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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

FAKE news, LIES, fake lies. We need the Trump Oracle.

999 replies

Lweji · 26/02/2017 13:23

A new thread. From
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/2862265-Were-only-showing-Ami-the-good-news-now-to-keep-her-sweet-Its-another-Trump-thread?watched=1&msgid=67235918#67235918

OP posts:
Thread gallery
25
amispartacus · 27/02/2017 08:39

www.nytimes.com/2017/02/26/us/politics/trump-budget.html

WASHINGTON — President Trump will instruct federal agencies on Monday to assemble a budget for the coming fiscal year that includes sharp increases in Defense Department spending and drastic enough cuts to domestic agencies that he can keep his promise to leave Social Security and Medicare alone, according to four senior administration officials.

The budget outline will be the first move in a campaign this week to reset the narrative of Mr. Trump’s turmoil-tossed White House.

A day before delivering a high-stakes address on Tuesday to a joint session of Congress, Mr. Trump will demand a budget with tens of billions of dollars in reductions to the Environmental Protection Agency and State Department, according to four senior administration officials with direct knowledge of the plan. Social safety net programs, aside from the big entitlement programs for retirees, would also be hit hard.

I know the budget has to be passed - West Wing taught me that.

Natsku · 27/02/2017 08:41

Anyone linked this? m.dailykos.com/stories/2017/2/26/1637660/-On-Tuesday-House-Republicans-Will-Betray-Their-Oaths-Their-Country-And-The-American-People?Salzillo

I expect attention will be drawn away from this on Tuesday.

TheClaws · 27/02/2017 08:55

Why does the budget have to be passed, ami? Forgive me, I don't know the ins and outs of US bureaucracy and I haven't seen the West Wing

PausingFlatly · 27/02/2017 08:57

The series of tweets indirectly linked by Cussing way above are a good read, so I'm going to repost them here in case they're ephemeral (sorry, I don't really understand Twitter). Apologies to the author if I'm breaching copyright, I just want this should be preserved. Bolding is mine.

Anand GiridharadasVerified account
‏*@AnandWrites*
I am shocked by the murder of Srinivas Kuchibhotla in Kansas, and want to share some things I learned reporting on a similar crime in Texas.
7:58 pm - 24 Feb 2017

Like the Kansas attacker, Mark Stroman of Dallas thought he was targeting Middle Easterners, and thought he was protecting America.

President Trump's administration has quickly leapt to say his talk and actions have nothing to do with this crime.

I would like to explain why the president is dead wrong on this one. He has everything to do with this, and I can explain.

What I learned reporting on the Stroman spree, which occurred right after 9/11, is how such an act is dependent on circles of enablement.

Frankly, Stroman wasn't intellectually sophisticated enough to channel his anger in this direction on his own. He needed help.

When I reviewed his letters, prison writings and blog posts, what amazed me was how he had stolen so much language from his social betters.

It mattered greatly what politicians and pundits said, because it gave his inchoate drifter emotions a purpose and a narrative.

He heard talk of "enemy combatants" on the news. He was inspired by that to call himself an "allied combatant."

So many of his phrases were borrowed from Fox News. He was a man without purpose all his life. This borrowed language gave him purpose.

These stories are so often of drifting lives electrified by a sense of having to save one's country. That call to save comes from on high.

Here's the thing. Stroman had no explicit support in 2001 from the highest levels of U.S. power. But the Kansas killer did. From @ POTUS.

W. Bush explicitly praised Islam and supported Muslims. Trump has explicitly degraded them and called them a problem. People hear that.

Trump makes the statements and goes back to his chefs and jet. But there are aimless Americans who take the words as a summons to greatness.

Part of being a leader is understanding how what you say will be used, how it will refract into other lives. That explains Bush's remarks.

Based on my reporting on Stroman, I can say that Trump has supplied more permission than Stroman ever received back in 2001.

Trump not only identifies and exaggerates this threat to America. He also keeps talking down our institutional capacity to respond to it.

Please understand, Mr. President, that this too gives permission, by dog-whistling to drifters that they might do what the government can't.

Stroman was deeply motivated by the idea that the government wasn't going to be tough after 9/11. So he had to be.

