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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

AIBU to have never felt degraded by the fact I don't earn "my own" income?

999 replies

Incognit0 · 30/04/2017 19:58

I'm fairly new to MN, but recently have read a lot of threads which seem quite judgemental about women who do not work outside the home, particularly once the DC are at school. I have never come across this attitude in real life, so wonder if MN is an anomaly, or if I'm actually missing something?

OP posts:

RebelRogue · 02/05/2017 06:51

@MaisyPops maybe it's because they have things like "lazy,no self worth,no ambition,bad example to your kids etc" thrown at them,which gets their defences up. Especially the no self worth and "what you do doesn't count because you don't bring any money in".

Original poster

Incognit0 · 02/05/2017 06:55

LondonNicki - who are you to tell me that my degree was a waste of taxpayers money? First of all, it was in Italy. The post-grad course that brought me to London was self-funded.
How many people actually use their degrees anyway in their day to day jobs? Your viewpoint is cringingly arrogant in my opinion.

OP posts:

MaisyPops · 02/05/2017 07:00

RebelRogue
I don't agree with bashing working parents for not caring etc.
I don't agree with the bashing SAHP have had on here.

Still doesn't mean that the "I'm such a martyr because staying at home is so much more difficult..." isn't just irritating and patronising. Like oh ok, you clean your house good for you, so do most other people.

There's been a load of very measured SAHP who've said "I stay at home, this is what I do, it works for me and my family". Good for them.

Whatever is the right choice for the family is absolutely fine. Just save the "ny life is harder" bullshit. You don't see men trying to get into a daft competition of who has it harder.

Spikeyball · 02/05/2017 07:04

Restless I suppose it depends upon whether or not you measure someone's worth by them being or not being in paid employment.

GetAHaircutCarl · 02/05/2017 07:06

incog in the UK you will struggle to find women who respect men who believe that providing is their only responsibility in family life.

We're not impressed by them. We don't buy the noise they make. Our standards are higher.

Nor do we have any deep regard for the women who prop them up. In Italy you may be revered as having reached the pinnacle. But here? Especially in the MN demographic- not so much .

You've no doubt found a circle of ex pats who all live as you do. Their normal is yours. It's an unhealthy bubble. But bubbles are comforting.

BoboChic · 02/05/2017 07:15

As long as a couple covers all bases between them and both are happy with the division of labour, no one should judge them. If one partner wants to do all the domestic stuff and the other all the providing, no one should comment on their choices unless some of their responsibilities are very obviously neglected.

RainbowsAndUnicorn · 02/05/2017 07:15

Many don't want a man that can keep them, they want an equal not a master.

For some money and status is everything, for others they want somebody who shares all the burdens and joys not just feels that going to work is enough.

I'd not want a man that opted out of working and expected me to fund his lifestyle, not a turn on in the slightest. So I'd not expect the same from a man.

Little point in education if it's never used plus never or hardly paying into the system that benefits us all with healthcare etc is wrong.

seoulsurvivor · 02/05/2017 07:17

Carl could you be more patronising? What do you know about this woman's life and if her 'bubble' is unhealthy or not?

Personally I find this whole 'I go to work and don't rely on a man' thing equally as tedious as the whole 'I am a martyr to my children and housework' thing.

seoulsurvivor · 02/05/2017 07:18

An equal, not a master.

Now I've heard it all.

We all must go out to work, otherwise our husband keeps us as a slave and will never respect us.

What total hogwash.

BoboChic · 02/05/2017 07:19

Carl's post was patronizing but, more worryingly, deeply illiberal and unfeminist.

Original poster

Incognit0 · 02/05/2017 07:23

Carl - I'm not saying I've reached the pinnacle of anything . I'm just saying this is the situation we're in and this is what works best for us in that situation. In other circumstances, I may have done differently.

Our friends are not in a bubble. They are from all over the world, plus many British. In general, its a wider cultural perspective than on MN. My DC are in very multi-national schools and see friends mums who do all kinds of things.

OP posts:

seoulsurvivor · 02/05/2017 07:25

bobo I just don't get it.

What's with the constant criticism of women?

Quite disappointing, I generally find mn quite feminist but this thread is stretching that meaning.

'You can be feminist but only in the way WE prescribe'. Totally ignores other people's experiences, Basically typical white middle class feminism.

Penhacked · 02/05/2017 07:26

Well I didn't feel judged until I read this thread!
I don't care. I'm happy, dh happy, children happy. I do work I enjoy that doesn't pay well, enough to give me job satisfaction but not enough that I miss my kids' baby years. Iwould never say anything derogatory about other people's choices. It is a completely personal decision as long as the nuclear family are all happy with the situation. I don't judge someone who is a doctor, a plumber, a cleaner, a SAHM is just another choice as far as I'm concerned. Like it or not, thy do contribute I their family a damned lot.

BoboChic · 02/05/2017 07:26

seoulsurvivor - it's suburban feminism. Yawn...

