AIBU to have never felt degraded by the fact I don't earn "my own" income?

[Incognit0]

I'm fairly new to MN, but recently have read a lot of threads which seem quite judgemental about women who do not work outside the home, particularly once the DC are at school. I have never come across this attitude in real life, so wonder if MN is an anomaly, or if I'm actually missing something?

The only thing I judge here is women slating each other for their choices. It's so hard for women to be truly happy and guilt free because they are slagged off for whatever they do BY OTHER WOMEN. Surely we can just let each other get on with their own lives without this blanket disapproval. Of course the vast majority of working women prioritise their families as well as their careers. Of course, the vast majority of SAHMs are not lazy fuckers but also do a huge amount of other things outside the home, including voluntary work, caring for elderly relatives etc ( and before I get slated for that, I'm not saying working women don't do that as well). It's really disappointing that a predominantly female message board is still coming out with this crap. It's so damaging to many people's self esteem and mental health to constantly feel guilty whatever they do, despite doing their absolute best. And yes there are many women who don't give a stuff however they are viewed but that doesn't mean there are equally many women who are bothered by it. Please just stop it now.

re: What do people do all day if they don't work and kids are at school.

No one asks this of pensioners! Seriously, I can see it would be easy to fill 9:20am - 2:50pm! That's not something I'm worrying about re becoming a SAHM of school aged DCs!

How can I really good point about everyone's choices at 21. I have an incredibly family friendly career while also being well paid. Luck rather than planning though and I agree if anyone had mentioned this sort of thing to me at 21 I'd have ignored them as a dinosaur.

Agree Mrdarcyfanclub. It's why I've tried to keep a thick skin and not engage in conversations with people I know are going to leave me feeling rubbish. I've not quite perfected it, but I'm much happier now than when I first had children and took every comment to heart. It's helped in other areas of life so an unexpected benefit.

Guitar girl I am off to make family memories in ikea. Thibk of me...

tinseltwins I wondered why you where replying to me about TA jobs you had me confused then but it's ok lol but thats a very good point that you make I know a couple of people who have volunteered as dinner ladies in their autistic kids schools and they got full time jobs out of it schools are always looking for parents to volunteer or do agency work then you can pick and choose your hours and don't have to work a set amount of hours there are millions of jobs out there that SAHM's with school age children could do if they had a look instead of using the I can't find anything excuse. My mum use to volunteer in my school because she was SAHM but not through choice through being disabled but she found things to do when she was able to.

Having been both a SAHM (for first three years) and now working full-time, I don't judge anyone for their choices. But, the thing that often strikes me, when I look at women who haven't returned to the workforce, or whose career has been stymied by maternity leave is that, a lot of the time, and for a lot of women, the element of choice really isn't there.

It's hard to make a free, unimpeded choice when society tends to assume (and I'd say this thread largely reflects that assumption) that the individual in a couple who should sacrifice their career is the mother. In my opinion, this assumption (and the way it's reinforced in parental leave options, etc) underpins SO many of the mothering vs career 'choices' contemporary women make, and it pisses me off.

In my opinion, a free choice about which you want - SAHM or WOHM - is only available when there are no societal pressures or biases one way or the other. If there was shared parental leave; if we had less socially engrained expectation that men were going to be the main breadwinner; if women had greater expectations of equal pay - ie if we were closer to a level playing field of gender equality - THEN we might begin talking about 'choice'. But, in so many situations the default option is that the woman stays home.

Okay, for some people the current set-up and expectations work out fine. People make choices and are happy to bear the guilt, or the judgement or whatever. But I think it's utterly abysmal that some women have defaulted on a career or vocation simply because (by absorbing subtle social expectations) they have just never seen the satisfactions of those levels of ambition as something that applies to them, or that they could aspire to if they wished.

I fully get that this doesn't quite apply to the OP. It has just always bugged me that all of this guilt or concern over career vs home has been seen as (almost) solely the domain of women.

Rant over!

I wouldn't judge a SAHM of school aged kids,honestly I would wonder what they do all day. But that's my assumptions rather than facts.
In fact I have seen lots of assumptions and bias on this thread,both ways.

I'm a single parent have brought my kids up alone, they don't really see their Dad. I work,always have done averaged about 3/4 time. Full time now,demanding job which I'm good at and love.
Every time I read I couldn't work because my partner works long hours,you can you choose not to. Fine choice but a choice.
When people exclaim running the house takes all my time, it doesn't.
I work because I have to,I bring up my kids because I have to,do the two collide ,yeah sometimes. Do I care what others think. No.
I suppose my point is that as women we limit ourselves by assuming that we can't do things,limiting our choices. Its fine to choose either,but to talk about ourselves in terms of limitations isn't. Men don't.

Luxnuova - great post and very true imo. Although I'm happy with my choice to be at home, I won't pretend that choice was made in a vacuum or that it was a level playing field at the outset - for many reasons!

I don't feel judged. I may not work but I do further my education.

