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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To formula feed baby despite OH's objections.

513 replies

Herbie22 · 29/05/2017 17:08

DD is 5 weeks old and exclusively breast fed. I am finding this tough because she is either on the boob or upset.
This is my first baby so I'm not sure what I am doing. I think she might not be getting enough from me as she needs near constant feeds. I would like to top her up with formula as I literally do nothing all day/night but feed her. I know that it's hard work a newborn but I can't even walk down the road to the shops without her screaming. I don't get to see anyone and it is making me sad and lonely.

I tried to speak to OH about this and he said that he doesn't want her on formula. He said that I am making enough milk because she is gaining weight. I don't think she is gaining it fast enough though which worries me.
I also wonder if she would sleep better if she was formula fed. I am up nearly all night feeding her at the moment which is another reason I think I'm not producing enough milk as she won't settle.
I don't want to give up BF completely. Maybe just supplement her feeding but at the moment I feel like I've lost all my zest for life because all I do is sit either on the sofa or on my bed feeding. It is also damaging my relationship with OH as we can't even have dinner without DD wanting to be fed (though I do feed her just before) and I'm starting to resent him getting to do things, even popping to Tesco, without a baby attached to him.
I know I sound horribly ungrateful as I am so blessed to have DD! I just want to be able to do things other than feed her!

OP posts:
PersianCatLady · 31/05/2017 17:11

(I am absolutely not saying this to knock breastfeeding or promote formula, btw.)
Me either.

I believe that you have to do what is best for you and your family in your situation.

What I don't agree with is the way in which BF is promoted to have all kinds of health benefits that have never actually been proven.

I also think that it is very wrong to demonise women who for whatever reason want to FF, because it does happen.

PersianCatLady · 31/05/2017 17:14

www.nhs.uk/news/2014/02February/Pages/Breast-milk-no-better-than-bottled-researcher-claims.aspx

Here is something from the NHS website which mentions a study that showed nostatistically significant differences in outcomes for breastfed and bottle-fed children.

DixieChick77 · 31/05/2017 17:16

I gave up at 6 weeks. It was just exhausting. I now have a happy healthy 18 year old. I can't see how torturing myself for any longer would have improved his life.

ConConstance · 31/05/2017 17:17

I have breastfed my daughter until 1year old. Found the first 8 weeks the hardest as it felt like all I done was feed.

Please contact the breastfeeding helpline for some support.

You need to do what is best for you. Happy mum= happy baby.

Lweji · 31/05/2017 17:19

What the studies don't take into account is that the kind of people who BF are generally wealthier and healthier themselves.

Not going into every study, it's common and good practice to stratify the samples according to age, economic status, habits such as smoking, even IQ, etc. And to analyse the two groups according to that stratification.

Health is more difficult but not impossible to estimate.

Of course no study is perfect.

But I'd like to see a declaration of competing interests by the magazine authors, as most scientific studies have.

Lweji · 31/05/2017 17:22

I haven't checked how the sibling comparisons were made. And I can think of a series of confounders that could affect results.

LRDtheFeministDragon · 31/05/2017 17:26

YY, agree with what you say about demonising, persian.

sycamore54321 · 31/05/2017 17:28

In the specific case of the OP, it sounds clearly like she only has barely enough milk to sustain this baby and the baby needs to feed every hour of the night and day to get an adequate intake. The first rule of any nutrition is that there must be sufficient calories. Every other nutritional conce is secondary to that. This baby is only getting enough intake at the expense of her own sleep and her mother's mental health. A five week old baby shouldn't have needed to feed every hour since birth. Don't call it cluster feeding, this is not normal.

OP adding some formula top-ups or replacing some feeds with formula sounds like exactly what you need to do to give your daughter the best for her. I am disgusted at your partner's attitude. As long as the baby is fed, then all your major parenting duties are fulfilled. Fully formula, mixed feeding, breastfeeding are all fine but on absolute condition that the baby is getting enough food.

Best wishes to you.

WellErrr · 31/05/2017 17:31

What I don't agree with is the way in which BF is promoted to have all kinds of health benefits that have never actually been proven.

But they have.

You're talking about lifestyle factors influencing intelligence, which is of course correct. But IQ is a tiny part of the benefits of breastfeeding.

