Toddler behaviour and food on floor in cafe... AIBU?

[NettleCake]

DD is 18months and won't sit in a highchair for more than 5-10 mins (screams, stands up and tries to climb out!)

We have lunch out most days. Mainly cafes and coffee shops. DD runs off constantly to explore, so I end up chasing her, apologising as she gets in people's way. If the cafe has toys she'll play with them for about 5 mins then loses interest.

What do other mums do? We have things on in town most mornings and afternoons, so too far to go home for lunch.

Also she's very messy, throws food on floor, shakes juice etc. I pick up as much as possible but I'm busy chasing her or holding onto her so often leave some of the mess.
I've had a few cross looks from staff. Am I supposed to ask for a dustpan and brush? If I restrain her in buggy/highchair while I clean the floor she'll scream. DH says not to worry about the floor.

How do we eat out without upsetting people... and how long does this stage last?

How do you afford to eat out everyday?

Why not plan activities for AM and PM and have lunch at home?

It sounds painful - and I say this with an almost 2yo who isn't cafe / coffee shop friendly!

I wouldn't bring her to a cafe or eatery at all while she's like this. You're only making work and bringing stress on yourself. And the staff who have to pick up after you. Wait till she's a bit older.

How do you afford to eat out everyday

That's absolutely none of your business and not relevant to the opening post.

Can I also point out if you don't clean up what your child has flung on the floor, it wouldn't take much for someone to step on it, go flying and be badly hurt or break a bone. Don't you have baby wipes with you? Put child in highchair, child screams, parent ignores, cleans up mess, removes child from highchair to buggy. Also agree all these activities and lunches come over as more for your benefit.

Dancegirl Aww I really believe an 18mo is able to understand "cause/consequence"

I have a video of my DC at 20mo, they were touching the TV screen (something that wasn't allowed), then went in the corner of the room where I used to put them in time out, and starting saying ba ba ba with the tone I had when I counted 1, 2, 3 during time outs. So clearly they understood one action led to the other.

Danceg you asked hiw to do it, so here is my technique, FWIW I believe my two have quite good table manners (for 3yo...), at home or outside, and would like to think it is thanks to me bit I know it depends a lot on the child's personality.
I am strict, they never leave the table before they are both done eating (from 6mo when we started weaning, waiting is a side effect of having a twin in a way), throwing food = food taken away, screaming because food was taken away = highchair pushed away from the table, etc. Don't get me wrong, I will cuddle them if they cry, I am not cold, but I am ferm. If they spill something on purpose it goes away and they don't get more (usually they start misbheaving when they are not hungry anymore anyway).
At a restaurant I used to only give them small amounts of food at a time so the amount that would get spilled was limited (no risk of the whole plate falling down).
Oh and constant interaction when eating out, storytelling, talking about people around etc. easier when on my own with them than when I want to eat with other adults and have a conversation.

Thanks for all the advice, much appreciated.

Reason we go out for so long is she gets bored and restless at home (climbing furniture, running, crying a lot). I've tried just a morning activity but if we come home for lunch we then have 7 hours to fill until bedtime! She likes being around other children and goes to nursery 2 days a week so is used to lots of company.

I agree, she shouldn't be running around cafes! It's not that I 'allow' the running, more it's hard to prevent. I try to sit her on my knee/in the toy corner/next to me on sofa and she suddenly scrambles down and runs off, with me in pursuit. I retrieve her immediately but 5 minutes later she's off again.

I'll try teaching her highchair manners. She throws food when she doesn't want it (fussy eater) which is most things. How do you teach them not to throw food? She doesn't respond to 'no' yet or just laughs defiantly at me!

OP's child might be only 18 months, but it won't hurt her to start learning some manners.

It's really no good making faces and going "awwwww she's a ickly wickle baby who doesn't know any better" she'd never going to know any better if no one ever teaches her a little patience or manners, it doesn't happen overnight.
What happens if OP has another? The first will have to wait!

Sooner you start, the sooner they get hold of it!

You are in for a tough few years as you don't seem to have much control over her now. You have to be more firm, not let her run wild, and reinforce the word "no". She is old enough to understand that.

There are loads of things you could do to entertain her at home.

An 18 month old doesn't need to be around other children all day every day.

If you had a busy morning with her and then a good nap mid day then she wouldn't be crying so much. Sounds like she is not getting enough nap time for an 18 month old.

Personally I'd say picnic lunch and somewhere open you don't mind her making a fuss.

Then teach her to sit and eat!

You have my sympathy as ds was the same but they need to learn. I'd start off small and increase the time slowly.

