To dare speak about Vaxxed on MN?

[thegoodfight]

NC for this but a regular.

So I've just watched the documentary Vaxxed. I know how vaccine threads unfold on MN, so I'm ready to be told IABU however I feel like everyone should see this whatever your views - it's about the cover up around studies into autism and MMR

There is an admission from a CDC insider that he worked on the study and hid data which proved a link (a strong an quite frankly astounding one) and the data was sent to an external biologist who saw it for himself. There are first hand accounts from parents, scientists, doctors and politicians. The CDC haven't denied anything or called their lawyers despite it being an allegation of the biggest medical fraud ever (not exact words but something along those lines)

I just can't believe it's not been in the news! AIBU to ask if anyone else is planning to watch it??

Vaxxed is just another one of Wakefield's works of fiction. I'd rather watch my (autistic) son playing Minecraft quite frankly.

Andrew Wakefield went to Trump's Presidential Ball..............

Notanotherpawpatrol- not quite the same as he's only my brother. But as I'm 10 years older than him I was quite involved in his upbringing, and I enjoyed helping out.
I 100% agree with your statement- my brother showed signs of autism since before he had the mmr. (We didn't know at the time because we didn't know what to look for). But after the diagnosis, thinking back, the signs were all there.
I'd never not vaccinate. Ever. Sorry I just wanted to share that with you.

There was an article on R4 recently saying they have now found differences in brains of children (who go on to show signs of autism) at a very young age (a few weeks?? - can't remember exactly) way before there are any outward signs. If only I could remember what programme it was I'd quote it for you. The bit I heard was very interesting.

The trouble with MMR and autism is that the obvious signs of autism often start to be come more apparent at about the same age that the MMR is given. A coincidence - not a causal link.

Op have you seen the complications of measles and polio? I have, no way would i want my dc to go through that. Theres risks with everything including getting out of bed, crossing the road, childbirth, eatinh. The risk from the disease is millions times worse than any tiny risk from the vaccine. It might interest you to know that there are people in the uk living with the lasting effects of polio before the vaccine was introduced. They the lucky ones they survived unlike they playmates who also had this horrible disease. If you seen what its done to their body you be marching your dc to the gp for the vaccine now. I also know of one dc who at age 6 lost her legs to measles complications due to parents not vaccinating. I dread to think what her parents go through. Their later child was vaccined as normal.

There wasn't any MMR when I was a child. I got measles when I was 9 and still remember thinking I was going to die. I was so ill for about 3 weeks. Once i was over the worst I had some hearing loss and respiratory problems which I still have in my 50's.

When DD was a child there was the MMR vaccine. It was at the time of all the controversy about safety and i was so conflicted. In the end i paid for her to have the measles injection separately, privately. I wasn't so worried about the other two but measles I was desperate for her to have.

Now, with the autism link discredited I'd have a child given the MMR in a heartbeat. Measles can be scarily bad and a killer even in this country.

"Can anyone explain WHY there is this massive conspiracy? I mean people don't do things for no reason..."

There's a lot of money in single vaccines. And in all the hideous quackery around autism.

It's rather like watching Most Haunted and seeing it as absolute proof of ghosts existing.

Well put!

I don't think that anyone is suggesting that the MMR vaccine is the one and only cause of autism (for those saying that they know older people who are autistic/children who showed signs of it before vaccination.)

Mrsmortis, mumps isn't really considered to be a deadly disease. It is usually decscribed as a mild disease in children. Complications in adults are more common.

If society was more accepting and supportive of people with asd then perhaps we wouldn't end up depressed, isolated and unable to work or function well.

I'm treated like trash because of the way I am. I'm a virtual hermit now and only interact with others if I absolutely need to.

Society needs to stop regarding us as though we're a disease

And to this day I remember my Grandpa coming into my bedroom to see me and asking him to get a mirror so I could see what my face looked like (my Mum wouldn't let me see!). He got the bathroom hand mirror and I just burst into floods of tears as I was just covered in the most awful livid blotchy rash.

Oh and at the worst of it, I couldn't bear any light - had the curtains closed and couldn't read, look at anything for long as my eyes ached so badly. It truly is awful.

I didn't have the MMR - at the time, doctors were concerned about epilepsy in my family. I ended up getting measles and mumps in quick succession when I was about 7. I was quite seriously ill with the measles and totally miserable for weeks. Less so with the mumps. But when I got over it all, I'd lost a lot of my hearing and I still struggle today with the consequences of that.

thegoodfight Vaxxed is the work of the proven liar, discredited researcher, disabarred doctor and all round self aggrandising, money hungry, life wrecking twat Andrew Wakefield.

The very doctor that deliberately misled parents, lied to take biopsies from vulnerable children, deliberately falsified research evidence and went to America to continue making money out of his despicable behaviour.

That you want to understand more is laudable, but please, always check your sources. This one is a dangerous liar!

"If society was more accepting and supportive of people with asd then perhaps we wouldn't end up depressed, isolated and unable to work or function well. "

Well said. Society is geared up for NT people, and if you don't fit in, you're wrong.
There is more onus on autistic people adapting and fitting in than there is on NTs adapting and supporting their fellow humans who happen to be autistic.

All of my children have had the MMR and youngest will be getting it once old enough because a, there is no link between the MMR and ASD and b, I don't want them to catch a disease that I could feasibly protect them against. When the eldest three got chickenpox was bad enough, no way could I cope with them getting measles, mumps or rubella. One of my children is suspected to have ASD but he has been this way his whole life, MMR had nothing to do with it.

