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AIBU?

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Original poster

To consider the Conservatives' manifesto pretty decent on the whole?

909 replies

Puzzledandpissedoff · 18/05/2017 15:45

Pretty decent in terms in principles, that is ... as so often with manifestos it's too thin on costings

Main points here: www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2017-39960311

Full version here: www.conservatives.com/manifesto

OP posts:
PigletWasPoohsFriend · 22/05/2017 18:52

The problem is that she does not say what the cap will be I agree. The problem is neither do Labour with theirs so if they try using that attack line it will come straight back at them.

JanetBrown2015 · 22/05/2017 18:57

Also I doubt councils are too keen on these deferred payment deals. Say Mr X is 20 years older than his wife (very common) and dies aged 75 after a lot of local authority care. His wife dies 40 years later - that is a long period to defer the charge over his half of the house over the £100k but subject to the cap. The local authority has to pay carers' wages in the meantime.

Two4One2017 · 22/05/2017 19:56

Corbyn doesn't look like an extremist! Fucking hell

^
The way I think this will play out is that Corbynites don't care, they love Jezza whatever he says or does. The young will vote for him because of tuition fees and they have no idea who the IRA and Hamas are

The old remember the IRA bombing campaign on the mainland and how Jezza invited Gerry Adams and McGuinness into the House of Parliament after a thwarted attack in London aswell as how he attended funerals of IRA bombers (but not soldiers or civilians) - from the mouths of elderly voters on the doorstep.

It's all in the eye of the beholder......

Arborea · 22/05/2017 19:59

Janet makes a very good point about the likely timescale for a council to get its money back from a deferred payment scheme, which is why I'm inclined to believe the rumours that the Government has asked Big Business to create a special (unregulated?) equity release product so that the finance industry can make a killing benefit from financing care.

It's only not a U turn olliegarchy because a cap is going to be consulted on now. That definitely doesn't mean we're going to have a cap, and it was frankly dishonest of May to pretend that the manifesto was misunderstood.

I'm still undecided about who I'm voting for btw, am not a Corbyn apologist trying to make political capital for him!

kirinm · 22/05/2017 20:26

Two4one I'm not a Corbynite or particularly young at 39. But he doesn't look like an extremist and it's a frankly ridiculous thing to say.

citroenpresse · 22/05/2017 20:28

I find it really curious why the IRA thing resonates so much. Gerry Adams was a democratically elected MP to the British parliament for over 20 years (but abstained) so not sure why he'd need an invitation from Corbyn. The IRA renounced terrorism. The Good Friday Agreement happened. The Queen shook McGuinnes's hand. Is he a threat because of his political views 30 or 40 years ago? Thatcher and Pinochet? Thatcher Jnr and dodgy arms deals? Paul Dacre and the Daily Mail? The EU? What are your favourite most dangerous enemies? Corbyn's life is out there. We should be much more worried about the influences we can't see.

PigletWasPoohsFriend · 22/05/2017 20:33

I find it really curious why the IRA thing resonates so much.

My friend lost her DM in one IRA bombing and then received life changing injuries herself in another.

Gerry Adams was a democratically elected MP to the British parliament for over 20 years (but abstained) so not sure why he'd need an invitation from Corbyn

It was way before that. He was invited by Corbyn and attended a few weeks after the Brighton bombings. MPs lost friends and colleagues in that bombing and had MPs had family members who received life changing injuries.

Sostenueto · 22/05/2017 20:39

To be fair the cap should be set at a percentage of your assets, the same for all who have to pay. The figure will be different for each person because each persons assets will be different but they will be paying the exact percentage as everyone else. To me it sounds fair but I bet some will moan at that.

Two4One2017 · 22/05/2017 20:42

But he doesn't look like an extremist and it's a frankly ridiculous thing to say.

What does an extremist look like?

I'm just telling you what people have said - older voters are a bit more circumspect about the IRA links and more sceptical that he (and McDonnell) are these wonderful peacemaker.

I did not call him an extremist, just quoted someone else, hence it being in bold

citroenpresse · 22/05/2017 20:42

Gerry Adams became an MP (and leader of Sinn Féin) in 1983; the Brighton Bombings were the next year.

Sostenueto · 22/05/2017 20:43

I believe Royal London was approached about advice on insurance for social care. It's only what I heard so not reliable. However, being as the breakfast scheme was piloted in Blackpool 3 months ago I tend to believe it.

