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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Why don't people like Corbin ?

176 replies

ginorwine · 29/05/2017 16:40

The media are after him . So surely he is a threat or the tabloids wdnt bother . But we can't believe what the machines of the popular press tell us to ???
I'm curious why he appears unpopular ?
He appears principled to me . ...

OP posts:
PigletWasPoohsFriend · 30/05/2017 13:35

Oh if you don't think Labour has issues with anti semitism I suggest you have a look at some of the replies to Emma Barnet on twitter after her interview.

ThenThereWereRainbows · 30/05/2017 13:43

@Scandelicious antisemitism is classed as a hate crime; it most definitely is illegal.

Scandelicious · 30/05/2017 13:46

I don't think it's labour in general or even most mps. But there's undoubtedly a far loony left contingent who have bizarrely made common cause with Islamic extremism together with the attendant anti Semitic. Corbyn, to me, represents the worst of the Labour Party and until they get rid of him, im not voting labour

Scandelicious · 30/05/2017 13:48

If you act upon your anti Semitism e.g. discriminate, incite then it's a crime. Simply holding anti Semitic views, tolerating it in your party and having convicted anti semites and holocaust deniers as your mates is not illegal.

Radishal · 30/05/2017 13:50

Expressions of antisemitism are a hate crime and are illegal . And yet it is indulged by JC.
Look at the report launch event.
Some twat going on about Jewish control of the media which everyone knows is typical antisemitism with a foul history of being trotted out every time someone attacks Jews. JC did nothing and let this ranter go on.

Beachcomber · 30/05/2017 13:56

His speech on the Chakrabarti report sounds anything but antisemitic:

“The Labour Party is built on the values of solidarity, social justice, equality, internationalism and human rights. That is why I have devoted my life to it, and why nine months ago, I was honoured to be elected leader by over a quarter of a million people. That is, by the way, substantially more than the entire electorate that will have the right to pick the Conservative Prime Minister this Autumn.

“After the tumultuous events of the past week in Britain, including the vote in last week’s referendum to leave the European Union, the need for us to unite around these values, to practice what we preach, and be judged by the highest of standards, is perhaps as great as it has ever been.

“So although I asked Shami Chakrabarti to carry out her inquiry after some disturbing and damaging incidents earlier this year, I believe that its findings and recommendations are of even more importance for our party, country and wider world today.

“Whatever your views on the outcome of the referendum campaign – and two thirds of Labour supporters voted Remain – we need to reflect for a few moments on some of the hateful language used by some of the most prominent participants in it.

“Boris Johnson, current favourite to lead the Tory party, compared Hitler’s murderous tyranny with the European project created from its ashes and questioned Barack Obama’s motives because of his “part-Kenyan heritage”.

“That was no dog whistle. That was a fog horn - a classic racist trope – casting doubt on someone’s motivation because of their race.

“The Justice Secretary Michael Gove compared pro-Remain economists to Nazi collaborators, a startling example of the way in which the Nazi regime and the Holocaust can be minimized, trivialized or even forgotten by ill-judged comparisons.

“And Nigel Farage warned of mass sex attacks should the Remain Campaign win, calling it the “nuclear bomb” of the Brexit campaign. Is it only me who just doesn’t find him funny any more?

“These are hateful comments - no question. They are unworthy of the millions who voted to Leave, not out of xenophobia or racism, but often as a desperate response - yes to austerity, but also to years of being ignored and left behind by the Westminster elite.

“The people of Britain - and especially the young - need a strong, united, principled and kind Labour Party more than ever. They didn’t crash the banks, heat up the planet or start the wars of the past decade or so. But the risk is that they will have to work harder for longer, quite possibly for less pay, because of what the powerful have done in their name.

“Divide and rule is the oldest trick in the book - whether used by imperial powers abroad or hate-mongers at home. Turn people against each other. Use race or religion or anything else you can find and hope they will be too distracted or consumed to take on the great inequalities of wealth and power in the world.

“For over a hundred years, the Labour Party of Keir Hardie, Ellen Wilkinson and Manny Shinwell has existed to offer working people another way: solidarity instead of division, equality instead of injustice, inclusion instead of isolation, internationalism instead of narrow nationalism, and human rights for all.

“But we cannot do our duty, if we do not look at ourselves as well. Say what you like about me, but I’m no hypocrite. When I look in the mirror, it is less for sartorial elegance than to examine what’s in my own eye before pointing out the specks in others. I urge others in politics to do the same.

“This is why I asked Shami Chakrabarti and her colleagues to take on the vital work of looking into our own Party before we criticise others. That is what she and her team have done.

“And I’m here today to launch and recommend their work to our Party and to put my weight behind its immediate implementation.

“Under my leadership, the Labour Party will not allow hateful language or debate, in person, online or anywhere else. We will aim to set the gold standard, not just for anti-racism, but for a genuinely welcoming environment for all communities and for the right to disagreement as well.