I do wonder as well if she's over stimulated with activities morning and afternoon. Some children go into overdrive - my ds being one of them.
Even now at 12!!!!

OP can you afford to put her in nursery another day a week? It may be of benefit to her and you by the sounds of it... x

It's really no good making faces and going "awwwww she's a ickly wickle baby who doesn't know any better" she'd never going to know any better if no one ever teaches her a little patience or manners, it doesn't happen overnight

It's not about that. It's about brain development and doing things that are age appropriate. All children are different though. Mine certainly wouldn't have understood consequences at that age. I started teaching table manners when they were old enough to understand.

Sooner you start, the sooner they get hold of it!

Completely disagree on this one too I'm afraid. In fact I've found that teaching some things LATER results in them getting it quicker.

Doesn't respond to No???? Time she learnt.
No way would I or have I chased any of my children round a cafe.
Strap them in highchair. If she kept throwing food she would get nothing else. Warning , and then if kept on back in pushchair

If she gets restless at home, take her to a park or playground or let her run around your garden, if you have one. She doesn't need to go to an activity.

It sounds as if she has hardly any time at all at home though and the going out is more for your benefit than hers. Maybe this isn't how it is, but it comes across as if you dread any long stretch at home with her and so are taking her out to keep her occupied with external activities and lunch. But she is over-tired and over-stimulated and it still isn't working.

Could you try pushing her nap time later? What happens if she doesn't go to sleep at 10 a.m.?

What kind of activities do you try to do with her at home? Do you take her to the park to run around every day? Do you have a garden with toys for her?Could you invite friends to you sometimes instead of always going to cafes? Then at least the mess is contained in your house?

What happens at weekends? Are you out all day then as well?

Having been involved last year in a situation at one of the well known coffee chains I think I can comment on this one.

If a tray of scalding hot coffee was split on your little one. What would your reaction be?

My situation was that a toddler was running around and making a real nuisance of themselves along with the group of mothers who felt they could take over the whole of the café.

This is not an unusual scenario in the coffee houses now. I was asked to make a statement because the child screamed the place down when another customer tripped over this child who was running around and the mother was threatening to sue, get the police involved etc.

It does sound as though these visits are for your benefit as opposed to everyone else's. I agree with someone else. It might be beneficial to have your child in a nursery for a day or so a week.

You could do what they do in the classes at home though - put on a cd and dance/bang tambourines, set up some messy play...then go for a walk.
Or spend the morning at home and then go out to an afternoon activity if the thought of filling 7 hours seems too much.

She does sound overstimulated. Does she nap in the afternoon at nursery? They usually have a nap/downtime period. My son never really napped after 18 months but slept 7-7 and had an hour after lunch which was quiet time (so reading cuddled up in a den or on his beanbag) sometimes he'd fall asleep but if not he was calm and relaxed ready for the rest of the day.

I agree with dancer I could have had a massive, protracted battle with ds1 aged 18 months to get him to sit 'nicely' in a chair for more than 5 minutes at a time. But he did it naturally by 2 and a half, so why put us both through that? He wasn't bothered about eating most of the time, so witholding food would have been totally counterproductive!

My son did this until he was 3, he couldn't sit for more than a couple of minutes before he was off racing around.

I stopped taking him out to places until he was 3 and could happily play with a toy.

It might be beneficial to have your child in a nursery for a day or so a week. - the OPs child is already in nursery (presumably on the days she works) but I agree with someone who suggested an extra day might be good. The cost probably equates to what you are spending on lunch and activities every day and it would give you a day on your own to do your own things and to recharge your batteries somewhat to deal with her on the other days. She just sounds like a very active child and one who doesn't sleep very much so you are probably exhausted and taking the path of least resistance to her as well.

I work in a shop that has a cafe, if you spill something it's polite to let them know and offer to clean it, particularly if it's something someone could slip on. I would tell you it's fine and I would see to it myself happily but I would appreciate the offer. The customers who do leave a mess we do often comment on how they,ve left such a mess. Your child running around a cafe where people are carrying hot food and drinks is an accident waiting to happen though.

unfortunate that sounds like a brilliant idea! Could you do that OP?

She needs to be strapped into the high chair.

I agree, she shouldn't be running around cafes! It's not that I 'allow' the running, more it's hard to prevent. I try to sit her on my knee/in the toy corner/next to me on sofa and she suddenly scrambles down and runs off, with me in pursuit. I retrieve her immediately but 5 minutes later she's off again.
Baby reins?! She'll not go far then.