To think teachers should not puts hands on children

[Mousedl1]

So I went on a school trip today with my DS class as they needed volunteers. Lunch was outside sat on a field DS was asked to sit down twice by the class room helper, for back round other children were up and playing he was being his usual slow self. He classroom helper then grabbed him by the shoulders and literally forced him to sit down, he didn't say anything and just sat bewildered and looked at me as he has never been shoved to do something at home.
I was very angry but as a school trip said nothing, another mum saw I was annoyed and commented that helper can often be 'forceful' with children. I am now home and furious and I think even more so that my son accepted it which with the other comment makes me think this may not be the first time. He isn't a nasty child but can get silly and giggly (is 6) but I don't think this is appropriate from an adult, then 10 mins later another child punched someone in the face and she had to hold a hand for 5 mins 😤 So she was punished less for that in my opinion then him standing to eat his food. Is it unreasonable to go into school and tell them in no uncertain terms no body has the right to do this or is it best to leave it like my husband says as it will cause problems for my son long term (the helper moves up with the class each year so he has her for 1 more)

Big I know for certain because of my job role.

Devilish, perhaps the article isn't accurate. But it's interesting that the child's father had other issues with the school, and that pupils of the teacher have supported him. Given the lack of respect for education and teachers shown by some children (parental influences?) I'm surprised that there aren't more stories like this.

Gran - my son (a very vulnerable young person) was observed being forcibly shoved and physically held by an adult in a position of responsibility. It was reported by two other adults (not related to him). Social services initiated an investigation. My son was examined by a paediatrician who noted the bruising etc. Anyway according to the police there wasn't enough evidence to charge. Not with two adults observing and independently reporting. It didn't matter how much I pointed that out - there was enough evidence so no case.

So I strongly suspect the teacher with the sad face in the Daily Mail did a lot more than give a gentle tap and probably will be better off taking my out his frustrations on tree branches rather than small children.

I do know the ins and outs of one teacher sacked for restraint and what he did was horrific & intentional (& he wasn't charged either)

I've helped out on lots of school trips and herding cats sums it up nicely. Children get really excited about trips, being out of their usual surroundings and behaviour is often a lot worse, especially with little ones. Any trip I've been on has about 4 adults for 30 odd kids. With that sort of ratio it's essential that kids do as they're told - first time.

Pretty clear from the OP that her child was not injured, just pissed off by being made to do what he'd been asked to do, twice. The TA wasn't asking him for something unreasonable, she was asking him, twice, to sit on his backside and eat his lunch. Had I been in the OP's position it wouldn't have got that far, even if she was unable to leave the child she was sitting with that doesn't stop her using her "Mum voice" and telling her child to sit, now.

All this coaxing and negotiating with 6 year olds is crazy. They do what they are told by an authority figure. End of story.

What tinfoilhattie said!

Ah sorry larger children.

Honestly though - if the court system has failed him (& in my experience I cannot see that as very likely as they're so unlikely to charge in these sorts of cases) then he is better of getting his side of the story out through a different outlet than the daily mail whose mangled writing has made it impossible to know actually what happened.

Fathers cannot insist police charge - that's not how it works. The police are usually wise to delusional parents.

The school may have a zero tolerance to touch etc - but that's a different issue to ending up in court for assault.

Shouting threateningly at someone can be classed as assault though - so who knows what has happened.

God I am glad my DD is at a school where physical contact isn't banned.

I volunteer at the school for certain things. Last week I held a 6 year old boy on my knee for two hours - gently - to stop him bashing his head repeatedly into a wall. He cuddled and sobbed and gradually calmed down.

My DD still hugs staff now at 10.

OP your son wasn't hurt therefore it was clearly a guiding touch and i wouldn't have thought twice other than embarrassment at my child not listening

He was asked twice to sit down and didn't and even when the TA touched him he still didn't sit down willingly then? Why?

For the love of fuck. She put her hands on his shoulders to get him to sit down when he wasn't doing as he was asked. Get a fucking grip.

It's getting beyond ridiculous.

OP YANBU and also agree that YOU were there no one else on here was so you know how it looked and how it made you feel. Honestly some of the comments on here show such blind unquestioning obedience to those in perceived authority. It's actually quite frightening. I have a child who was badly assaulted at school by a teacher and also know of a TA that everyone at the school is terrified of, even other members of staff as she is so overbearing and one of the longest serving members of staff, no one dares tackle her and she gets away with a lot of scary, shouty behaviour - her classes are terrified of her. There's bullies and people who lose in control in all areas of life and the teaching profession is not exempt from that. I'd put my concerns in writing to the HT if I were you and if that makes me THAT parent, well that's fine by me

Honestly some of the comments on here show such blind unquestioning obedience to those in perceived authority

What a daft comment.

