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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To ask you honestly if you think my DD is badly behaved?

465 replies

tickettostruggling · 26/02/2017 08:24

DD is 3, and I used to think a lot of her behaviour was normal for this age. I still think it's normal but I wonder if DD is maybe at an extreme end and I wonder if its my parenting Sad I definitely don't want soft soaping here so please give it to me straight.

  • tantrums, I know, normal for this age group but they last such an unbelievably long time and are so forceful. She honestly screams as if she is being murdered. Anything and nothing sets them off, things like buttoning her cardigan the wrong way, putting a blue hair bow in and she wanted purple.
  • rudeness (this upsets me most) she is not a polite little girl. We were at a party the other day and she was given a "prize." She responded with a foot stamp and a loud "noooooooo NOOOOOOOOOOO I want THAT one." She couldn't have "that" one so she just kept screaming. It was a gift Sad She has done this before if anyone gives her anything, so embarrassing.
  • won't walk anywhere for long periods, she has to be carried and only by me, not DH or one of my friends. I've stood for an hour telling her to walk but she doesn't give up. It's definitely about being close to me not tiredness as alternatives like DH carrying her, standing on the buggy board, don't work.
  • sleep, she's always been a bad sleeper and it's not improving, she wakes several times in the night and again it is me she wants.

It sounds awful but it's putting a strain on our relationship as DH thinks (he doesn't say so explicitly but it's obvious) I have "caused" this and I think maybe I have as I was very into the whole gentle parenting thing when she was born. We were at the zoo the other day and DH suddenly walked away with other DC when she was whining and crying. I asked him what was wrong and he said "I wanted to smack her, and I felt awful for wanting to smack her, but I did." I knew what he meant. Obviously I don't want to smack her but I do feel like she's making us all and more importantly herself miserable right now.

Any advice? Sad

OP posts:
dotdotdotmustdash · 26/02/2017 10:22

When my Dc were young I had a friend with a similar set of Dc to mine. Her kids behaved very poorly, ran around the furniture in homes and restaurants, tantrummed often and spoke very disrespectfully to adults and she would do very little to correct them. My children weren't angels, but I was a firm parent and they both knew not to behave that way and would sit and watch their friends in amazement.

I broke contact with the mother, but our children went through school together. Fast-forward lots of years and my two are both in Higher Education with a good set of school results and both of hers left at 16 and are still trying to find something that suits them. The elder has had problems with drugs and theft. This sounds really smug, but it's borne out what I and others thought back when they were little - it would only get worse.

oklumberjack · 26/02/2017 10:22

Ticket, let go of that fear straight away. Your dd knowing that YOU are in charge, YOU make the rules will make her feel safe. Honestly.

You will still give her all the love.

KittyVonCatsington · 26/02/2017 10:24

What about emotionally hurt ticket? What about the child who's party it was that she kicked off and made a scene? It doesn't have to just mean the physical bad behaviour is awful. All bad behaviour has consequences. For example, how much is she affecting your other DC's lives? Your lives?

gerbo · 26/02/2017 10:25

Grainofsalt has it, worded perfectly.

I would sit the family down together and explain that you're having a family meeting. Say that you and dh have decided (together, emphasise you're a team) to have some new rules when behaviour is unacceptable in your family. Not specifically getting at her, just setting out your stall. Maybe walk the children to the designated 'thinking step', explain consequences such as removal of TV for the day, toys going away, etc.

Also I would introduce a marble jar for positives - worked a treat for us. One marble perhaps per day if she's got through it without "crying crossly" or however you want to word it. Or a marble per morning, afternoon and evening, three a day. Full jar means daddy walks her to shop for treat.

I think your daughter's behaviour is a response to the lack of boundaries in place, it's her way of showing you she needs them.

