to still be cross about the outcome of the EU referendum?

[mynamesnotsam]

I'm still so angry and can't forgive those who voted to leave. After the result there was much talk of how the two sides must put aside their differences but I don't feel there has been any attempt to try to appease the 48.1% of people who voted to stay. I also want to rip the head off any one who says it's the will of the people. They should be legally obligated to say it's the will of 51.9 % of the people who voted. If the vote had gone the other way you can bet that UKIP would still be making a huge fuss about it but remainers are expected to "just get over it"!

You chose to make my family's future very tough, you chose high food prices, you chose to make us unemployed (financial services), you chose to shaft the universities, social care and farming: of course I don't have to forgive you.

There is nothing about not holding grudges in any definition of democracy.

It's basic manners to not criticize food prepared for you as a guest and is something most civilised people are taught as children.

I physically wretch at the smell, sight and taste of lamb but I would do everything I could to hide it and make some other excuse for not eating it.

Very rude neighbours, don't ever ask them back!

retch not wretch!

Please ignore me everyone.........wrong thread! :)

They were definitely brexiters, am I right?!

Question is, is it EU lamb?

Actually one of the better contributions LEE

Oh yours was good! Othersock!

As I understand it in the EU we could only trade within ourselves. Ie only within the European market.

Not true - just go an have a look at your clothes labels and see where they were made - then look at your TV and car.

By leaving, we'd surely be broadening our options and be able to trade freely with any country we wanted (obviously dependent on whether they wanted to trade with us) as opposed to only those we were told we could trade with?

Trading and trading freely are totally different things. At the moment you don't have to pay a tax to export to the EU or to import from it, how we trade depends on the agreement with individual countries outside the EU and after Brexit whatever we can negotiate with the EU.

How can that be construed as a bad thing?

Because at the moment we have free trade with the EU, we don't need to negotiate or pay taxes.

So say you are building a car in the UK but the engine is built in Germany, at the moment you just import he engines for the cars, put them in the car and sell them to the EU.

No import of export tax.

Now if the EU decides we have to pay 10% on all imports form the EU the cost of cars of making those cars is going to go up, therefore the price to sell will go up. In addition people may well not want to buy a car made outside the EU.

Of course we were allowed to trade outside the EU. Not only that, but within the EU we had advantageous trade deals with more than 50 countries outside of the EU. Better deals than, for example Canada or Switzerland had with those countries. We didn't even have to negotiate those deals, we got them handed to us on a plate.

We lose all that, we'll have to start from scratch negotiating deals that famously take years to conclude. We have very little expertise in the area as we left it to the EU to do for us. We will almost certainly end up with worse terms with almost everyone - inside and outside the EU. It's lose lose for us I'm afraid.

I think it's particularly unfair that young people in the main voted to Remain, and of course those under 18 in June last year didn't get to vote, but these changes are going to impact them for many years to come.

If you look at the figures of those who voted in the referendum, over half of those under 50 voted to remain! This statistic will only go up as more young people reach the age of 18 and more older people die. I'm not saying that older people's votes don't count but it is true to say that these drastic changes will affect young people more and I think it's terrible that 16 and 17 year olds didn't get to vote.

Regarding people I know, all my family voted to Remain, although my mum needed a bit of education but happily agreed with us after that. I do have friends that voted leave and sadly, most haven't changed their minds although there are some that do say they didn't really understand it all and do not wish to be out of pocket!

Yougov polls consistently show that Remain would win if another referendum was held and even the Express and Sun said there had been a swing to remain from their readers!

Ange

Yougov polls consistently show that Remain would win if another referendum was held and even the Express and Sun said there had been a swing to remain from their readers!

This has already been discussed on this thread and been shown to be untrue. Could you link to evidence showing what you state?

Pleased to hear you "educated" your mum I'm sure it was all fact based and fully objective truths. We wouldn't want those older people making up their own minds, would we?

Regarding people I know, all my family voted to Remain, although my mum needed a bit of education but happily agreed with us after that.

Do you realise how arrogant that sounds.

I don't think that sounds arrogant - it was a complex issue - so why not try to explain that it wasn't about bendy bananas but more fundamental questions.

If she had then decided that Leave was the correct decision then OK.

I'm a pretty vociferous remainer.

Most polls are shit

As for "educating" leavers - I deal with people who voted exit for reasons that make utter and absolute sense in their context.
Sadly their viewpoint is very incomplete
and there are few polite ways to fill in the gaps in their knowledge

so 2019 will be a nasty shock for them

My mil surprised me by voting remain

After the referendum she told me that she had voted remain following a number of chats with ds1

Saying that he 'educated her' would be wrong but he certainly gave her another point of view and she did think long and hard about it

Sadly their viewpoint is very incomplete

I was a remain voter, but tbf for balance, I have heard some pretty incomplete reasons for some that voted remain.

I think the idea that one side was more 'educated' than the other just perpetuates the 'all leavers are thick' line that gets rolled out.

My MIL astounded me by voting Remain, especially since she reads the Mail from cover to cover. She said she didn't really feel qualified to make the decision but sat down to think it through. Full marks to her for giving it proper thought.

I think you will clearly see that we have plenty of trade to non EU countries whilst being part of the EU but fully agree with LaurieMarlow that probably none of this trade will be so easy once we are out of the EU.

HMRC Tradeinfo. figures the latest available being November 2016. I found a table which compared our total exports to the EU with those to NON-EU Countries. The figures are as follows:
UK Exports to the EU: £131,904,890,963 (just under £132 Billion)
UK Exports to NON-EU Countries £141,489,295,632 (Approx £141.5 Billion

I think the distinction is between someone educating themself, by talking to people and reading, which is good and everyone should have done, and some one "needing a bit of education to vote the right way " which, I don't know, sounds a bit Stalinist to me

Agree with piglet and wrong

To be fair to ange sometimes its hard to find the right words and phrases

But yeah 'educated' reminds me of china under Mao

Do you realise how arrogant that sounds. Sorry you are right, it did sound rather arrogant. Obviously, my mum chose how to vote in the end but I think she found it interesting and informative listening to me and my siblings and my teenage children as she hadn't understood the complexities and really didn't know for example that the UK government could control immigration within the EU if it chose to.

Don't worry Ange, you can happily call remainers remoaners, hysterical, yawn-some, boring, brain-washed, need to get a grip, get over it, etc, but you should never say that your mum needed an education.

Them's the mumsnet rules.

Mainland EU will suffer little for paying tariffs on the UK

the UK will suffer very greatly for the other way round

David Davis talking about deals with German car makers just shows how incredible badly informed he is