No. It just means I save my criticism for actual issues rather than non events.

Also you have to look at the alternative to putting her hands on his shoulders. What was she supposed to do? Ask him 15 times? They are in a strange environment. She needed to keep him safe in as quick a time as possible. She is also surrounded by 29 other excited children on a school trip who could also start doing the same/worse as him if they see him getting away with it.

What do you think she should have done instead op?

Awaywith, a child about to run out behind a car comes under my heading of "something gone badly wrong". As do other situations where physical restraint is appropriate in school like a child attacking another child or going to hurt themselves in some way. Of course I recognise that a child who's behaviourally younger may require different handling, though don't really think that's relevant here - physical restraint would be appropriate for any child about to run into a road.
The case in the OP wasn't a "something gone badly wrong", much as some posters would like to talk it up, no-one was about to get hurt.

I can understand you wanting to complain if the helper had whalloped your DS but she didn't, did she?
My DS is a slow eater and gets up to potter about when he's at home. I'm regularly reminding him to sit down and finish his meal.
He's very good at following instructions at school but if he was misbehaving on a school trip in my presence, I'd feel mortified and would probably have shouted at him.

I hate this precious snowflake attitude.

Child was told to do something. Twice. He didn't do it. I'd personally feel embarrassed as the parent, not come and rant about it on here.

She asked him twice. He wasn't the only child she was supervising. Could you have not at least added your voice to the request. He is six and been in school long enough to know how the school requires him to behave. He looked at you to see your reaction. Perhaps he was behaving in that way because you were there. You would be better to have a talk to him about doing as he is told and explaining that the teacher/helper has a lot of children to look after so cannot wait until he feels like doing something.

Devilish I'm sure my blood pressure rocketed every time I helped on a reception trip!

"Girls, go to Miss X."
"Boys, go to Miss X."
"Girls, go to Miss X."

Every 2 minutes, ad infinitum.

There's usually a policy. Handling during a dangerous meltdown is usually considered to minimise physical risk to the child. Lots will also have a clause to give a hug etc although the guidance on it is less than affectionate and more akin to what you might do to keep a crab at bay. I wouldn't think that any handling such as described above was policy or necessary, no.

Honestly some of the comments on here show such blind unquestioning obedience to those in perceived authority

It really isn't. I've already explained that I for one, am not biased after the experience of the last school, but I don't see a problem here.

The OP wasn't the only one that was there, the teacher/member of staff was there too, and I think it's a bit OTT to think the member of staffs only intention was to 'force' the child down. She was trying to get him to do as he's told by the sounds of it!

My DDs TA is a force to be reckoned with, there's very few people that put the fear of God into me, guess what? She's one of them. The kids aren't terrified of her, they respect her and do as they are told the first time. If ibwas in charge of 30 Yr6s I think I'd have to be exert a bit of authority at time to keep order to!

You'll never guess what I'm about to say next, every single child in that class loves her. My DD thinks she's the best thing since sliced bread. I see a snapshot of them for five minutes in the evening and mornings, DD spends six hours a day with her, if my children are happy I'm happy and I certainly wouldn't be writing any letter to the HT about how you think a member of staff was a bit rough with a child who was refusing to do as they were told in the first place.

Sorry about the typos in my last post

Are you sure the TA didn't just place her hands on his shoulders to encourage him to sit down? Surely she didn't manhandle him into sitting?

the op stats another adult saw this force and made a remark to her so it cant just be op being precious

Well, she's not been back to update us on whether she went to complain/ran to the Mail with a sad face or what her job is....

Or has she...?

Are you quite sure that the hands on your ds's shoulders were using a fair amount of force or do you think the hands could just have been applying enough pressure to give a physical cue/reminder to your ds to sit down?

I don't really think it's bad though. Physical reinforcement of instructions is fine imo. I'm not talking about smacking, I'm talking about if you ask a child to come along with you and they don't you could put your hand on their shoulder and push lightly in the direction they are supposed to be walking. Or if you are passing on a narrow path and you ask your child to stand to the side and they don't, you could get their hand and lead them to the side or you could use your straightened arm to guide/nudge them to the side.

Overall I wouldn't complain.