Good luck!

oklumberjack · 26/02/2017 10:27

Gerbo, I think that's a great idea.

atheistmantis · 26/02/2017 10:28

I'd be pretty shocked by the rudeness if I saw that in a 3 year old but only if you had ignored it, I'd have been inclined to take her home.

mygorgeousmilo · 26/02/2017 10:30

The thing is OP, that by saying that she was injected with awkward behaviour at birth, you are making it sound like it's still not in your control. Read what people have said about listening to your daughter when she's NOT being naughty, showing her live and affection while she's doing well, giving her lots of praise. She won't hate you for telling her off! Children absolutely need boundaries to understand that there's a person who knows what to do and is the authority on things that she knows nothing about. It's why she can't vote! Imagine being at work in a high pressure environment, and your boss never knows the answer to anything, and when you ask how to manage something, she says it's up to you - but you make it clear you're out of your depth and have never trained on said subject. You would feel so stressed, and you'd be pissed off with your boss for not taking charge. You are the boss, I know people don't like that when referring to parent/children dynamics, but it's true. You have to lead, and the buck stops with you, you are the top tier of responsibility.

KERALA1 · 26/02/2017 10:31

Some really good advice on this thread - mumsnet at its best.

The sad thing about this well intentioned lack of boundaries/gentle thing is how it actually disadvantages your child as they can be in turn unpleasant to be around for their peers and other adults examples on this thread. Ironic that in seeking to be so kind and nice to and foster a good relationship you end up hampering them.

atheistmantis · 26/02/2017 10:31

dotdot unfortunately sometimes firm parenting is not enough, a friend of mine has three DCs who are all very bright. The eldest and the youngest are lovely children, well mannered, work hard, do well at school and the middle child is rude, disrespectful and can't be bothered with school. Nothing happened in their life to have an impact on the middle child, it's just how they are. They've all had firm parenting.

gamerwidow · 26/02/2017 10:32

I think this is all on the extreme end of normal.
In fact it sounds very much like Dd at 3. She was on the naughty step more than she was off at that age.
We just removed her from the situation and let her cry it out when she tantrumed at that age. I remember having to lock her in the car at that age while I stood outside for 30 minutes until she stopped screaming and thrashing enough to put her in her car seat. She could not be reasoned with or reassured mid tantrum if you touched her or talked to her it fed the tantrum and made it worse we just had to put on on the stairs or in her room and leave her until she calmed down then give her a big cuddle at the end. She also never slept and it was tiredness and frustration which caused the problems I think. She is six now and everyone at school tells us what a lovely sweet natured easy going child see is. Just keep going, be firm and consistent but let her know she is loved too. It'll pass.

Original poster
tickettostruggling · 26/02/2017 10:32

I was just joking, milo, I know :)

I really am overwhelmed with gratitude for your posts.

Re DH - he works long hours so he can go days with only briefly seeing the children in the morning when it's always a bit chaotic Shock

OP posts:
Silverthorn · 26/02/2017 10:33

Gentle parenting doesn't mean no discipline or boundaries. Its just means the child is treated as a human being with some big, new emotions, trying to figure out how everything works.
I like to offer to hug it out.
Sometimes they don't want to do anything because they're tired.
If he refuses to walk, I find something exciting to look at further along the path, puddles, a ladybird, a house number. Or he may need to toilet/drink or is tired. One time he had a toy car in the toe of his wellies?! If you need to get somewhere quickly I use the pushchair.

KittyVonCatsington · 26/02/2017 10:33

A fab analogy gorgeousmilo!!

MiddleClassProblem · 26/02/2017 10:34

Nothing happened in their life to have an impact on the middle child how do you know that?

I'm not disagreeing with you, you have to adapt it to different personalities. Just like in adult life. You could say something to me and I would take offence but say the same thing to DH and he wouldn't think twice.

OrchardDweller · 26/02/2017 10:35

A bit late to a long thread but my DD was an awful tantrummer with a fiesty personality to match. We kept firm boundaries, believed in actions and consequences (and stuck to them) from a early age and picked our battles. It was really hard at times. We've always been strict on manners and age appropriate behaviour which may seem a bit formal these days but DD is 23 and is one of the nicest, kindest, loveliest, most considerate personI know and we have great, trusting relationship.

KittyVonCatsington · 26/02/2017 10:36

It can be so draining when you are doing a lot of this alone ticket if your DH works long hours but it also means you can start trying new techniques straight away as a lot of the immediate decisions will come from you

youarenotkiddingme · 26/02/2017 10:36

You HAVE to make the decision whether in the short term you are going to accept the "punishment" forced on others by leaving or whether you are happy for this to continue for many years to come.

