems so disingenuous. You know that anyone reading has to assume it's based on one or more distasteful ideas about men who have sex with men, subconscious or otherwise.

I'm not pretending anything. I posted earlier in the thread that I had a relationship with someone bisexual in my early 20s. It was not happy. I won't do it again.

And NO I won't have you analyse my relationship to tell me why I should reach other conclusions.

this is my life and I will make decisions that suit me. Not you and not some notional idea of how someone should behave.

I will not have a relationship with someone who is bisexual. I have no problem with anyone who is gay, bisexual, whatever. Don't care. But I don't wan't to be in a sexual relationship with them - been there, done that, don't want to do it again. I am not pretending about anything and your amazing arrogance in presuming you know better than me why I am making the choices I am in my personal life is astonishingly offensive.

I posted earlier in the thread that I had a relationship with someone bisexual in my early 20s. It was not happy. I won't do it again

OK, so you clearly have some kind of rationale for your preference. I missed that post. The post I responded to, here, rather implied you were unwilling to admit your preference was based on anything at all:

I just don't want to do them or do them with people who have done them

Which is why I described it as 'just because'. Clearly you're not trying to suggest it's 'just because'. I've no need personally to dig around in the reasons you have. I only object to the idea that it can be entirely without basis.

And NO I won't have you analyse my relationship to tell me why I should reach other conclusions.

I have absolutely no interest in doing that, nor have I expressed one.

I am not pretending about anything and your amazing arrogance in presuming you know better than me why I am making the choices I am in my personal life is astonishingly offensive.

I argued that there has to be a reason underlying 'I just don't want to', as explained, and that anyone reading a claim that it's due to no deeper reason than 'I just don't want to' will be unconvinced. Given that my original post was not directed at you, I think it was rather misjudged to assume I'd caught the post you wrote re. your past relationship. I responded your post directed at me. I could call it 'amazing arrogance' and 'astonishingly offensive' to attribute desires, intentions and opinions to me that are not in evidence, but I'm not given to filling posts with hyperbole.

So after all that justification of your posts Dixie do you accept that is it ok for me to not want to have a relationship with someone bisexual without being accused of being homophobic?

My partner is bi. Didn't find out until after we were together. Wasn't bothered. Really surprised so many in this thread are.

do you accept that is it ok for me to not want to have a relationship with someone bisexual without being accused of being homophobic?

I've not accused you of being homophobic. And I wouldn't accuse someone of being homophobic without evidence making me think it was the case.

I think it's fine for you to not want a relationship with someone who is bisexual. I don't however think you have any right to dictate that people refrain from questioning the reason behind that on a discussion thread, or suggesting it might be founded in questionable logic regarding bisexuals, if you can't or won't back up your position with anything that points to the contrary.

I am interested in whether people are going around with harmful and fallacious ideas about others. I am not remotely interested in whether people are denying those others a sexual relationship with them.

I couldn't be in a relationship with a bisexual man.

It's like being 'really surprised someone doesn't like olives'. Honestly.

It's because they just don't like them. Personal preference - totally illogical thing, personal preference, but there's no accounting for taste.