To think most Dubai naysayers are hypocrites

[WhisperedLoudest]

Not at TAAT more a TAA lot of threads.

Repeatedly on MN people say they'd never go to Dubai because of Human Rights issues at the same time as announcing they'd much rather go to do yoga in India or sightseeing in Morocco.

It seems rather hypocritical and an attitude that is very particular to Dubai and I suspect something to do with being perceived as trashy not disagreeing there

So if you have objections to Dubai on moral grounds where do you go? Do you apply same strict standard to other countries.

I've often asked on those threads where people do go but never received much of a response.

Great article in the Telegraph - some fantastic lines in there

Exactly, red, doing the right thing is always right, even when no-one see it (and I'm atheist, so not doing it for god either).

There probably are nice old villages etc -

My point is 1. Way too hot for me (that's just personal preference, no judgement on the place itself, I live 60 degrees north and start grumbling when it passes 20C ;)

1. A woman by herself would not be able to potter out and explore without significant fear of harassment.

I've been to an awful lot of countries and lived abroad in several - Dubai or UAE or anywhere in the ME (and several other places) is not for me. Neither is turkey or Egypt - both places I've visited /worked in and found to be not great for a woman by herself, however modestly dressed.

I'm sure lots of people would hate to live where I do - it's fucking dark four months of the year and we have snow on the ground for six. It's rarely warm. But I like it. I'm not keen on the ME. Just personal preference.

Being female, I definitely have no interest whatsoever in going to Dubai.
Why would I want to go to a country that seems to see women as second class citizens and unequal?
I feel the same about any country that's the same, not just Dubai.

A woman by herself would not be able to potter out and explore without significant fear of harassment.

Ummm.. I do all the time...Like every single day. I've yet to be harassed in Dubai. In Doha, Qatar, yes I was. But not once in the 6 years I've been in the UAE.

And Sonjadog- yes, western countries grew rich on slavery/colonialism/oppression.

And some people come from families who have a history of opposing those things at the time, or who have been politically/socially involved themselves in the current day to combat the legacy of that/continue the struggle for human freedom and dignity.

It might be as simple as signing Wilberforce's petition, or it could be as frontline as being deported for organising a proto-trade union, today it could be being committed to the fair trade movement or helping people escape modern day people trafficking. But lots of people do stand up and either refuse to participate in something wrong, or actively work to bring it down, or put their shoulders to the wheel in building and maintaining something better.

That's how things change.

Are holidays not about beaches, shopping, good food and relaxation

For you obviously. For me, food and relaxation yes, beaches maybe but I hate hot weather. Shopping doesn't feature on holiday for me at all.

Tell yourself everyone else is a hypocrite; I wont go anywhere that DV is legal or that flogs rape victims.

Its not snobbery, its basic human decency.

Yes, I agree. I wrote something similar upthread.

Bollocks to being a woman and not being able to go out alone, complete bullshit!
I've spent plenty of time walking, visiting friends, going to mosques, shopping, swimming and running and NEVER been harassed, it's very safe, attitudes to women are incredibly respectful as opposed to Italy/greece/UK where men are so fucking rude, catcalling in the street, winding down car windows and hollering disgusting sexual comments.
You know that video that's gone viral of the builders in the van shouting at the female cyclist in London? She then goes nuts and rips his wing mirror off? That would NEVER happen in Dubai....

Benidorm.

Or Centre Parcs.

So why then are you objecting to people vocally refusing to be part of something unjust Sonjadog...why can't this be there little bit of something to be passionate about?

People who go to Dubai for a break are often vulgar types.

Although I'd never go to center parcs again, full of the most boring middle class wannabes and there insufferable badly behaved brats, kidding themselves they're in the countryside because they've paid a thousand pounds for 3 nights in a dirty butlins-esque chalet.....

Alice212
Out of curiosity, why do you include Malta on your list?

Bloggybollocks - I thought that video was a set-up?

My exh is Moroccan and I've seen some horrible treatment over there of both people and animals although I was pleased to see a report last year that a young man has finally started an education programme to get people to treat their donkeys and mules better

I wouldn't go to KSA and think they're just as bad as Trump for not letting people in somewhere for religious reasons

I don't know gleam bud when I was out running through Manchester recently a van driver shouted 'let me suck on your tits love' through the window and that's never happened to me in Dubai!

My objections to Dubair aren't on an ethical level, it's because there's bugger all to do apart from shopping and lying on a beach. I'd die of boredom.

Lots of people still saying they would never go to Dubai but not so many saying where they would go.

I've spent a lot of time in UAE (and the rest of the world) for work. My current country count is around 70 and it's very difficult to not find fault with the majority of those.

I've never made a decision not to travel on moral grounds. I stopped going to Iraq a few years back but that was on basis of safety and I wouldn't travel to large parts of Africa currently, again for safety so I suppose I'm interested to know for those that do make a moral decision what the tipping point is.

I feel strongly against, for example, FGM, death penalty and am pro access to abortion and gay rights. Obviously if I only travelled to countries which held similar views I'd not have got anywhere near 70.

So should it be an absolute. E.g. I won't go anywhere that outlaws homosexuality or are their exceptions e.g if they have a rich cultural heritage?

Well I looked it up and apparently it was 'factually incorrect'.

Brasty - slavery built Europe and the US. So I take it you stay at home in the holidays yeah?

TheLittlePaperPrincess: because to me signing the Wilberforce petition or being involved in the activism you describe is actually doing something about the issue. While to me, making sneary comments about someone´s trip to Dubai from what people think is their superior ethical standpoint is immensely annoying. Especially when I think that their superior ethical view is in fact based on a very narrow view of the world and of history.

But we can agree to disagree. I would never want to live in a world where everyone is in agreement anyway.

Yes slavery built the UK and US. But neither of those countries have slaves and have not had for a long time. Dubai still has virtual slaves.