My friend had the same mindset as you. She was also an "oh they're tired/hungry/bored" Her kids were the most angelic around other adults to the point they could make normally behaved children look bad. But they'd learnt the art of manipulation.
She's really regretting not putting in boundaries now they are teens.

We had a massive argument once because her kids were behaving appallingly around mine again I had enough of appeasing her kids to appease her feelings and was very firm that it stopped or they stopped coming around. She said "they misbehave around here because they aren't use to having so many boundaries" Hmm
The 'boundary' was not jumping on or drawing in furniture and soft furnishings.

They basically ran to her if asked to do anything - including picking up toys they'd got out.

Luckily our relationship survived but ime the relationships you have with other parents will suffer because you don't try and discipline not because your DD has a temper. Most reasonable adults realise you can't change someone's personality.

Birthdaypartyangstiness · 26/02/2017 10:37

Consequences are really important. If my 3 year old had behaved that way at a party, I would have given the prize back and removed them.

123 Magic is a good book, focussing on immediate natural consequences with a warning system.

KittyVonCatsington · 26/02/2017 10:38

Oh and as lots of posters have said, it may take a long long time for your DD to move past this but with consistency from your DH and you, she will learn that it's not ok and eventually stop

EdenX · 26/02/2017 10:41

If you would never allow her to be violent (that should include violence to you as well as other children) then presumably you are prepared to have some boundaries and consequences?

You can be kind and gentle and respectful and still have boundaries and teach your child to function in society. I don't smack and try not to shout but my DC certainly know when I am unhappy about their behaviour. Give limited choices (either say thank you for the party bag or have no party bag, either walk nicely or be strapped in the buggy) and follow through.

glitterazi · 26/02/2017 10:41

Consequences don't work for tantrums. Ask her if she wants a cuddle, if not, leave her to it.

Sorry, but Grin Grin Grin at that. Have you ever tried to cuddle a mid tantrum child?
Good luck with that when they're actually in a full on tantrum rage, they're beyond reasoning!
At 3, you're definitely not too young for consequences. In a cafe and they're playing up? Give them a chance to behave, and if they carry on, tell them if they don't stop they'll be going home.
If they don't, then home you go. Like you said you would.

Original poster
tickettostruggling · 26/02/2017 10:42

Thank you (again!) I agree this thread is "mumsnet at its best" Flowers

OP posts:
therealpippi · 26/02/2017 10:45

Ticket you will be a different parent and you will not give your dd the same childhood as yours whatever you do. But you do not have to go the total opposite from yours to atone for it. There's a middle way.

A child doesn't want to be frightened stiff of their parents but equally they do not want nor need a parent who isn't in charge, who doesn't show them the way, who doesn't teach them how to be and keep safe.

I remember a poster a while ago similar to yours but with a 16yo. What struck (and resonated with me) was that she was putting her daughter in unsafe situation because she was worried of being too strickt and not a friend. But to allow your dd to be somewhere where she may be in danger and have not the resources to fend for herself is not being a friend, is not helping.

Sometimes I had to send my dds to their bedroom to calm down etc, even at older ages. I did get "thank you mamma for helping me I don't know what was the matter" once we had a cuddle post tantrum and I could them reassure and explain. I think they then feel loved but understand some behaviour is unacceptable.

Having children triggers emotions linked with our childhood. I'd explire that.
I'd also try to discipline bit by bit. You'll get used to it especially when you see that dd will come back for you.

Giving boundaries doesn't mean being mean.

Astro55 · 26/02/2017 10:47

If you know the bows are triggers - get rid of them - lose them
Yes walk out of the party

Tell her she won't be carried - ever and stick with it - she has legs

People will be judging you for this constant giving in - and it's sad watching a grown up allowing themselves to be treated this way

Make a list

And stick with it

(In a side note - school won't put up with this - they get a choice and have to follow rules in school - the sooner you do this the Better she'll fit in)

Original poster
tickettostruggling · 26/02/2017 10:50

Yes, she is a delight at nursery. I don't foresee any issues with school. I was worried about nursery (and she has been to two different ones due to moving house) but she's been fine.

The bows aren't triggers. Only in the same way shoes are triggers, coats are triggers, car seats are triggers ... You get the picture :)

OP posts: