to ask how most of our mothers coped?

[ItalianScallion]

I was born in the 70's. My mother was a SAHM and there were three of us kids. My father worked night shifts.

The youngest of us was born when I was four and the oldest was 7. My mother got us up, took us to school, took us to after school activities and sports whilst maintaining a ridiculously clean home, and doing all the laundry etc with no help or family support.

My DH has a similar upbringing except his mother and father were living abroad and travelled to several different countries to live because of the nature of FIL's work. My MIL worked nights and so they would literally hand over the kids to each other as one came home and the other went to work.

I feel that we were all raised pretty decently and I have a huge amount of respect for my parents and PIL.

Which brings me to my AIBU to think that we are getting softer? My mother and MIL shake their heads in disbelief when they hear of mothers who SAHM, have a nanny/au pair and a weekly cleaner and still talk about how they're not coping.

Don't get me wrong, parenting is a hard job but it seems that popular parenting ideas and methods are allowing us to make rods for our own backs.

Please understand I'm not referring to women with PND or any MH issues. This is MN so I know I'll be flamed by people with their anecdotes of difficult babies and their specific struggles, and I agree that there will always be exceptions to the rule. Still, I can't help but feel that we don't 'just get on with it' the way our mothers did.

I don't really get it either,
I had 3 children under 5 at one point, Dh worked 8-4.30, I worked
5-10pm 4 nights.
I did all the school runs, house work, cooking, after school clubs swimming lessons etc, we just got on with it , the kids were well looked after, the house always clean and tidy.
My mum had 2 children, she was a sahm for part of it then returned to office work when we were at school, I don't think either of us had it any different
Neither of us had any help from relatives or paid help

Clumsy duck it was far harder being a single mother in the 70s, at least in some sections of society. Council housing was for married couples; benefits wouldn't support a single parent family in their own home; the stigma and embarrassment to the family was palpable. It was even harder previously. My aunt was deserted by her DH in the 40s, she not only looked after two children, they had to live with her ailing mother in a small flat. She also had a cleaning job. Her life was hard by any standards,

DD was a single mum for a time; she had a home, a job, and although it was hard financially she managed. Tax credits helped with childcare, and no one looked down their noses at her for not having a husband.

I was a mum in the 70s, I worked full time from my DC being quite young. Neither DH or I earned great money, but jointly we had a reasonable standard of living. I worked so that DC didn't live on the sort of estate DH spent his childhood on! We had jobs, DC have careers. They have larger houses, each has a car (I couldn't drive when they were small), lovely holidays. They work hard, but appreciate what they have.

I was born in the 60's. My mom was back at work when I was 4 months old because she was the only earner. We lived in a rental house & my dad was a law student. 10 yrs earlier my mom was nicking oranges off local trees because she had no money to feed herself & two children. They worked very hard for anything they had. Always had a housekeeper or cleaner since I was born, though. I did inherit some money from my mom, have had most things a lot easier.

Their "me time" meant hiding behind the newspaper all weekend & they went out loads in evenings.

A trainee HV I know was saying recently that the difference in needs in different areas is quite stark. More PND and MH issues in the more affluent areas. This is anecdotal of course. I think our expectations of life have changed. I probably derived a lot of self-worth from my job and was used to being mentally busy and having a degree of control over what was going on in my life. Maternity leave was a shock to the system, big time.

But what I'm mainly getting from it is that bandeausally is a massive twat.

That's nice, do you want to report you own post or will you leave that for others to do for you?

Again, I want to thank everyone who has taken the time to share a story. It's very interesting reading, regardless of whether you agreed or disagreed.

Some very valid points raised about parenting styles, and how children were left to it, or expected to chip in a lot more back then. We were certainly no strangers to the hoover by age seven. Playing out in the street was the norm, which is not now.

Parenting has definitely changed and is much more time consuming by most accounts. A few PP mentioned that men are expected to be more hands on now but their increase in involvement is quite possibly proportionate to the increase in women's involvement. It seems that the biggest shift has been for women, who are expected to be everything!

Thanks for the book recommendation, I can't remember the posters name. I'm going to seek it out.

for everyone really, but especially those who are doing it hard or did it hard.

My mum had 2 under 5 lived in a tiny village, worked part time, my dad was a copper so worked strange hours, no family near at all. Limited playgroups, a dog, chickens to take care of and a huge garden, washer was a twin tub, she didn't drive and even if she had my dad needed the car mostly.