So when @ Potus denigrates our intel services and says he knows more than the generals, out there in America it empowers the hate criminal.

When he spreads his idea of Americanness-as-whiteness, he and his rich friends can laugh about the brilliant tactic. But people listen.

And a small fraction of those who listen will arm themselves and go to war. And people will die. And the president should sleep on that.

.@ potus understood one thing well: millions of Americans felt punched down upon for a generation. Some were right.

But now he answers their feelings not by shielding them or helping, but by diverting blame from those who screwed them to those who didn't.

So the answer to those who felt punched down upon is the chance for them now to punch down at others. That isn't leadership. It's the WWF.

U.S. elites did long neglect middle- and working-class folks. The remedy isn't giving them permission to hate and sometimes kill immigrants.

In other words, the least vulnerable Americans screwed the middlingly vulnerable, and Trump's answer is a war against the most vulnerable.

Goldman guy cost Scranton guy his house and hours, and now brown, Muslim & immigrant communities are attacked. Goldman guy's in the cabinet.

Wake up. The only people who are winning from this are the people who caused the problem. We cannot go to war against each other. Stop it.

Because our president may keep giving this hate-permission, your voice matters. Drown the permission out. Tell people they are welcome.

Stroman was persuadable. He heard more voices inspiring him to kill than inspiring him to love. Change their calculus. Goodnight. With love.

twitter.com/anandwrites/status/835338124859441153

CaveMum · 27/02/2017 08:57

ami is this a special budget or standard after an election? Can the Government go into shutdown if this one isn't passed?

CaveMum · 27/02/2017 09:03

TheClaws wash your mouth out! You must much West Wing! It's a bit dated in places now (late 90s for the first few series) but it stands the test of time in the main and helps you to understand how the Government functions.

If a budget isn't passed by the House it can force the Government into "shutdown". It means all Government funding ceases immediately, so no benefit payments are made, all federal employees will not be paid, Government supported organisations will not receive grants, etc. They did it to Obama in 2013, refusing to pass his budget without certain amendments. The shutdown lasted 15 days.

Natsku · 27/02/2017 09:21

Thanks for posting that series of tweets Pausing Trump really has given people cause to think that they can go and do things and that'll make them heroes of America. Very worrying.

Must admit, I've never watched West Wing either hides

PausingFlatly · 27/02/2017 09:38

Can't look out my sources at the moment, but there's a lot of campaigning against deportations in the UK. Including the Scottish groups who turn out before dawn and surround tower blocks to prevent deportation.

I'll try to post on this more later.

SanFranBear · 27/02/2017 09:40

All you West Wing deniers Shock it's obviously an intelligent, witty look at US politics with a decent dollop of education in there but it's also got Rob Lowe and Bradley Whitford which make it pleasing to the eye.

The fact they hated each other in real life I think stands as a testament to their acting skills Smile I also have a very soft spot for Richard Shiff... and Alison Janning!

I started rewatching it on the eve of the election in November to distract myself from what was unfolding in real life. I wish we had a Jeb Bartlett in office - he is the polar opposite to Scrotus in every single way!!

TheClaws · 27/02/2017 09:44

Mum Sorry, I won't do that again... Grin Seriously, I will try to get hold of some box sets. And thanks for explaining the budget!

amispartacus · 27/02/2017 09:58

Sean Spicer dismissed any correlation as absurd. Just like most people who aren't affected by hate crime dismiss any concerns over language and then say that freedom of speech is under attack.

They are not the ones afraid of the actions of people inspired by the rhetoric. They are not the ones whose rights are taken away. The ones who are at the receiving end of violence. The shooting in Orlando. Inspired by someone who had been taught to hate LGBT people. Who had been radicalized. Is Trump radicalising people?

WorshipTheGourd · 27/02/2017 10:10

Marking place.
Also wanting to note my disgust at the UK home Office and May.
I was in touch with a friend in Mexico recently and we were discussing the situation. He asked 'if everyone in the UK agreed with the UK govts appeasement and stance on 'foreigners'. I felt so embarrassed to be British. Sad

Natsku · 27/02/2017 10:53

Was in the library on Saturday and noticed they had recently added 1984 to their small collection of English language books Grin Had to get it out of course to re-read it now.