Also, if I wasn't at home we'd need to employ a nanny, a cook and a cleaner so I'm actually doing the job of 3 people. And I love it. I love the freedom of not going into an office, I can spent lots more time outside. Children can hardwork but no more so than a high maintenance manager!

if I wasn't at home we'd need to employ a nanny, a cook and a cleaner so I'm actually doing the job of 3 people. Really, you must live in a very unusual environment, I have never known anyone to employ a full time cook. In every family I know with two working parents (or in lone parent families) they get by doing these things themselves and don't employ anyone to do these things, or at most have a cleaner in for 2-3 hrs a week.

if I wasn't at home we'd need to employ a nanny, a cook and a cleaner so I'm actually doing the job of 3 people. whoops bold fail!

Feelingdizzy my "limitations" weren't really limitations it was what made more financial sense,considering my partner's income,working hours,the fact that if he doesn't work he doesn't get paid and my earning potential. He would've supported me and encouraged me either way but there was just no point in working.

Feeling, out of interest, how much time do you spend during the week doing cooking, shopping, cleaning, laundry, diy, decorating and tidying? I have a four bedroom Edwardian house (so old and crumbly, very dusty) and three kids and I just can't get on top of it all, despite working only 2 - 3 days a week. I keep wondering what I'm doing wrong, or if the secret is to not sit down for more than an hour in the evening and to spend a good chunk of the weekend doing house stuff.

All the people I know who have two f/t working parents and 3 or more kids either

• pay someone else to clean, garden, decorate
• have homes that need little maintenance
• no garden or one which is just lawn
• spend a good chunk of every weekend/evening shopping, batch cooking/cleaning etc. Or do massive online shops.
• are ferociously energetic and never sit down

I can't work out how I'm supposed to have an acceptable quality of life and still maintain a big house and garden etc and be out the house for 50 hours a week working. I just can't do it. I really have no idea how other people do it and keep it up and be happy.

Also, if I wasn't at home we'd need to employ a nanny, a cook and a cleaner so I'm actually doing the job of 3 people

It's these kind of comments that wind me up.
Choose to stay at home, I respect and value each couples right to choose what works for them (said this lots during the thread)

BUT don't give me all these lines about how being at home is actually doing 3 jobs etc as if to say 'I work harder because I'm at home'. The next line will be "People who work can come home from work but I WORK 24/7"

Also, if I wasn't at home we'd need to employ a nanny, a cook and a cleaner so I'm actually doing the job of 3 people.

Do you think all working parents have nannies, cooks and cleaners or something?

Funny enough, if you did work you'd cope just fine without these things, like the rest of us do.

" In every family I know with two working parents (or in lone parent families) they get by doing these things themselves "

All the families I know who do this have fuck all leisure time and are in a constant state of tiredness and dissatisfaction with their homes.

But this is supposed to be something we should aspire to?

I get a bit of gentle teasing about being a SAHM to school age children but I don't care. I had my DCs in my late 30s after 10 years of TTC. Before that I had worked in banking for 20 years and had built up a nice lump sum of cash which I used to pay off half of our mortgage when I gave up work. My previous career has set me up well financially for the lifestyle I have now and I'm making the most of it.

I fill my time when the DCs are at school and the housework is up straight with my hobbies and a little bit of volunteering. When they get home from school I'm busy driving them to and from their various activities and clubs.

I'm busy but we all have time to breath.

I'm happy , DC are happy and DH is happy. That's all that matters to me.

I don't judge you but as you've asked the question I will give my opinion.

I work full time with 3 children. My children always come first but I think I'm a good role model for my girls. I would hate them to think they worked hard at school and university to spend their lives doing domestic chores or drinking coffee.

Also I feel I've really achieved something every day at work - I wonder if I would feel the same sense of achievement if I stayed at home.

I would also feel a sense of guilt if I was sat at home/meeting friends etc while my husband worked hard and took all the financial responsibility

Just my opinion

I work ft, my dh works ft, we don't need to employ a cleaner/cook/nanny because we split everything. People should try that.

OP do YOU have illness cover etc? If he walked out tomorrow, moved in with someone else and you fell down the stairs next week, broke your neck and needed full time care, who would pay your bills then? If he decided not to? You NEED to protect yourself financially, especially if he starts another relationship. Life has a strange way of throwing curveballs.

"Funny enough, if you did work you'd cope just fine without these things, like the rest of us do."

People don't 'cope fine'.

The most common reason for visiting the GP is tiredness.

We've never had such high rates of depression.

Cleaning/DIY/gardening/dog walking services have grown hugely in the last few years as more and more families have both parents working.

Ready meals and takeaways make up a huge proportion of people's diets in the UK compared to the rest of Europe.

It really isn't all sunny out there.

Most of the stahp I know send their kids to preschool/day care. Their houses are not cleaner than mine. They don't feed their kids home cooked meals like I do. So I do often wonder what they do all day.

Beebeeeight

People in real like are too polite to say it to your face.

They will be thinking it.

Agreed. With work, in an environment beyond the home, comes status and a sense of worth.