“Racism is racism is racism. There is no hierarchy - no acceptable form of it. I have always fought it in all its forms and I always will. But while we respond to hate with universal principles we must also remember people’s particular experience, if we are too ensure that not one person feels vulnerable or excluded from their natural political home.

“The Jewish community has made an enormous contribution to our Party and our country – Jewish people have been at the heart of progressive and radical politics in Britain, as elsewhere, for well over a century.

“But they are also a minority amongst minorities and have had good cause to feel vulnerable and even threatened throughout history. This should never happen by accident or design in our Labour Party. Modern antisemitism may not always be about overt violence and persecution, though there is too much of that even to this day. We must also be vigilant against subtler and invidious manifestations of this nasty ancient hatred and avoid slipping into its traps by accident or intent.

“For the avoidance of doubt, I do not believe in name calling and I never have. “Zio” is a vile epithet that follows in a long line of earlier such terms that have no place in our Party. Nor should anyone indulge in the kind of stereotyping that can cause such hurt and harm.

“To assume that a Jewish friend or fellow member is wealthy, part of some kind of financial or media conspiracy, or takes a particular position on politics in general, or on Israel and Palestine in particular, is just wrong.

“Our Jewish friends are no more responsible for the actions of Israel or the Netanyahu Government than our Muslim friends are for those of various self-styled Islamic states or organisations. Nor should Muslims be regarded as sexist, antisemitic or otherwise suspect, as has become an ugly Islamophobic norm. We judge people on their individual values and actions, not en masse.

“No one should be expected either to condemn or defend the actions of foreign powers on account of their faith or race. At the same time, we should have the sensitivity to understand how upset many Labour party members and supporters are likely to feel about various human rights abuses around the world.

“Human rights language is so much more accurate and persuasive than the kind of language that was often resorted to in the Brexit debate. That is no doubt acceptable in other places and other parties, but it shouldn’t be here, on my watch, or in our name.

“I will continue - as Labour Leader - to pursue the causes of peace and justice in Israel-Palestine, the wider Middle East and all over the world. But those who claim to do so with hateful or inflammatory language do no service to anyone, especially dispossessed and oppressed people in need of better advocacy.

“Of course we as Labour Party members must all be free to criticise and oppose injustice and abuse wherever we find it. But as today’s Report recommends, can we please leave Hitler and Nazi metaphors alone (especially in the context of Israel). Why? Because the Shoah is still in people’s family experience. If every human rights atrocity is described as a Holocaust, Hitler’s attempted obliteration of the Jewish people is diminished or de-recognised in our history. Other human rights atrocities from African slavery to the killing fields of Cambodia, the Armenian and Rwandan Genocides are all of course to be remembered, but diluting their particularity or comparing degrees of evil does no good.

“Pursuing a more civil discourse does not in any way mean stifling free speech. I for one, will continue to meet, discuss and debate with all-comers in the cause of peace, progress, justice and human rights around the world. Though I acknowledge the need for the Party’s Leader to spread his or her time around a greater range of issues, I do not believe that anyone should be judged for the platforms they share or the human rights causes they take up, as long as they fight hate with every breath.

“And to those who have been afraid of so-called “witch-hunts” by the press in recent months, those who perhaps worry that debate and speech around difficult and important issues risks being shut down in our Party: I commend and endorse the Report’s recommendations about improving natural justice, transparency, consistency and accountability in the conduct of Party discipline.

“But not being racist and not being hateful is not enough for our Party to be the inclusive and vibrant political movement that Britain so sorely needs. If we are to unite and lead our country we must be the most welcoming and empowering place in which our diverse communities can prosper.

“I am very concerned about the Report’s findings on how too many black and minority ethnic members of our party have felt for too long. We must act against long term “special measures” placing local parties under limited democracy. I will also take action with colleagues to seek to improve the representation of black and minority people at every level of staffing and leadership within the Labour Party.

“We will work with our Trade Union affiliates and others to achieve the best programme of activist and leadership education possible. We will talk, read, learn and organise together. We will learn from each other’s personal experiences but also share each other’s considerable campaigning and political skills.

“The last year - with all of its highs and lows - has left me with every confidence that Labour is has the potential to be a powerful and transformatory movement, capable of winning the next General Election (whenever it comes), and many more elections after that.

“But my confidence and optimism are not naive. We all know that despite the overwhelming mandate I was given by Labour party members and supporters last year - we’ve all had a torrid few days.

“Whatever now takes place in our party, politics should be conducted in a decent manner. When I stood for the leadership last summer I called for a kinder, gentler politics, that’s still work in progress.

“Some people may equate “leadership” with nastiness. I disagree. Decency is no disqualification for leadership – in fact it should be a pre-requisite.

“Those loyal to my leadership, and to Labour’s core values, want to pursue the new politics with decency and civility, and see strength and not weakness in living those values.

“I ask Labour people to do as I do. To be kind and respectful to each other and our neighbours, and to be as courteous as we are courageous with our opponents.