BiglyBadgers · 27/02/2017 10:55

The thing is May is smarter than Trump. Everyone knows what Trump is doing because he shouts and tweets about it. I think the problem in the UK is that many people just aren't aware of the deportations and conditions people are being held in. The conservatives are very adept at sneaking things through when people are distracted or hiding key legislation in seemingly unremarkable bills. In a way the issue in America are also serving to shine a light on UK practices. A lot of people who are shouting how terrible Trump's policies are are now realising we have our own issues and are shocked by this. I hope we will now hear more about the UK's horrendous immigration policies.

Lweji · 27/02/2017 11:09

I just couldn't watch the Oscars last night, but have just finished watching my recording.
Rigged.
Kimmel actually tweeted Donald on stage. So, some digs were very direct.
Off to see what else has happened in the world.

OP posts:
Destinysdaughter · 27/02/2017 11:14

Pausing thanks for copying that here, very well articulated. Words matter.

peaceout · 27/02/2017 11:21

The thing is May is smarter than Trump
He does set an extraordinarily low bar though doesn't he😂

Destinysdaughter · 27/02/2017 11:25

This is interesting, a course for white pp to help the them deal with their internalized racism and 'toxic whiteness'

www.independent.co.uk/life-style/toxic-whiteness-healing-white-people-internalised-racism-woman-sandra-kim-new-york-a7595216.html

BiglyBadgers · 27/02/2017 11:39

From that article about the course:

“The course is really about helping people of European descent heal from whiteness imposed on them without their consent and so to free themselves from it, so they don't have to be a white person in a racist society but a human being who cares about systemic violence happening in their name.”

This strikes me as the sort of thing middle class white lefties (like me in fact) will go to so they can convince themselves how awfully more open and better than everyone else they are. It is preaching to the converted and won't actually deal with the problem of people getting shot by fascists. Hmm

amispartacus · 27/02/2017 11:39

West Wing

Shut it down

Bartlet vs Congress on taxes

amispartacus · 27/02/2017 11:42

This strikes me as the sort of thing middle class white lefties

Libtards? Social Justice warriors? Virtue signallers. Those are the words used against those people who want to try to make the world a better place for all.

Destinysdaughter · 27/02/2017 11:48

I used to be a trainer for a national charity and I once did some equality and diversity training for the police. On asked the question which groups are oppressed in British society, I got the answer 'white men'...Hmm

( followed by 'fox hunters!)

BiglyBadgers · 27/02/2017 11:49

Libtards? Social Justice warriors? Virtue signallers. Those are the words used against those people who want to try to make the world a better place for all.

And words that I have not used. I class myself as a middle class white lefty. I don't think the left, myself included, is above critisicm and sitting in a room full of white people talking about how awful it is being white and how terrible it is being racist, isn't it great that I am freeing myself from this horror, is in my view something we have a tendency to do. It makes us feel better about ourselves, but in the end it has a feel of putting the focus on us and not on the people who are actually getting shot right now.

amispartacus · 27/02/2017 11:54

It makes us feel better about ourselves, but in the end it has a feel of putting the focus on us and not on the people who are actually getting shot right now

I've been called all those things on Twitter. I am NOT just raising awareness for other people. I am raising awareness because it affects me personally. It's amazing how many people on Twitter think that I am acting as a social justice warrior and virtue signalling. No - I am discussing this and challenging people because it affects ME personally.

When I tell them this, they suddenly stop calling me SJWs or whatever.

BiglyBadgers · 27/02/2017 11:59

I think that's the difference I am trying to get at though. I have also been accused of these things and that is exactly why this has annoyed me a bit. This is not someone going out and educating people who would not have known or been involved. These courses are not being done for the police or people convicted of violent crime. They are a self selecting group of people who are for the most part already involved in activism and well aware of the issues, or they would not be there. I am sure they all do amazing work, but I think this particular course is potentially going to increase the myth of the left an as insular, self-interested bubble and I don't think that helps when we are trying to convince people to take us seriously.