What if this happened at your kids school?

[Bambambini]

Would it bother you - if this happened at your kids school? A 15 yr old boy (ok Trans) who used to race on the boys team - now races on the girls team and is beating the other girls. I don't see why it won't happen here - if it already hasn't happened.

I have kids at high school and i'd find this hard tovsccrpt, especially if i had girls who liked sport.

www.google.co.uk/amp/www.pinknews.co.uk/2017/04/08/trans-middle-schooler-added-to-female-track-team/amp/

Transgender people should not compete in sports if they are taking hormones to 'transition'. If they are not taking hormones they should compete according to their biological sex. That is fair. Anything else is unfair.

But actually I do find the level of misogyny and anti-feminism on these threads very hard to stomach.

You really cannot be serious. Every one of these threads on MN is heavily weighted in favour of feminists, to the point that anyone who dares to suggest that trans people are not all inherently dangerous and shouldn't automatically be vilified finds themselves the target of abuse and vilification. The discussions always go around the same little repetitive circle till the next person finds an excuse to start a trans thread, whereupon it all starts again. You can support the right of trans people not to be universally demonised without being a misogynist, you know.

women and girls should not be expected to share safe women only spaces with MTF transgender men, nor have to complete against them in sports. The safety of MTF transgender men is NOT more important than the safety of girls and women. The sporting ambitions of girls and women are NOT less important than the sporting ambitions of MTF transgender men. Men cannot become women. If they do take steps to 'transition' they should do so in the knowledge that they will no longer be able to compete in sports. One cannot have one's cake and eat it.

That's not true NotMe, if someone makes the point then they argued with in a reasonable manner. Feminists just use facts and they care about women and girls, someone needs to.

Yeah I'm wrong it must be really upsetting for the girls not to win all the time how do they ever manage coming second! When I was at school we had a girl who was an amazing athlete ended up going to the olympics who won everything by some distance was it unfair that she was able to compete? We knew that second place was a great achievement and the competetive tried to get closest to her. I'm not saying they shouldn't be upset but life's unfair suck it up and try harder or is it a case everyone should come first?

Princess

Really?

That post is ironic, right?

I competed in a physical sport at a high level at uni, and I do not understand why this is such a huge issue for the people who have posted on this thread so far. It may or may not be an issue at the very highest level, for people who compete, but for school sports it seems a bit precious to be so concerned. Even at my level, which was international at uni and told I was good enough to train for the olympics, unless a particular event with a particular competitor caused life changing consequences for me, eg not being picked for a squad for a long period of time, it would not even be on my radar. I used to train with men and women and I would be able to beat about 95 percent of the men and this was the case for most of the top women. And I was 5'6 and a size 8 at the time. Skill counts for a lot.

At puberty all sorts of things are given up by both sexes frequently -orchestra, sport - because most teenagers want to go to parties. (Or that was the case in my day)

This is the first time I have read one of the trans sport threads.

but she was a girl Princess, she probably trained harder than them. If they had trained hard they would have a chance. They wouldn't have a chance against a male no matter how much they train or how little he does. that's the point. He doesn't even have to try to win and they won't win no matter how hard they try but yeh, they should just suck it up I guess, cos, reasons.

It's precious for girls to care about winning? If they don't care about winning at this level they won't even bother going forward. I wish everyone would think a little harder.

Meh. This has been done to death. Anyone would think there were thousands of transgender children depriving other children of their plastic gold medals on sports day. There aren't.
Would I understand if my child was upset because they got beaten by someone who had an unfair advantage. Yes, of course I would.
Would I understand that young people who are trans have bigger issues to deal with than this - such as the attitude of some people that amounts to transphobia. Yes, of course I would.
As far as national and international sport is concerned, I'm happy to leave it to various regulatory and governing bodies to work out what is fair and what isn't.

I'm not at all into sports and even less into the Olympics, but I believe that there is an overall benefit for everyone in playing sports and, in the end, people play sports to win at their level. Now that they are making a totally mockery out of women's and girls' competitions, will we have even less uptake of sports?

Young girls have lots of issues to deal with too, body confidence issues, the fact that they rarely see their sex represented on tv taking part in sport, sexism, misogyny etc.

But yeh, just meh, why bother about them losing another right cos someone else wants it and that persons feelings are more important. Gosh, that's almost like the shit women and girls have been putting up with for thousands of years. No, couldn't be misogyny could it?

She did train harder as she was given extra time and dispensations. DameDeDoubtance you seem to be of the impression that it was purely down to training so obviously talent and ability doesn't come into it? I don't believe a functioning male should compete against girls but at the point a trans is physically female they should compete with the girls. How do people stand on a female taking male hormones or a hermaphrodite?

I wonder why trans- can't have their own thing, like Special Olympics?

How does a male become physically female? That isn't possible. Dressing in a feminine way and growing your hair doesn't make you a girl. Taking cross sex hormones doesn't make you a girl. Having surgery doesn't make you a girl, though all that seems to be required now is to grow your a hair a bit and like pink.

Why can a man or boy not be feminine?

Sex matters, despite the anti science lobby that is currently in favour.

Because that's highly offensive Rail! How dare you imply that trans women are not real women and must be put in a category of their own :O Doesn't matter how big their penis is, if they say they're a woman they're a woman and must compete in women's events. #transphobic

(I think it's ridiculous too)

DameDeDoubtance if you have a penis your a man, a vagina a women. What about the opposite a girl transitioning to male?

If I joined in a race with 7 year old girls, and subsequently bet them - due to my strength and longer legs - I'd feel like an utter tool standing on the podium, accepting my gold medal.

I'd be acutely aware of the two 7YOs standing to my left and my right, giving me the side-eye, and seething at the unfairness of it.

I'd be cringing at the thought of everyone in the audience, seeing my inherent and unfair advantage, and just knowing that they thought the real winner of the 7YO girls' race was the 7YO girl who came first.

I would feel ridiculous.

Princess, transmen are not going to disrupt men's sports, because they are biological women. Most transwomen and girls don't have surgery, they have female penises. The idea that trans women and girls are all body disphoric, or are all going to have surgery isn't true. They just say that they feel female, no idea what that feels like by the way but it seems to be feeling like a stereotype invented by a misogynistic society.

Women and girls have the right to compete with their own sex.

Of course its not fair.

There is no easy option really. Either trans kid loses out, or girls do. Why is it always females expected to move over? Thats the real question here.

Male, female, transwomen, transmen categories.

At least until society accepts that sex is real but your personality and clothing choices are your own.

Plenty of athletes face choices between their sporting ambitions and other considerations. Transwomen should accept that competing against women in most sports is cheating and that they can either continue competing as men or not at,all. Transition isn't something that other people do to you. It's a choice.

Not exactly fair but it wouldn't be fair on that particular child if they were refused. Besides, no two people are the same. We all have different abilities etc and can't win at everything. Plus life just isn't fair, hence why that child was born in the wrong body.

Men and women are very, very different. there are lots of biological differences which give males a sporting advantage. I really care about women and girls and the way they are treated in sport is already a joke, now they have to compete against biological males too?

Nah, not on my watch, at least I can look my daughter in the eye and say that I gave a shit.