I've had the MMR jab eight times. I have no immunity to rubella so every time I have a related blood test (e.g., pregnancy) and it pops up that I have no immunity I have to have the MMR jab again. Eight flipping times. I am yet to suddenly develop ASD. Why? Because it's bullshit.

This conversation alone makes me so angry. It shouldn't be taking place, yet there are stupid people in the work that get their kicks out of making crap up and people who fall for it hook line and sinker because they don't do even just the basic research themselves (the film being directed by the discredited Dr case and point!
Autism and MMR is not a thing and it never will be a thing. Why is it still in the media all these ears later, why do people still believe that maybe there might be some truth in it and why is that EVIL man allowed to get away with making a programme and calling it a documentary rather than "random shit I like to spout to scare the shit out of parents so more children die"

That's true Cloud and research has demonstrated that autistic people who are forced to appear 'normal' are at higher risk of mental illness and suicide. It causes a huge amount of mental stress to try and adapt and the NT world is still not happy with us.

Quite a few people seem to think the Wakefield paper claimed things that it didn't.

Some quotes -

"We did not prove an association between measles, mumps, and rubella vaccine and the syndrome described. Virological studies are underway that may help to resolve this issue.
If there is a causal link between measles, mumps, and rubella vaccine and this syndrome, a rising incidence might be anticipated after the introduction of this vaccine in the UK in 1988. Published evidence is inadequate to show whether there is a change in incidence22 or a link with measles, mumps, and rubella vaccine.23 "

"We have identified a chronic enterocolitis in children that may be related to neuropsychiatric dysfunction. In most cases, onset of symptoms was after measles, mumps, and rubella immunisation. Further investigations are needed to examine this syndrome and its possible relation to this vaccine."

Link to the paper here

I don't think that anyone is suggesting that the MMR vaccine is the one and only cause of autism

But what some are suggesting, is that the risk of death is preferable to the risk of autism.

bumbleymummy - yes but when an adult gets mumps as many 15% of cases lead to meningitis (according to WHO data). Also if a pregnant woman gets it there is a 20% chance of a spontaneous abortion.

You aren't just vaccinating to protect the children. You are building a herd immunity to protect the whole population.

Alice, I don't see that either. Many people who choose not to give the MMR will give the single measles vaccine (which was available on the NHS at the time of the Wakefield press conference - it was withdrawn 6 months later).

Mrsmortis - viral meningitis.

The government in this country (U.K.) and governments / insurance companies in other countries have to provide so much provision for children and adults with autism.
My dd has ASD ( I knew well before she was 1)
To get her diagnosis she saw a
Health visitor
GP
Paediatrician
Audiologist
Ophthalmologist
Speech Therapist
Occupational therapist
Child development specialist
Specialist nursery nurse
And whoever else was in the MAAT
She still has speech therapy, occupational therapy, has a specialist 1:1 worker at school, she also revives DLA which we used to fund other therapies such as horse riding, private speech therapy etc as she only gets two weekly appointments.
Lots of children with autism also have Health Care Education plans which means that the local government pays money to their school each week to provide extra provision for them.

I personally am no fan of the government or any of the policical parties if I'm being honest, I think they're all corrupt bastards but I also think that if they genuinely knew something was wrong with the childhood vaccination program and it did cause autism they would find a way to change it.
Either the way it is made or administered, I don't necessarily think they would be open and honest about it and possibly even change it on the sly but I do believe if the vaccine genuinely caused autism they would change it and we know this hasn't happened as the schedule remains unchanged and autism rates are 'rising' not falling.

If the vaccine was to blame it would be far far cheaper for the governments worldwide to change the vaccine than it is for them to pay for all the long term provision children and adults with autism need, either leading up to assessment or after assessment.

I think it's really irresponsible when celebrities start saying they think vaccines cause autism when they know they are public figures who people will listen to. People like Robert De Niro, Jenny McCarthy and Jim Carey, who have all publicly slammed immunisations aren't medically trained professions they aren't scientists, they haven't dedicated their lives to research yet think they have the right to scare monger parents on an international scale based on their own personal views because of their international status, it's absolutely irresponsible.

Also my dd had the vaccine and she actually went on to develop measles due to the low uptake in my area, she 'only' got a milder version due to her having her immunisations but she was so poorly I wouldn't wish that on anyone.
She literally cried and screamed in pain all week holding her head because it hurt so much, she had a high temperature, she was so poorly I didn't know what to do with her, it was awful. She just sat in a nappy all week she was so hot covered in a rash crying in pain.

Anyone who would happily let their child get a worse version of that or would risk other children / adults who can't have the vaccine getting that ill or worse because some half wit celebrity or discredited doctor says its bad is an arsehole.

It also boils my piss when people think autism is so awful they'd rather risk their child dying than having the vaccine. I love my daughter with all my heart and wouldn't change her for the world and that's the truth but unfortunately society has become such a culture of lemmings that we fear anything and anyone different rather than embracing and learning from others.

12 children (mean age 6 years [range 3–10], 11 boys) were referred to a paediatric gastroenterology unit with a history of normal development followed by loss of acquired skills, including language, together with diarrhoea and abdominal pain.
The opening paragraph of the paper.
The opening paragraph is a lie. It should read 12 children attended my son's birthday party.