Harvey342009 · 02/05/2017 07:28

Hi, I'm new here but I need a bit of advise. My mum has always favoured my 2 younger sisters over me and it's driving me mad. I remember being younger and my mum took them on a train journey to Edinburgh shopping for the day but we myself and my brother had to stay with my gran ( I don't know why). Also when I started working I finished at 10pm most nights and I had to walk through a dark alley way to get to the bus station even though my step dad had a car but when my younger sister started working and gfinishedat 5 pm my step dad would be waiting to give her a lift home 😕. Over the years it has not gotten any better. Both my sister's have 1 child each and my mum idealised them and babysits constantly for them both on the same night so they can go out together but yet when I ask my mum to babysit she says she can only manage 1 at a time as they are too much for her, if it wasnt for my mil myself and my husband would never get to go out.
Also, whenever I visit my mum she is constantly on her tablet and never even looks up from that machine and I only get one worded answers to questions I ask her as I'm interupting her playing her game but yet my sister's go in and she looks up to speak to them and puts the stupid machine away.
When I had my youngest daughter my mum hated her name ( Lucie) as she says it was like Lucifer and tried every trick in the book to get me to change her name but I stuck to my guns but even now ( Lucie is 3) she doesn't cal! Her by her name very often, usually Lou Lou or luc where's she goes on and on about how much she loves my niece's name as it's a pretty name and doesn't remind her of anything evil.
She also constantly invites my sister's round for t and never me, I have invited my mum and step dad to mine for t but they never come due to illness/ babysitting/ work. Basically ant excuse not to come.
As myself and my husband only have one car we have to sometimes get the kids up early to go to work so the other one can use the car but my step dad takes my sister to work so my nephew and brother in law don't have to get out of bed! When it was my birthday I got a bunch of flowers whereas my sister got the complete box set of a TV show she liked .
They all plan days out to zoos together without me or my family and when I ask why I wasn't invited all I get is ' I thought you were working' or it was a spur of the moment thing we didn't plan it . Or they book a caravan together then tell me there's no more room for anybody else so I get left out, I ask them to go with them next time they go and when they next go they ' forgot' that they said they would let us go so we get left behind again
If I wrote everything here that happened I would be here all day but sometimes it's like my mum wishes she'd never had me , I hate favouritism and make sure my 3 children never feel that way. How can I get my mum to love me the same as my sister's?

RebelRogue · 02/05/2017 07:29

Many don't want a man that can keep them, they want an equal not a master.

OH earns in 3 days what I earn in a month. We are no more equal now than we were when i was earning nothing if you go by earning potential. However in fact we are equals and see each other as such.

seoulsurvivor · 02/05/2017 07:36

If you base the respect in your relationship on what each other earns, you're going to have problems.

I used to earn more than my partner. Now he works and I study.

Can't say I've noticed a difference in his respect towards me but perhaps I should check if he wants me to call him master.

NataliaOsipova · 02/05/2017 07:41

I do think that it's a real waste of tax payers money to university study when people don't pursue a career. Just seems like a waste of learning and potential.

Rubbish.

I've worked this out. One of my good friends is a teacher. She works FT; I'm a SAHM. But - for the 15 years I worked in the City, I earned, on average, 5 times as much as she did. And the nature of the progressive tax system means I paid a lot more than 5 times her tax. So if you're talking about taxpayers' money and that's your benchmark, then I'm streets ahead, even as a SAHM. What do you do?

SuperBeagle · 02/05/2017 07:46

Natalia You misread the post. That person was saying if you don't pursue a career then it's a waste. That's not the same as having worked in the city for 15 years and then becoming a SAHM.

seoulsurvivor · 02/05/2017 07:51

Well a lot of things are a 'waste'.

Do we all have to follow some prescribed path?

If you find that being at home with your kids makes you happier, wouldn't it be pointless to go and have a career?

It's not like you are never allowed to use your brain at home - I'm certainly planning on using my teaching degree to help my kids. I will still read books, I will still have discussions with friends. My reason to go to university was not so I can make money. It was because I wanted to learn.

School-university-career til you die is not the only acceptable life path and any woman who doesn't follow it is a traitor to the cause.

BoboChic · 02/05/2017 07:52

The purpose of education is not to earn money - the purpose of education is to equip people with the skills to make wise, informed choices.

BoboChic · 02/05/2017 07:54

And, tbh, I see women earning lots of money and making terrible choices every day and their children and wider society suffering because of those choices...

skerrywind · 02/05/2017 07:56

My degree has certainly not been a waste.

I have a degree in science. I find that area of education quite lacking in primary schools.
At the age of 8 my kids (through our conversations) knew basic atomic theory, knew about the phases of matter, what the electomagnetic spectum was, what a periodic table meant, why fireworks are different colours.

Both are embarking on science careers themselves.

SuperBeagle · 02/05/2017 07:57

And, tbh, I see women earning lots of money and making terrible choices every day and their children and wider society suffering because of those choices...

So if those women were also educated doesn't that negate the point you made in your previous post? That it exists to help people make better choices? Most people don't make "lots of money" without some formal education behind them in this day and age.

BoboChic · 02/05/2017 07:59

They may be qualified but they very often lack a meaningful education. Qualifications and education are not synonymous.

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