PigletWasPoohsFriend · 22/05/2017 20:47

Gerry Adams became an MP (and leader of Sinn Féin) in 1983; the Brighton Bombings were the next year.

Still a massive lapse in judgement of I was being generous. They chose not to take their seats then turn up then? How would you feel if you were Michael Hessletine for example?

Charmageddon · 22/05/2017 20:47

But he doesn't look like an extremist and it's a frankly ridiculous thing to say.

What does an extremist look like then?

Do they wear a sandwich board or similar?

citroenpresse · 22/05/2017 20:48

I'm an older voter. And I'm circumspect about the IRA links but I can also remember the political tempo of those times and that was then and this is now. He's an old leftie, but the alternative (a Tory landslide) is far, far worse.

PigletWasPoohsFriend · 22/05/2017 20:51

I'm an older voter. And I'm circumspect about the IRA links but I can also remember the political tempo of those times and that was then and this is now.

I am also an older voter and through personal experience as you can imagine I am entitled to my views as are you. Smile

I am not alone in my views and there are many that won't vote Labour while he leads.

JanetBrown2015 · 22/05/2017 20:52

I think we should seek discussions even with enemies. I have no problems with Corbyn's past conduct on any of these matters (although I am a Tory).

Most people don't need end of life care so they would be a bit silly to buy insruance products to cover it as a possibility. Better to take the risk you don't and then at the time either have your family do the caring or your spouse or else pay out of your savings ( you may well die before they run out) rather than take these risks with charges of the house to the local council or buying expensive probably mis-sold insurance products.

Sostenueto · 22/05/2017 20:59

People with a lot of assets will try to avoid paying by finding ways and means to take the house out of the equation. They do it now by finding loopholes when people go into residential care.

citroenpresse · 22/05/2017 21:07

What's that about Heseltine Piglet or do you mean another thing from 30 years ago and Gibraltar? Aren't his views on Brexit and the financial crisis caused by Brexit (which May seems to be denying) a little more relevant now? Goodness, reasons to find Corbyn "extremist", really digging deep here! Could we try something a bit more 21st century like fracking or environment policy or cyber crime or globalisation?

Sostenueto · 22/05/2017 21:11

As you quite rightly said (and I said before that) Janet you do not know what your costs might be. The councils will be unable to wait for their money for the care they will have to provide. The caring agencies who will do the care definitely won't wait for you to die to get their money. It is totally unworkable and impractical to expect them to wait for the money because May will not put in the amount of funds to do it. There are not enough trained carers anyway. Who wants to do a job where you.get.minimum wage and zero contracts? No sick pay and.minimum holudays.? Forced to work every other weekend and bank holidays including Xmas day? There won't be many takers.

Sostenueto · 22/05/2017 21:14

Well said Citroen!

Sostenueto · 22/05/2017 21:16

The ONLY big policy of the Tory manifesto is already a gigantic balls up. People .moan JC trying to do too much. May can't do one thing right lol!

citroenpresse · 22/05/2017 21:20

I've just remembered that May sacked Hezza over Brexit (or was it for saying she was doing a man-sized job?). Totally forgot that. A political lion in winter, according to the Guardian. No U turns for him!

PigletWasPoohsFriend · 22/05/2017 21:29

Sorry I meant Tebbit not Hessltine.

Up to the eyeballs with drugs currently. So will sign off in a bit.

Goodness, reasons to find Corbyn "extremist"

Your words not mine. I haven't called him extremist.

I have given my reasons for not liking him. My friend cut up her labour membership card the day he was elected. I don't blame her.

EnthusiasmIsDisturbed · 22/05/2017 21:40

Another Labour Party member who will not vote labour while Corbyn is leading the party

And I know quite a few who feel the same

Juliet11 · 22/05/2017 21:44

If you compare the Conservative manifesto and the Labour manifesto, there is only one clear choice (unless you are super rich). Labour are interested in making life better for working people, they want children to go to decent schools, and be fed a decent meal, to go on to universities and contribute to society and succeed, buy an affordable home and have a decent future. They want an NHS that isn't broken and struggling, they want old people to be safe and secure. What in the fully costed Labour manifesto is there to disagree with? The uncosted Tory manifesto however is just more of the same, the wealth going to the top and not trickling down. They have been destroying this country for years, working people getting poorer and poorer, those at the top getting richer and richer. What is there to like about the Tory manifesto?