To think that just because you're off work sick doesn't mean you cannot leave the house

[user1485342611]

Someone has just been complaining that they spotted a colleague who is off work sick for the week out and about in their local shopping centre. Apparently if they're well enough to do that, they're well enough to be in work.

One of the reasons a doctor will certify you off work for a week is to give you time to rest and take it easy as you recover from an illness. That doesn't mean you can't leave the house. There's a big difference between getting up at 7am, facing a long commute and a full day at work, and not getting home until 6 or 7 pm; and going for a gentle browse around the local shops/meeting your mum for coffee or some such.

AIBU to wonder why people don't get this, and speak accusingly of anyone who dares to venture outside their front door when they're out of work on a medical cert?

Who goes to the doctor for a SICKIE corythatwas?

We are not talking about the same thing at all! I give up.

And regarding appearances, it's regarding the original OP, about someone being "spotted" somewhere. The problem is one post replies to something specific, is then taken out of context, and before you know it the whole thing goes into nonsense. I do give up.

Well it was diagnosed as migraine by a neurologist so that's why I call it that.

Meant to add that that was after I temporarily lost my vision and spent 3 days in hospital as they feared it was a stroke or a warning sign of one.

Reading this thread I'm jolly glad I'm not a psychiatrist. Imagine having spent all that time studying what works for various disorders, and then spending hours outlining to the patients what they need to do to get cured- only to have them come back with "ooh, I couldn't possibly do that, doctor. It's a question of showing decency", as if you'd asked them to dance naked on top of the Albert Memorial.

I don't go out if I'm off work sick. I worry someone from work will see me and it'll look bad.

YANBU I was signed off work sick some time ago with a fracture. It was a complex fracture of my dominant writing arm so I couldn't write or type for 8 weeks - the two things I need to be able to do in order to do my job. But I didn't feel unwell and hadn't broken my legs. Still perfectly capable of going to meet friends for a coffee or popping to the shops. I felt very guilty about being off work and colleagues being left in the lurch but nothing to be done about it. I wasn't going to spend 8 weeks stuck in my house.
If people are off work with depression for example exercise can be the best medicine. It's ridiculous to think that just because you are off sick you should be holed up indoors

Threads like this drive me up the wall. I'm signed off work for a relapse in bipolar disorder, I've been off for 3 weeks and my GP wanted to sign me off longer, which I probably need to be, but I didn't want to let anyone down. So I'm signed off for a month and will go back the week after next when frankly I don't feel ready and it's partly because I worry about all the things expressed in this thread. I've gone out - I even went to dinner with my husband while my friend babysat and I've gone for long walks in the park with my son - because I was told to try and relax and get out as much as possible to help my mental health. As it happens I have the flu now which means I haven't been able to get out this week and my mood is struggling with it. Hey, least it looks better though eh.

I've only been off work in the past for a couple of days with bad colds/flu type things when I slept most of the day and didn't feel well enough to leave the house.

However when DH has been off with similar he usually needs some fresh air so might pop to the shop five minutes away.

Long term illnesses are different however and people can't be expected to be housebound for weeks or months on end. Sometimes they might be up to going out for a bit, but not doing a full day's work.

I had a friend who was off work for months with anxiety and depression and used to drive 40 miles to visit me. My son was a baby at the time and she would often come for a walk or to baby group with me.

It depends on why the person is off sick. If they've told their employer that they have a broken leg and can't leave the house, then are spotted wandering around TK Maxx, they are taking the piss. If they have been signed off with anxiety and are seen walking home from a therapy session, they're doing nothing wrong.

As a rule - and there are plenty of exceptions - if you are fit enough to be out shopping, then you should be fit enough to go to work. If your illness means that you can't do a full day's work, or do your normal duties, then you (and your employer) should be thinking about the work that you can do rather than claiming you can't do anything at all. Perhaps you can work reduced hours, perhaps you can do lighter work, perhaps you can work from home.

Like anything, it needs to be judged on a case-by-case basis. Unfortunately there are plenty of people who pull a sickie, and there are plenty of doctors who will sign someone off work rather than argue with them why they won't. While these things are the case employers will be, shall we say, a little "wary" of people's motives when they are seen swanning around the shops when they claimed they couldn't get out of bed...

I wonder if attitudes are based on employer policies and size.

There is no statutory requirement to pay any sick pay for the first 3 days and therefter SSP is payable for upto 28 weeks with nothing thereafter.

I suspect most employers are more generous than that but where is it reasonable to draw the line ? Full pay for three months ? Full pay for 12 months ? Half pay ? Different rules for different illnesses ? Different rules for different staff ?

As an employer, I don't have a budget or a contingency for sick leave. I have what I think are solid, fair policies that reward rather than deter but it does very occasionally leave us being screwed by someone who works the system to their advantage. I can absorb all of that some of the time but I have to rely on employees having integrity and it comes at a cost elsewhere, perhaps a smaller pot of money for community benefits. I don't have a built in replacement for every role but have a degree of cover. To do otherwise would require me to either reduce salaries, reduce any enhanced policies re maternity pay/paternity pay. I could increase staff and have a less generous policy for compassionate leave, medical appointments etc.

I don't think people are aware of the lack of slack in small and medium businesses which need to make very tough choices on priorities. It's a balancing act that relies a lot on goodwill on both sides. And yes it's true that retaining staff is generally better all round but there's a limit on how long that remains the case. If an employee can't honour their contract how long do you to continue to pay them and how long do you continue to employ them ?

It's not easy either way.

I'm not really sure what the issue is here. Surely if the problem IS a mental health problem or a long-term illness or recovery after an op, the people in work who matter ie HR and senior managers will be well aware of this because of medical notes stating exactly what the problem is. The nature of the illness should be confidential in work amongst general fellow colleagues so while some idiots may gossip, whinge and moan all they like, they have to assume that managers are happy with the absence.