Breastmilk contains, among other ingredients, omega 3s, DHA, cholesterol and lipase, oligosaccharides, lysosomes, lactoferrin, live leukocytes, absorbable lactose....I could go on and on. Formula is either completely lacking in these, or extremely deficient. All of these ingredients and more, are in breastmilk because they are necessary for normal development.
The levels change and adjust to the baby's needs. Formula does not.

Breastmilk also contains live digestive enzymes and hormones such as oxytocin; the digestive enzymes and hormones in formula (which are not human to begin with) are killed by the manufacturing processes - they put them in because it looks good on the tin.

That's just off the top of my head. The info is out there for anyone who wants it.

This is in response to posters saying that formula is as good as breastmilk, or that breastmilk doesn't have proven benefits. Formula is a useful tool and of vital importance for many families. It's not human breastmilk though.

sycamore54321 · 31/05/2017 18:02

"Breastmilk contains, among other ingredients, omega 3s, DHA, cholesterol and lipase, oligosaccharides, lysosomes, lactoferrin, live leukocytes, absorbable lactose....I could go on and on".

But so what? If there is no difference in outcomes, so what? You say they are necessary for normal development and claim these things are absent from formula, so formula babies by your definition must develop abnormally. Yet nobody can measure this or tell breastfed infants/toddlers/children/adults from others. The effects of any must be very small indeed. Breastmilk can also contain pus or blood if the mother has mastitis - just because it's there does not mean it is important or beneficial

If my diet is absent certain vitamins, you can damn well tell within a few months as I will have scurvy or rockets. And this may have lifelong effects. If I am fed formula milk but not breastmilk, nobody can tell any difference at the time or later - disclaimer for the proven protective effect of breastmilk against NEC in premature infants, which is not the case for the OP.

Absofrigginlootly · 31/05/2017 18:09

Oh dear god I see this thread has descended into a BF vs FF bunfight. It always does Hmm

Feeding is such an emotive subject. Speaking as someone who used to work in HV long before I had DD (so had no axe to grind re: my own feeding experiences at the time) I saw a lot of women who desperately wanted to BF but weren't able to for various reasons and the amount of guilt they carried around was overwhelming at times and contributed directly to PND in many cases. That is why I would always encourage someone who wants to BF to keep going for as long as they can - because often it's a case of a small amount of tweaking to get things to 'click' and then they will be glad they keep going.

OP I posted a similar thread around 5-6 weeks when my DD was feeding 24/7 as I was considering adding in some formula because I just couldn't cope. I was getting 1-2 hours sleep a night! She was making me so sore!

That's why I said to get silent reflux and allergies and posterior TT ruled out as all of these things contribute to constant feeding.

Newborn babies will nurse ALOT - for hours on end, that is normal. The reason I suggested Kellymom and looking at Dr MCKennas research into infant sleep is that I feel western parents often have unrealistic expectations about how much newborns feed and how often they wake up. It doesn't help that FF has been the predominant feeding method for decades in the Uk now, so people's experiences and expectations are often based around FF babies behaviour, not h normal behaviour of BF infants.

BF is definitely front-loaded in terms of effort. The first 3 months are awful... you can basically expect to do little else apart from feeding and expect your baby to wake frequently throughout the night. BUT once you get over the hump it just sort of clicks and you realize how convenient and easy BF is its sooo worth it in the long run (IME).

However, constant 24/7 feeding is usually not normal and can be indicative of something else going on (reflux, allergies, TT) so I think it's worth getting a referral to a lactation consultant and maybe seeing your GP to rule out reflux.

OP I really sympathize. I'd gone on BF training, taught other women how to BF, felt I had a pretty good understanding of how hard it was going to be at first so I felt realistically prepared and certainly didn't have rose tinted specs at how blissful and wonderful it was all going to be.... I was still floored at how hard it was at the beginning.

I kept going because it was incredibly important to me to BF my baby. I know it would have been detrimental to my mental state if I had stopped. HOWEVER there are clearly lots of time and when the opposite is true and if you feel that introducing the odd bottle of FF here and there is going to make a difference to your coping ability and preserves your BF overall then that is no bad thing.

With regards to the BF vs FF bunfight, the scientific evidence is pretty clear that human breastmilk is superior than formula milk. And that is not to say that formula milk is bad for babies (!!). Saying breastmilk is superior doesn't mean that formula isn't the next best alternative and thank goodness for the invention of forumla! Where in the past such babies would have been failure to thrive or worse.

