Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

AIBU to think we should encourage our daughters to 'marry well'?

999 replies

windygallows · 09/04/2017 22:18

I know 'marrying well' is something our mothers and grandmothers crowed about but it's not a phrase I've heard much these days and it feels quite an anti-feminist sentiment in a world where women can do well without men.

Yet I wonder if marrying well - marrying into money or marrying someone who is in a well-paid profession - is something we should be encouraging our daughters to do. Why? Because not every woman wants to have a career and if you want to be a SAHM then really that's easiest if your DH is well paid. Also women still experience a pay gap and are in lower-paid roles by comparison, so having a well paid DH really does make up that pay gap.

Plus - when I look around at my female friends and peers (I'm mid-40s) of the ones who have a comfortable lifestyle and are able to work part-time or be SAHM, for about 3/4 that lifestyle is attributed to having a well-paid or wealthy DH. The other 1/4 got there through their work/career, family money etc. This is purely a sample of my peers, by no means the norm.

I'm a staunch feminist so it's a bit hard to write this but I'm also a single parent and know what a slog it can be making everything work on my own salary. Marrying well doesn't mean a good marriage or relationship but it does make things easier. In the end shouldn't we be having an honest conversation with our daughters about this and encouraging them to think a bit more about 'marrying well'?

OP posts:
MaidenMotherCrone · 10/04/2017 20:44

After reading all these comments I think I might encourage my DSs to never get married, hang on to their own money and fall in love with a likeminded independent young lady. It's a very sad thought that so many women think like this.

Bottlesoflove · 10/04/2017 20:49

No I did not find it particularly easy becoming a doctor, it took sustained effort like most careers do. What is wrong with that? It was not unachievable though, despite many people telling me it would be. (What about when you want to have children blah blah blah - even in medical school interview, yes really) Just because marrying a rich man is (arguably) the "easier" option doesn't mean it is the favourable one, and not something I am going to go out of my way to encourage my dd to aspire to, in lieu of having aspirations and ambitions of her own.

Karanka · 10/04/2017 20:50

You have to be physically strong and fast so the average woman is at a disadvantage.

You have to have a reasonable level of physical health, but you don't require a greater degree of strength or speed than you would to, say, go hiking, do DIY or play contact sports.

Bottlesoflove · 10/04/2017 21:03

Today my dd was telling me she wanted to be a scientist when she grew up. Should I have said "ooo no dear, science is a very male dominated industry and you won't get very far. You'd be faaarr better off concentrating on keeping yourself pretty and marrying a scientist instead".

Hhmmm. I'd rather not piss on her chips just yet. Think I'll actually aim to give her the confidence to believe she can do it herself instead. I know there is sadly an element of truth in the above. However Things will only change if our dds grow up wanting and expecting an equal shot.

HelenaDove · 10/04/2017 21:06

I think OP is a feminist.

She simply doesnt do MIDDLE CLASS WHITE feminism.

Gwen i agree with your posts SOMEONE has to do the tills at Tesco. SOMEONE has to wipe Grannys or Grandads arse in the nursing home so that their middle/high income relatives dont have to give up their well paid jobs to do so.

Agree with Vestal too.

BarbaraofSeville · 10/04/2017 21:10

I'm not sure bin people get paid that well any more. Isn't it all contracted out now?

If it's a wheelie bin round it's not particularly physically challenging for the able bodied. Certainly no harder than being a postal worker, and plenty of women do that job.

BarbaraofSeville · 10/04/2017 21:11

Being on the bins is probably no harder than nursing and care work, where patients need to be lifted, mostly by women.

mygorgeousmilo · 10/04/2017 21:14

I married well. Wonderful husband and father, not majorly wealthy but we have a happy life and go on holidays etc. Happiness and kindness are worth their weight in gold. YABU

Gwenhwyfar · 10/04/2017 21:19

"you don't require a greater degree of strength or speed than you would to, say, go hiking, do DIY or play contact sport"

I couldn't do any of those things as a job and I disagree anyway on the average DIY task being as physically demanding as refuse collection. I have read that any worker who was slower than others (I would also need to do more trips as I wouldn't be able to carry as much as a man or a stronger than average woman) would annoy their colleagues for holding the team back. They may not be paid like that any more, but I'm pretty sure they wouldn't want me slowing them down.

I just looked up the requirements and NUMBER ONE was

"you need to be

physically fit, active and strong enough to lift and carry heavy bins and sacks"

From another Internet article:

"Tom, 21, a keen footballer, and 20-year-old Steve dart on and off the pavement, running along the length of the truck emptying bins and food waste containers as they go. Driver Mark said: “They probably run the equivalent of a half marathon every day, dragging heavy bins behind them."

Gwenhwyfar · 10/04/2017 21:22

"I'm single, since leaving my husband. I'm a teacher, so not on a high salary.

I'm really, really happy."