Where we're talking a couple of days here and there with a bad cold, D & V, migraine etc then no,I absolutely would not expect someone in that situation to be going round the shops or having a coffee and a brownie in costa. That is taking the piss really, isn't it? If you've got Enough of an appetite and energy and the DESIRE to eat a brownie in costa while you've got a cold then to me, you're well enough to be in work. You really are.

It's common sense. For Long term sickness absence i would expect visits to Costa or even holidays to be possible needs as part of a gradual recovery, but it would be none of my business what they were off with if i were not party to medical notes so I wouldn't be gossiping about it with anyone.

If a colleague came back after 3 days off with a self-certified "bad virus" I would not be impressed with a picture of them on Facebook showing them sat in Costa during that time off. They might well need to legitimately leave the house for GP, pharmacy, quick food shop, or school run but anything else at all would be massively taking the piss. It just would.

I'm lost as to what to do for best now. I have been to the shops a couple of times - as a nurse axuliairy there's sod all I can do that isn't manual. I don't do paperwork, I have zero training in nhs administration systems etc. I'm just unable to lift patients or bend over to wash them for extended periods , push beds , deal with violent and agressive patients and families, or keep going for 13 hours.

But I have been able to go for slow walks, out for lunch/coffee or wonder around the shops for 40 minutes or so. It leaves me in severe pain and exhausted - first time I went out I shouldn't have as I was crying on the way home and then flat out on tramadol for 14 hours afterwards. But I couldn't sit in the house doing nothing but watching the TV.

I'm now at the stage of being well enough to go back to work, being desperate to go back, I'm off all painkillers at long last, but GP and occupational health want me to take another week of still.

Should I still stay indoors as much as possible? Or should I continue trying to build up to normal stamina?

Yanbu.

The only thing that keeps me in is d&v. For everything else I need to pop out because I'm a lp.

Flu here. I haven't left the house since Sunday. I vacuumed today. That's the most I've done all week. Feeling able to move about is one way I judge for myself that I'm ok to go back to work.

I work in a school so it's a strict 48 hour ban for v+d. Last year I was sick on a Sunday evening so couldn't go to work till the Wednesday. I still felt horrible but living alone meant that on Tuesday I had to go to the supermarket to do a food shop and run errands. I spent the whole time in fear I'd be seen and judged a fraud!

We don't have a D&v exclusion policy - we are expected to come back as soon as the symptoms stop

It really isn't as simple as "If you can go to the shop you can go to work" though, is it? Not for most workers.

Someone can manage half an hour to grab some food from Tescos and pop into their cafe for a coffee, even if they're absolutely wiped out when they get home - it's a little different to commuting, working an eight/ten/twelve hour day either on your feet constantly or having to provide good customer service, and then commuting home. If you can't see the difference between the two, it's a little concerning.

Going to the shop to buy something (if you have a physical illness) is fine - sitting in a coffee shop is not.

I was signed off work for nearly 6 months - severe depression caused by work was the reason the Dr put on my sick note. If I hadn't left the house to get on with normal chores (shopping/dog walking etc) I'd have totally lost my mind. So in that respect OP, YANBU.

My old pharmacy was very slow at dispensing prescriptions. It was right next door to Costa. I used to spend ages just sitting there and waiting. I'd be right fucked off if someone told me I couldn't park my backside while off sick.

As an office worker, if I am well enough to go for shopping/coffee I am well enough to go to work, apeven if reduced hours. If I am infectious I will work from home. I would only take a sick day if I had absolutely no choice. I have gone into work with broken bones. I can still work, so why skive? It would load more work onto my colleagues & I like them.

What other people do us up to them, but I respect a trier.

I had a bad breakdown due to work stress. I was working crazy hours with no breaks and eventually I cracked. I actually lost time. Had no idea what had happened but had been on the floor hitting myself and rocking and pulling hair. My doctor signed me off for 3 weeks. Work still got there way as I was forced to return after 2 weeks. I am so glad I left. My mental health has still not recovered from my 2 years with them.
Oh and no I could not just got to work. I lost track off time too much, had no concentration span and could not even look after myself. I was a carer for several people and in charge of medication and other vital things including paperwork. I was made to go back to early and am just glad nothing terrible happened to the people I was looking after as a result. The company did not give a shit either way

Haven't rtwt but it seems overall most ppl agree that it very much depends on the circumstances!
All I will add is my personal bugbear of people relying on 'the doctor signed me off for so much time so I had to stay off' as it's simply not true. Doctors may sign you off for longer than you need and ultimately they are suggesting a period of rest but it has to be your decision entirely whether to be off or not and for how long, it is fine to take into account medical guidance of course (common sense rly) but not to abdicate responsibility and just say 'well I had to be off as GP said so'.
If you're not well enough to work then fine you're not well enough but it remains your decision.
In my experience GP readily sign off ppl for longer than needed which is fair enough as their concern is you getting 100percent better not whether you are losing money being off or whether the employer is struggling or indeed whether you may lose your job on this. So they will err on side of caution when giving guidance.
As someone said if you feel fit to do some work then that needs to be discussed as there may be light duties etc available!
Just my thoughts!

I'm having a massively complicated, reconstructive surgery later in the year. I won't be able to eat or talk or even sit up for up to 2-3 months. Like fuck am I going to stay in the house for this entire time. Fortunatrly, my colleagues aren't like some people on here. After a month, I might be able to sit in a cafe and dribble some tea from a straw but I sure as hell won't be able to work a 9 hour day, plus commute, especially as I need to drive around to see clients.