shooting outside parliament

[Itisnoteasybeingdifferent]

Breaking on the Huff and Beeb

[originalbiglymavis]

Not even a terrorist. He had no ideology or demands. The end goal was death. Just a moronic, violent, criminal thug, fed lies of redemption through violence.

[Doyouwantabrew]

Yes agree

[FlappinSwazy]

//www.gofundme.com/melissaandkurt

This is the link for Kurt and Meilissa (the American's). Someone asked for it.

Sorry - when I asked for links I didn't anticipate it turning into a debate about how people donate their money, or the insensitive comments that followed.

[FrenchLavender]

Yes he is Do people can define as any religion they like and if he converted to Islam and called himself a Muslim then he is a Muslim, however uncomfortable that might make other Muslims feel.

Plenty of people of all faiths are not good or nice people, they are flawed, bad, cruel, mad and frequently misguided. That doesn't mean they aren't devout, in their own sad, pathetic warped little way.

[originalbiglymavis]

I can call myself Jewish after reading a couple of batshit crazy books by some extremis loony but that doesn't make me Jewish to 99.9% of Jewish people you ask. It's not like you have to pass an exam or get a certificate.

[PigletWasPoohsFriend]

Sorry - when I asked for links I didn't anticipate it turning into a debate about how people donate their money, or the insensitive comments that followed.

You have nothing to be sorry for.

Thank you for the link.

[Elendon]

Yes, thank you for the link Flappin

So sad to see some nasty comments btl. But I echo the sentiments of her brother who set it up. He would rather have them both alive and well than do this. So tragic.

[FrenchLavender]

Well presumably he didn't just decide to call himself a Muslim but actually went through the religious instruction and process required to convert to Islam, overseen by an Imam, or whatever it is that has to happen, in which case he WAS a Muslim.

The question isn't whether he was a Muslim, because clearly he was. The question is whether he was a decent person with a good heart and a healthy, well balanced, non-extremist mindset.. Clearly he wasn't.

He was a warped, angry, bitter, pathetic, sick fuck. But he was a Muslim.

[originalbiglymavis]

People bitching about donations are jealous of the money? That says so much about them and their attitude to money over human life. I suspect they wouldn't be first in line with to donate a kidney unless they were being paid.

[SexTrainGlue]

"Are you really that lacking in compassion? Seriously?"

No.

I had taken the post to which I was responding to mean that there was already an identified an immediate need. It was not intended to be any wider comment on any instinct to reach out, whether by sending condolences, cash, laying flowers or attending vigils.

[Masher]

Does it add an extra layer of concern that he was a teacher for anyone else? I can't think of a job that I'd be more uncomfortable with a terrorist doing then teaching.

I was reading late last night and I understood he was teaching in an Islamic school - what I couldn't understand was whether it was an Islamic school that was registered with the government or one that was allowed to run out of homes and mosques.

I see there have been two more "significant" arrests over night.

My thoughts are also with the family and friends of the latest fatality.

[FrenchLavender]

He wasn't a teacher. Apparently he lied about that. If he did teach then it must have been in some private school that flew beneath the radar. He had no formal teaching qualifications.

[PigletWasPoohsFriend]

Does it add an extra layer of concern that he was a teacher for anyone else?

They are using the term very very very losely

[FrenchLavender]

Ah, sorry didn't read your post in full. Yes I imagine any 'teaching' was in some dodgy Islamic free school where the national curriculum was largely ignored anyway.

[DorotheaBeale]

I think the BBC are saying there's no record, that they've been able to find, of him ever teaching in a UK state school. But he seems to have used several different names over the course of his life, so it may take time to piece together his whole story. And the police understandably aren't revealing everything they know.

[originalbiglymavis]

On the radio they suggested he had lived in Saudi and taught English.

[Doyouwantabrew]

Flapping you have nothing to apologise for.

But French just identifying as a Muslim or any religion does not make it so. You follow the teachings of peace and good will etc otherwise you are not a follower of that religion at all.

Self identifying does not make it so.

[AlPacinosHooHaa]

Goodness so another who was radicalized in Saudi, When are we going to get tough on Saudi as far as I am aware, huge percentage of this tripe is emanating from Saudi, and infact they are not far from ISIS IN interpretation of Islam.

[Valentine2]

They will never get tough on Saudis. It's all jolly good when the rich friends are involved.
Well, the rich friends rountinely use terrorism to keep their public under their thumb. And the same rich friends are buying half of London.
I sometimes despair of the future of this country.

[AlPacinosHooHaa]

Well some people ie Boris have been outspoken about it.
I understand its not a black and white situation, and we need to work with them but something has to be done by the same token.

Much of this poison comes from there and anyone who saw the undercover saudi documentary last year would see how dreadful the regime is.

[tiredvommachine]

Sorry for biting yesterday but the extreme shift between support and condemnation is breathtaking and I'd reached saturation point.
Nobody deserves to die like this.

Yes, I pay into my pension and life insurance but 14 years of front line have taken a huge toll on my health and family.

I don't care if I'm worth more dead, I want to bring my kids up.

[PigletWasPoohsFriend]

tiredvommachine

You really don't have to apologise. In my DBro role he was one of those first one the scene in 7/7. Some of the insensitive things people said and still do are breathtaking.

Stay safe.

[Doyouwantabrew]

tired you have no need to apologise. I think most people are good and decent and it's just s tiny minority who are just plain stupid. And those people are the cowards who arnt fit to lick the boots of the likes of you and first responders on Wednesday

[FrenchLavender]

You follow the teachings of peace and good will etc otherwise you are not a follower of that religion at all.

What about following the other teachings? The bits that are not all about peace and goodwill? If it's written down in your holy book of choice and you choose to follow it, does that not make you a follower of that religion? Even when you choose to follow the less palatable teachings to the letter? Or are you only a proper Muslim if you cherry pick the nice bits?

[originalbiglymavis]

There's always the get out clauses of 'innocent' and 'unbeliever'. Daesh justify murder, rape and enslavement of the yazidis on this basis, and the rape of children on a warped self interpretation of religious texts.

I could take the telephone​ directory and create a mad religion out of it where I am queen cat and my subjects have to rub my belly and bring me saucers of cream under fear of a cruel death and eternal damnation.