You're in a well-respected profession with a decent salary. Not that surprising that you're happy. We already know from studies that people don't get much happier once they earn about the average, but people on low wages really do have a more difficult life.

Gwenhwyfar · 10/04/2017 21:25

"It (becoming a doctor) was not unachievable though"

It's unachievable for most people is my point! I don't care if you worked hard or not, what is the relevance of that to the discussion.

"Just because marrying a rich man is (arguably) the "easier" option doesn't mean it is the favourable one, and not something I am going to go out of my way to encourage my dd to aspire to"

Well, your daughter is likely to inherit your intelligence and to be growing up in an intellectually stimulating home, but some women don't get the academic or the practical ability and have nothing but a life of depressing jobs ahead of them.

BarbaraofSeville · 10/04/2017 21:26

Sloths move faster than the people who do the bins where I am. And they never put them back anywhere near where they found them, preferring to leave them strewn all over the place blocking as many driveways and pavements as possible.

Of course it's physically harder than an office job, and it's outside, but it's not beyond the capabilities of your averagely fit woman at all.

Gwenhwyfar · 10/04/2017 21:27

"Today my dd was telling me she wanted to be a scientist when she grew up. Should I have said "ooo no dear, science is a very male dominated industry and you won't get very far. You'd be faaarr better off concentrating on keeping yourself pretty and marrying a scientist instead". "

Whoever suggested that? Nobody's saying that marrying well is better than having a career, only that it might be the best option for SOME people.

Gwenhwyfar · 10/04/2017 21:28

" it's not beyond the capabilities of your averagely fit woman at all."

Did you not see the quote about the 21 and 22 year old who do the equivalent of a half marathon a day. Don't know about you but sports with an athletic 21 year old man is completely beyond me.

SmileEachDay · 10/04/2017 21:29

Nope. Being reliant on someone else for your security and future happiness is not ever the best option.

Gwenhwyfar · 10/04/2017 21:32

" Being reliant on someone else for your security and future happiness is not ever the best option."

Lots of people on low incomes are working and also on benefits. Should they refuse those benefits, because being reliant on someone else is never the best option? We're all reliant on our employers aren't we?

Karanka · 10/04/2017 21:33

I couldn't do any of those things as a job and I disagree anyway on the average DIY task being as physically demanding as refuse collection.

Whether you could or couldn't do it is irrelevant - I can't cut hair, but that doesn't mean men can't be barbers. Many women do work physically demanding jobs, in care for starters.

SmileEachDay · 10/04/2017 21:34

gwen I think you're being deliberately obtuse.

We disagree. That's ok.

didireallysaythat · 10/04/2017 21:36

Interesting idea OP

Should i encourage my sons to marry well ?

Gwenhwyfar · 10/04/2017 21:36

"I can't cut hair, but that doesn't mean men can't be barbers"

That's completely different. You're not physically unable to cut hair, you just haven't been trained to do it.

"Many women do work physically demanding jobs, in care for starters."

Yes, but isn't that sometimes at the expense of their health?

IAmAmy · 10/04/2017 21:37

Truly depressing thread. My mother and most of her friends have excellent jobs and very happy marriages. They have more than comfortable lifestyles and I have friends whose mothers out-earn their fathers. On top of this, encouraging girls to choose male partners (not everyone wants to get married) on the basis of their salary/likely future salary is ridiculous and potentially dangerous, if you taught daughters this they'd think they have to sacrifice love, potential relationships with boys truly right for them and even put up with being mistreated in any number of ways just to "bag" someone with the right earning potential.

Also: Prime Minister, First Minister of Scotland, Home Secretary, CEO of Lloyds of London, Chief Prosecuter of the CPS, CEO of EasyJet, the youngest ever Old Bailey judge, Commissioner of the Metropolitan Police, to name but a few...women. What a shame some would rather teach their daughters to marry a high earning man than about women like them and so many others.

2rebecca · 10/04/2017 21:40

I think everyone should try and marry someone of similar intelligence and similar earning potential, as well as the love each other similar values stuff.
To get the power balance right you should respect each other and have the ability to walk away if things go badly and not be a financial prisoner. My career has outlasted my husband/s.

RainbowsAndUnicorn · 10/04/2017 21:42

I'd rather my son didn't get married in one respect as he shouldn't be seen as a cashpoint simply because he was born male. If he leads by example he'all find a women who is an equal rather than out for what she can get.

AntiGrinch · 10/04/2017 21:42

"Being reliant on someone else for your security and future happiness is not ever the best option."

But we are all reliant on others. For all kinds of things. And surely being in a relationship is the one very particular case where actually that should be ok?

Karanka · 10/04/2017 21:47

Yes, but isn't that sometimes at the expense of their health?

No more or less than physical demands take their toll on men.

As I said upthread, I spend a considerable amount of professional time trying to encourage new female entrants into sectors like construction, energy and transport - I refuse to subscribe to this idea (seemingly taken up by some on this thread) that women are too delicate and feeble for jobs like these.