(For example: www.who.int/mediacentre/factsheets/fs342/en/)

BUT there is also a lot of evidence to suggest that PND negatively impacts on infan development - so it is important to take the mothers mental health into account in these situations.

OP whatever you decide to do, someone will have an opinion and judge you negatively. That's parenting I'm afraid. You have to do what is right for your family and no one else can make that decision except you. So please don't let this thread make you feel bad either way. I would also respectfully disagree with the poster who said the fact that your baby feeds so much is evidence that your milk is not enough. If the baby is gaining weight well and has plenty of wet and dirty nappies then they are getting enough.

Good luck OP whatever you decide

Absofrigginlootly · 31/05/2017 18:17

Oops Blush

www.who.int/mediacentre/factsheets/fs342/en/

WellErrr · 31/05/2017 18:19

But there IS an effect on health throughout life sycamore, which is why the NHS, WHO and all other health authorities are so strongly in favour of breastfeeding.

DorkMaiden · 31/05/2017 18:44

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TheSkyAtNight · 31/05/2017 18:46

This thread really shows how efforts to increase breastfeeding in this country have gone into the message rather than practical support.

Herbie, I hope you've been able to get decent face to face advice from experts to help you decide what's best.

TheSkyAtNight · 31/05/2017 18:49

To add to what DorkMaiden says, there is also no correlation between how much you can express & how much milk you have.

DorkMaiden · 31/05/2017 18:49

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DorkMaiden · 31/05/2017 18:50

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DorkMaiden · 31/05/2017 18:52

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WellErrr · 31/05/2017 19:19

This thread has highlighted to me how much misinformation there is about breastfeeding.

TheSkyAtNight · 31/05/2017 19:30

I couldn't pump much despite an oversupply & engorgement for 3 months!

shouldwestayorshouldwego · 31/05/2017 19:43

Send him a link about male lactation tell him he has a few weeks to set it up, it is his choice whether he formula or breast feeds when you go out for the morning, but obviously he believes breast is best and surely if he loves his dd that much he will do it for her.

Do also check out cows milk protein intolerance. I couldn't have any milk or soya when feeding mine.

littletwofeet · 31/05/2017 20:11

sycamore
In the specific case of the OP, it sounds clearly like she only has barely enough milk to sustain this baby and the baby needs to feed every hour of the night and day to get an adequate intake. The first rule of any nutrition is that there must be sufficient calories. Every other nutritional conce is secondary to that. This baby is only getting enough intake at the expense of her own sleep and her mother's mental health. A five week old baby shouldn't have needed to feed every hour since birth
It does not sound like OP doesn't have enough milk. Baby feeding frequently is FAR more likely to be milk transfer issues than OP not having enough milk.

OP adding some formula top-ups or replacing some feeds with formula sounds like exactly what you need to do to give your daughter the best for her
If the OP has supply issues (which nothing she has posted indicates this) giving formula will only hinder this. Look up the top up trap.
Giving formula is fine if that's what the OP wants but it's not the best thing to give her DD, breastmilk is.

If the OP wants to give formula then this is obviously up to her but so many women make this decision based on poor advice (not enough milk being a classic example) and then come to regret it.
OP, maybe speak to a lactation consultant as some of the advice given here is awful (some great advice too but it must be hard to pick out what is accurate and what is nonsense)!

In relation to there being no difference in outcomes, this is simply not the case. You may not be able to tell which individual baby/toddler/adult has been breastfed, the same as you couldn't tell which baby/toddler adult is fed a diet of processed ready meals and who eats freshly prepared food. It doesn't mean that they are the same.
Formula is heavily processed powered cows milk. You cannot compare this to breastmilk. Formula works out as a good choice for many women but you cannot say it's as good as/the same as breastmilk.
The same way, many families live on processed food (as a valid choice for them) but it would be nonsense to say it was the same as cooking fresh food from scratch.

This thread really highlights why breastfeeding rates are so low in this country.

Cutesbabasmummy · 31/05/2017 20:23

I was formula fed by Me so gastric tune when I was born. So I must be intellectually deficient. Oh wait - I have a degree from a red brick university! Honestly the OP wasn't asking about the benefits of breast milk v formula milk. She was asking if the feeding was normal and feeling down as she is just a milk machine for her child with a husband who has no idea how she feels. You won't damage your child by giving formula P.O.. Reclaim your life and combination feed xxx

DorkMaiden · 31/05/2017 21:14

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Message withdrawn at poster's request.