"UK home to 23,000 Jihadis"

[user666999]

This is the title from a Times article today. Bloody hell. This is a shockingly high number. I find this really scary. There really needs to be some major plan rather than just more waffle from this useless Government. I just don't see how this genie can be put back in the bottle and I think things will only get worse.

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/huge-scale-of-terror-threat-revealed-uk-home-to-23-000-jihadists-3zvn58mhq

I guess I think you guys sound incredibly naive. The situation in Rotherham was inextricably tied to religion and cultural differences and it's still going on.

It's easier to turn the other way, though.

By the way, I also come from a relatively diverse place but in the last decade, similar problems have cropped up. I want to discuss those issues and not pretend all is ok.

It really isn't ok. It really isn't.

Massively! Right across Europe.

It really isn't ok. It really isn't

There's lots of issues in our society. Some people seem to be only focussed on Muslims and Islam.

For some reason.

@Charlieismydarlin you are naive if you think this is only a 'muslim' issue. It's not. It's a man issue. It also has a lot more to do with social culture than religious culture.

And look at the UK 50 years ago.

Look how far we've come on LGBT issues, equality...

Can I just say, there is a report button to report racist or offensive comments.

I am finding the constant comments accusing pp of being a coordinated campaign very tiresome.

If you can't imagine why a lot of MN posters are interested in discussing this issue at the moment, you need to have a word with yourself.

Last night it was accusations of sockpuppetry, now its shills. Why not argue with what people are saying, report if outside guidelines, rather than just trying to find ways to discredit people whose views you disagree with?

And yet we still have a massive issue with male violence, sexual assault, inequalities etc.

crossword

But you aren't discussing. You're just saying something must be done.

What do you think needs to be done with those 23,000?

So a Muslim terrorist, less than a week ago, deliberately targeted & killed young teenage girls & we're supposed to focus on something else?

Like what exactly?
The Vikings?
The Romans?

You couldn't make this up could you.

The uk has been very tolerant, however events over the last few years and particularly over the last week indicate that our tolerance has not been seen as an example to follow. The country has allowed different faiths to worship and have their identity and sadly it has been one faith that has abused this and resulted in contempt for the uk way of life.

surferjet

That was a comment about culture. Our culture has changed over the years.

Do you think people born in the UK to Muslim immigrants are as much a part of UK culture and BELONG here as much as people whose parents and grandparents were born in the UK?

By the way, I also come from a relatively diverse place but in the last decade, similar problems have cropped up. I want to discuss those issues and not pretend all is ok.

That may well be the case, but please don't assume that your area is representative of the rest of the UK. I'm not being naive when I say that multiculturalism is working where I live. It does work here. If there are places where it isn't working, then we need to look at the reasons for that, but it simply isn't true to say that Muslims all over the country are failing to integrate. They can and do.

Ok I'm pulling at straws here but I think maybe there needs to be some kind of large monetary incentive for family/friends/community members to report people they have concerns about and if anything is discovered then they will be rewarded generously. As Salman Abedi was thought to be a huge concern by many people around him before Monday.

He was as much a Muslim as the IRA bombers were Catholic. It's one of the reasons I get emotional on these threads. It's the thought that perhaps 25 years ago these people would be calling for me not to have been able to attend concerts as I had red hair and an Irish sounding nickname. In fact Irish people and people of Irish extraction did face such attitudes. It wasn't acceptable then and it isn't now. His mother and his mosque reported him. Muslims have marched against this. This isn't about Islam. It's about angry disenfranchised young people brainwashed by a death cult. ISIS have killed more Muslims than any other religious group.

I am discussing. I don't know what needs to be done with the 23,000. I am not HS, neither am I an expert on counter-terrorism or counter-extremism. I would hazard a guess that increasing the resources of the security forces would help and possibly lowering the threshold for taking police/legal action against suspects. But I think possibly more important is acknowledging the source of this ideology and how it is being spread in this country (which from what I have read seems to be often from Saudi funding of Wahabism doctrine through some mosques) and taking action to stop the spread of these ideas.

And I have reported and will continue to do so

The country has allowed different faiths to worship and have their identity and sadly it has been one faith that has abused this and resulted in contempt for the uk way of life

Is that Christianity who still aren't very keen on women in major roles and on the LGBT community and gay marriage?

I wonder what Judaism has to say about the LGBT community and female equality?

Just, community members did report concerns about Abedi to the authorities. No financial incentives were required.

The difficulty is what we do about such concerns when they are reported, especially when no crimes have yet been committed.

@Justdontgetitatall - they did report him. Without any other incentive than it was right to do so.

He was as much a Muslim as the IRA bombers were Catholic

The Manchester bomber was a Muslim. The IRA bombers were Catholics. Neither represent the religion or the other members of that faith.

The country has allowed different faiths to worship and have their identity and sadly it has been one faith that has abused this and resulted in contempt for the uk way of life

I guess you haven't seen all the positive news stories about Muslims because the UK media is very good at feeding negative stories.

For some reason

Neither represent the religion or the other members of that faith

Maybe you should tell that to some people on here.

Look how far we've come on LGBT issues, equality...

Absolutely. This is sort of thing ISIS and Islamist extremists want to destroy.

@Orlantina it depends on the group of Christians or Jews. Many Jewish communities are forward thinking on the role of women in the community (female rabbis not unusual). However, the Orthodox community would probably be considered extremists and are certainly not interested in integration. The CofE is interesting in that it was the laity not the clergy that held up the discussion of female bishops (I find this fascinating as an outsider). The Kirk in Scotland is surprisingly up to date on things like that despite being 'behind' on things like Sunday trading. Catholicism is hamstrung by the doctrine of papal infallibility. Change will come (and a change in language about LGBT has already occurred). It will, however, be glacial in pace.
As for banning Muslim names from public events what would we then do about: Zayn Malik, Yusuf Islam or Mo Farah?

We are talking about the hear and now not the historical aspects, the county is under threat of terrorism and that is the issue that needs to be dealt with.