I have one, DH works shifts early in the morning so I get up with him at 4.30am, I then start work so I can get things done early, cover off some housework and meal planning. I then homeschool DS, this includes one outside activity most days, I work and bid on further work in between, cook, tea, have baths, and fall into bed and it all begins again. I also have a vegetable garden and the cat to sort. I rarely get time off and I don't drive either. I do however have an automatic washer.

I think I'm kind of just repeating my mum's experience with the addition of a few mod cons.

My Mother always worked and was a manager in her field in charge of around 50 people by the time I was a teenager. When young she had been a professional dancer, model and actor. She also fitted in four husbands and six children. She left Them when they didn't meet her standards though she was widowed once. She always mananged to remarry easily and consider this is the sixties and seventies and divorce was less common.

The one thing she had apart from being exceptionally clever was she was a great beauty and she has a magnetic and charming personality. To be honest having read up on psychopathy I do wonder if she has strong traits.

Her home was spotless but there were very strict routines and we were helping from an incredibly young age. She maintained a size 8 figure and was incredibly evil about any woman who was overweight.

She is now 90 and her body is knackered but she has every faculty. I must admit she is not by any standards a regular person and always had an energy that seemed superhuman.

I would describe her as an incredibly beautiful moth who people were drawn to but many burnt their wings.

I think to those of us who brought up our children in the age of all day kids' tv and dvds the idea of not having that easy soporific of hand is un-thinkable, but you can't miss what you've never had. Parents pushing their prams to the end of the garden was the equivalent of parking their LO in front of CBeebies today. Not making a judgement on either of those things, just saying you do what you need to do. I look round cafes and restaurants today at toddlers glued to smartphones and iPads and wonder those parents would manage without them - the truth is they would because I did, just had to carry bags of crayons and small games to play at the table with me. Of course it was easier for my mum's generation because people didn't eat out so much with kids in those days so the need didn't arise. I wonder what new technology will make things easier for our children parenting their children? I think looking at those things is a bit misleading - what really makes a difference to parents lives is how easy it is to spend as much time with their children as they would like. If both are having to work full-time to cover the bills so they only see their kids to put them to bed at night and get them up at the crack of dawn to take them to the child minder then that is not having it easier - no matter how much help they have, paid for or otherwise.

They were different days.

Clothes got washed much, much less than they do today.

We had much fewer items than people do today. Much less clutter. Much less to tidy away.

Oh yea I totally agree regarding being a single mum in the 70s I think I worded it poorly . I mean for mums who were married or had partners it was perfectly acceptable to not work and you could live off one income ( not just one massive income like it seems to be today ) so these days if you don't work and your dp is on an average wage you need to claim top up benefits just to have the same lifestyle as say 30 years back and there is pressure to get to work and contribute

The single parent thing I meant how it's seems much easier ( thankfully ) now for either party to walk away from the relationship as there is much less stigma to divorce / being a single parent and so that leaves women who previously were sahm in a marriage now on there own having to claim benefits while having this pressure that they should work and they are a "scrounger " ( again, this is not my opinion )

Of course I could be talking shite and divorce / single parent rates could be exactly the same as in the 1970s it's just how it appears to be to me

My mum had 4 children under 5 with no parental support (parents dead, in laws lived miles away). She was a SAHM while dad went to work. She did not cope very well at all! She's 70 now and she still talks about how hard it was when we were children and how difficult she found it. I remember as a child seeing her break down lots of times and feeling helpless. Conversely, I know lots of mums now who seem to manage very well, with no parental help, and don't complain about it being hard. I think it depends on the children (we were high energy kids and my brother had mild behavioural problems).

I agree with fruitboxjury. As soon as I get down time, I end up filling it with Netflix, Social media etc - despite my resolutions not to. When my mum came to stay for first few weeks after DS born, the whole day was dedicated to housework & tending to baby. It felt enjoyable because there was no pressure to fit technology in on top of everything else. I keep telling myself I'm going to have a day off the Internet- but i find it impossible!

My mum worked constantly. She had a job 9-3 so she could do school pick up/ drop off. Then she'd come home, do 2 hours housework every night and cook dinner, followed by ironing. We didn't have a washing machine until I was 16, before that she handwashed everything or boil washed it in our v v old twin tub which at the time (1980s) was about 20 years old.

She was on the go all the time. She did another 4-5 hours cleaning and laundry on Sat, and ironed every evening. None of my friends mums worked as hard as her. I don't have anywhere near her energy, and I can't imagine standing up for an hour every day doing the washing.

