Calling all Spartacus! Jenni needs us!

[iloveruby]

Am shamelessly posting in AIBU for traffic.

On Sunday Jenni Murray from woman's hour wrote an article saying that transwomen aren't women.

Full article here: www.thetimes.co.uk/article/trans-females-can-never-be-real-women-says-jenni-murray-ht0xhcvrs

In light of the inevitable backlash that Jenni will / is receiving there are a number of efforts to show our support for her.

One of which is co-signing a letter to the BBC. The letter is below and anyone who would like to add their support please message me with your name and you will be added.

"There will undoubtedly be calls for Jenni Murray to leave her position with the BBC following her article of 5th March in the Sunday Times about trans women.
Whether her comments were ‘hurtful’ as Stonewall claim is irrelevant. Murray was bravely sharing her experience as a woman, a feminist and a broadcaster who has navigated a male-dominated society to enjoy a successful career.
Of course trans women have their own hurdles, but those who have spent their formative years as men will not understand the impact of the casual and institutional sexism that women are born into. That some trans women feel justified in wanting to silence Murray speaks volumes about the reality of the different ways men and women are taught and expected to behave.
It is perhaps noteworthy that Murray has made these remarks at the age of 66 with a robust and respected career to bolster her. How many others share her thoughts but are prevented from speaking out for fear of causing offence and sparking a hostile reaction?
To date the BBC has been remiss in its duty to 'educate, inform and entertain’ regarding the ideology behind gender identity. It seems the lobbying activities of groups such as Stonewall and Transmedia Watch have stymied debate, and vilified those who do not share the same viewpoint.
We stand in support of Jenni Murray, and in support of free speech. Please do not cave into the demands to end Murray’s career. The BBC has few older women in positions of seniority, and it would be to the detriment of both audiences and the reputation of the BBC if you were to remove her from post.
Yours"

I am not the author of the letter - that is an amazing women on facebook called Maggie who has organised this.

If anyone would like to add their name directly via facebook let me know and I will send you the link.

I am Spartacus! I am Jenni!

I will not sign this.
Intersectional feminism is inclusive of tran people because ignoring them is just playing into the patriarchal view of gender. Gender is not biologically binary. Across the world there are many different expressions of biological gender. Do a bit of research on genetics & you will discover that. Trying to make everyone fit into it is just another oppressive tool in the work bag of toxic masculinity.

I'm no expert but in the little I have read I have managed to see behind the bluster. National Geographic have some excellent articles on gender.

If you are in a position of power, authority or have status or privilege (Jenni) and you use that position to cast doubt upon another marginalised group, using your opinion & not amplifying the voices of people who are actually from that marginalised group, shame on you, you are no better than the men who oppress women.

Isn't Stonewall about sexuality? What has a person's sexuality got to do with trans? Can someone please explain this to me?

There is no such thing as biological gender. That's fake news. You cannot merge biology and gender. The sun might seem to revolve around the earth, but science tells us differently.

WHAT?

Stating that the lived experience of a woman born female and socialised as a girl is qualitatively different from the lived experience of a woman born male and socialised as a boy ... that's as bad as misogyny?

Fuck me sideways. I thought it was as self-evident as remarking that someone's experience of London will vary depending on whether they grew up there or in Norfolk.

Also intersectional feminism should be inclusive of females who do not want men in their private spaces, and those women included should get to define who is and who isn't a man. Their views should be listened to.

Rakey
Another waiting to know what biological gender is?
How do you define a female?

Gender is not biologically binary.

Gender is a social construct. Socially, you can have as many genders as you want, but it doesn't erase biology. Binary means two things. In the case of mammal biology it is male (penis) female (vulva).

Have used the letter to send a complaint direct to the BBC. Could you also pm me the facebook link please?
x

Please can someone post the fb link on this thread?
Jenni Murray deserves our support in this.

Could someone please send me the FB link? I'll send a BBC complaint now

Bev I'm actually nervous. Never had an interest in clothes, hairstyles, make up, shoes, shopping, rom com, ponies etc Bit worried I'm going to outed as a gay man!

NotCaryl quick drinking the kool aid and actually read what people are saying rather than simply shouting BIGOT! TRANSPHOBE!

I'm no expert but in the little I have read I have managed to see behind the bluster. National Geographic have some excellent articles on gender.

Clearly not an expert if your go to is the National Geographic.

I've written a direct complaint to the BBC but I know that it will be dismissed on past complaints.

How do we sign the letter?

Diana pm the OP with your real name.

ignoring them is just playing into the patriarchal view of gender.

If you actually stop and think about it, this is what the TRAs are doing. They are putting so much emphasis on looking/feeling/acting like a woman (whatever the fuck that entails) and ignoring the fact that the outer 'image' is irrelevant. A human with XY chromosomes in a dress does not equal a woman. But that is what they seem to be arguing.

They are tieing themselves up in all sorts of knots

Thanks Barbarian

Bev you're a straight man coz your dp is a woman... I think. No. he's a lesbian woman and you're a...

Oh fuck it I dunno. Feelz and stuff.

I have aspergers, have little emotion and think logically, I dress quite androgynously, don't do typically female activities or interests (apart from a bit of crochet) and I'm not scared of mice - am I a gay or a heterosexual man? Do I have to buy washable sanitary towels with little skulls on for when I get my manstruation?

....or maybe I'm a genderqueer butch lesbian (I do like comfortable shoes). Is that a thing?

My this kool aid is tasty

I've sent you a PM OP.

I will telephone the BBC complaints line today to show my support and complain about their actions. Can not do so on social media for fear of my job.

Instead of retaliating, consider how you would feel if you discovered that your son actually identified as a girl & look at all the hatred they would be up against. This isn't something you can say "no I don't agree" and it will go away. Trans people's lives are in danger the more we perpetuate hurtful ideas.

You can attack me for using incorrect language. I can take it. But can you live with your ideas contributing to the increased suicide amongst trans people, the incredible rate of violence and sexual assault on trans women. The stigma in work places that mean many trans people lose their jobs or get turned down for jobs they are fully capable of doing.

Ask yourself a question: is your ideas about what constitutes a woman more important to you than a trans woman's life?