“I believe that approach to be closer to the values of the British people than so much of what they have witnessed on the political stage over many recent years.

“I want to express huge thanks to Shami Chakrabarti, David Feldman and Jan Royall, as well as to Deok Joo Rhee and Godric Jolliffe – and all who submitted their views and took part in this comprehensive exercise.

“Britain deserves better - so let’s offer it. Come together as a party and then unite and lead our country through these incredibly challenging times. “

Radishal · 30/05/2017 13:58

Lovely speech. So why didn't he stop that twat?

Puzzledandpissedoff · 30/05/2017 14:18

It was an interesting speech, Beachcomber, but I'm afraid it was just words

When his actions consistently match them, I'll revisit my views about Labour and antisemitism

Radishal · 30/05/2017 14:18

Yep. Some people are ok with it or think it is being overstated. I'm not one of them.

Scandelicious · 30/05/2017 14:23

Some muslims supported trump

Radishal · 30/05/2017 14:45

In answer to the OP - listen to today's Woman's Hour. JC doesn't need "media smears " to screw everything up. He does it himself.

samG76 · 30/05/2017 16:27

The comparison between Jews/Israel and Muslims/ISIS is a bit of a shocker. Jews in the UK could and a great majority do feel solidarity with the Israelis, even if they don't support all Israeli actions. Loads of Israeli youth groups go to Israel every summer.

By contrast, travelling to ISIS controlled territory is (I think ) illegal. There are very few Muslims who think that pushing gays off high buildings is okay but forced enslavement of 9 year old girls is a bit over the top....

Charmageddon · 30/05/2017 17:52

Just listened to his patronising car crash on women's hour.

Reminded yet again why I don't like him...

Scandelicious · 30/05/2017 18:27

He said that, Sam? Shock

Justanotherlurker · 30/05/2017 18:59

Another thread of "why the hate for JC".

The media are after him

Unfortunately it's part of the job, and Labour have historically had it harder in the press

So surely he is a threat or the tabloids wdnt bother . But we can't believe what the machines of the popular press tell us to ???

LOL, nope he isn't a threat, he may shake some of the champagne socialists a bit, but it's the tabloids doing there thing, they aren't as much of an influence as others like to make out. If you worry about it share more canary articles.

I'm curious why he appears unpopular ?

Have you been living in a cave?
Many reasons, the fact he is economically illiterate for the globalised world we are in, his friends such as Hezbollah, his insistence on giving the Falklands back even though they want to remain British, his IRA links (no he wasn't involved in the peace process at all), the "Russia does nothing wrong" seamus milne, John McDonnell

He appears principled to me . ...
Principled to most JC supporters is a very loose term

20nil · 30/05/2017 19:13

Dislike and mistrust him for many of the above reasons, but I still think he's the best on offer. Working people, health, education, human rights and the environment have always done better under Labour governments so I'll vote Labour. Dislike DA and JMc intensely, but no more than I despise Hunt, Fallon and Bono. I'm also canvassing and am finding a lot of support for JC on the doorsteps. Much more than I expected to.

Justanotherlurker · 30/05/2017 19:26

Working people, health, education, human rights and the environment have always done better under Labour governments so I'll vote Labour

Why do people say this when it has been conservatives in power a lot more?

Human rights?? I am really struggling to see this one

AllThePrettySeahorses · 30/05/2017 19:43

I really, really dislike Corbyn for all of the reasons above and that revolting photo of him doing the rounds at an IRA funeral made me shudder, plus he needs to call his vile little rabble off Emma Barnett (but I reckon he loves it).

However, I have a couple of more trivial reasons to dislike him:

He always makes me think he smells musty and has coffee breath.

I hate the the way he's always surrounded by pretty young girls. I think it's weird.

AllThePrettySeahorses · 30/05/2017 19:45

Oh - I do have more.

I hate the way he snorts and waits for applause when he thinks he's made a good point. I can't stand his smug face when his shills are whipping up the crowd to clap him.

EnthusiasmIsDisturbed · 30/05/2017 19:50

i can't stand how condescending he is to the working class - I know what is better for you and it's not what I have had

Maybe I can actually make that decision for myself thank you

Angry
Charmageddon · 30/05/2017 21:58

Another reason....

Not just outrageously patronising to women, but also to BAME people too:

order-order.com/2017/05/30/corbyns-spectacular-ethnic-minority-gaffe/

Puzzledandpissedoff · 30/05/2017 22:43

Love that link, Charm ... looking at the comments, it's really not going down very well is it? Grin

"You do not speak for us, you patronising totalitarian git"

I couldn't have put it better myself ...

Charmageddon · 30/05/2017 22:53

I loved the tweets from Sajid Javid etc puzzled! Grin

BMW6 · 30/05/2017 23:14

Totalitarian

Yes, that's the word that sums up why I will not vote Labour while Momentum and McCluskey are pulling the strings of their puppet leader.

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