I wish she hadn't died when I was 21, as she never got to enjoy an easier life :(

My mother didn't have a cleaner beyond our toddlerhood but she didn't hesitate to stick us on the bus to school and back from a young age. She didn't ferry us round to EC activities. In fact, she didn't think she ought to entertain us much and we were very much left to be bored while she renovated her house.

80s child here.

Life wasn't so different back then if I compare my childhood to my own DC's TBH except the technology we use to entertain ourselves is different. My brother and I played endless games of Jet Set Willy (on a tape!) instead of having tablet, and we watched videos instead of Netflix.

There were significantly lower expectations of what constituted dinner which made it easier too. Pizza and chips was a frequent feature.

It was less socially normal to be in a single parent family tho, and my mum had a bit of a chip on her shoulder about it which wasn't easy at all at times.

I actually think my Mum had it easier than me! I do the same as her but with one exrra child and I work. She also just used to let me go out and play in the woods with friends from about 5 whereas I have to take mine to the park.

MIL worked part time as a teacher and also had a full time nanny/housekeeper. She says she doesn't know how I manage to do the housework and look after 2 pre schoolers!
My mum was a SAHM and had family nearby. All her friends were SAHM's too.
I'm a SAHM and lucky enough that we can afford for me to do so. We can't afford cleaners/gardeners/nannies (well we could afford a cleaner if we prioritised that over other things, but we don't). We don't live near any family and I've worked hard to make some local friends although it's been tough. DH works away at least 3 nights a week.I don't know any SAHMs with nannies/gardeners etc, they all do the the vast majority themselves. I must move in different circles to you.
MIL keeps telling me to go back to work so we can pay someone else to do everything for us!

I agree - life was much simpler then with lower expectations. I am one of two and have three step-siblings. I don't actually know how my parents managed to parent five at a time, which they had to do EOW and for two weeks each summer - it must have been hideous!

However, if we went swimming we all went and the dads took us (neither my DM or DSM can swim), we had bikes, we had a big garden with a climbing frame, swing, den (we lived in the country), and we didn't tend to have many days out.

Holidays were SC, everyone piled into the car and off we went.

We didn't go to theme parks and we didn't have big birthday parties - it was six friends round the kitchen table and pass the parcel, etc.

Neither my DM or DSM worked so yes, home was clean and tidy and all the washing was done, but:

The dads worked MUCH more reasonable hours than my DH works, there were no business trips or DHs away overnight, and they were home by 7pm, at the latest.

And they had family nearby. My GPs were all within 25 miles, as were aunts and uncles. They had us for the day, or to stay for a couple of nights on a regular basis. My DSM dropped my step-brothers with her DM all the time - literally several times a week.

My DM shakes her head in incomprehension at how hard we make life for ourselves these days, and of course we have no local support. My family at 100 miles away and my ILs are 3,000 miles away.

Interesting thread.

I think we are very child centred these days. My mum is too kind to say it out loud but I know she quietly thinks it's bonkers that we take kids to baby sensory, baby massage, baby yoga, baby signing, baby mandarin etc etc from weeks old. She was a SAHM in the 1980s and she used to take me to toddler groups but that was mostly so I could run round and burn off some energy while she had a coffee. As a baby I think I was mostly in the pram or bouncer while she got on with housework.

I think nothing of it if another mum tells me she has to take her eight month old DC out in a sling or pram every time they need a nap as it's all that works, that seems totally normal as so many people seem to be in that situation. People do sleep train but often not until the parents are at breaking point and even then it's through 'gentle' methods, whereas my mum openly admits that from a few months old she would leave me to cry at night. That was usual practice and not frowned upon. As a PP said, beans on toast or fish fingers and angel delight was totally normal for tea, now people know so much about nutrition and are expected to put so much effort into it.

There were significantly lower expectations of what constituted dinner which made it easier too. This is so true Was smiling at the reference further down to fish fingers and chips and Angel Delight being an acceptable meal to serve to friends' kids - no Mumsnet back then for parents to post on demanding to know whether this was reasonable or not.

My mother used to complain a lot about how much (domestic) work she had to do. She shut up pretty fast when DSis and I had our DC and she realised how very much harder we worked without complaining!

Also born in the 70s.

Both my parents worked and had full time nannies until my youngest sister was 7 and at a private school with very long days, they also had a cleaner who came every day, gardener weekly and as hoc handyman (they still have the last 3 as pensioners, on hefty pensions people doing their jobs now won't get the equal of - my mum retired at 55, as soon as her last child left home...)

People with the same jobs these days can't afford to employ one full time and three part time staff - it's not easier for everyone these days!