Furious: Girl Guides now admitting boys

[shinynewusername]

Sorry for DM link but this is important. Brownies and Guides are going to admit boys if they identify as girls. Girls will have to share 'single sex' facilities including tents & changing rooms with them. Parents won't be told. Oh, and men who identify as women can become Brownie & Guide leaders, where they will get to supervise girls in those tents, changing rooms etc.

How is this possible? There is an epidemic of sexual abuse. We are still in the fall-out of Rotherham, Saville etc yet we are enabling men to have access to every safe space for girls. AIBU?

if you have a double mastectomy and a hysterectomy youre a man are you
Of course not.
Any more than if a man has his dick and balls chopped off he would be a woman.
Radical surgery to some of your sexual organs doesn't change your sex.
And neither does "identifying" as a woman when you are a man.

So its the terminology you take offence at?

Still doesn't explain why someone who in all ways but physical, is female should be prevented from all the things her female peers are enjoying.
Or
Why group leaders in the same situation should be immediately linked with depraved sexual behaviour.

If you understand the science behind what makes all of us male or female

Science says that there are two sexes - male and female.

Science says that having a penis makes you male and having a vagina makes you female.

What terminology?

in all ways but physical if female
That simply doesn't make sense.
What ways are there to be female other than physical or biological?

Still doesn't explain why someone who in all ways but physical, is female should be prevented from all the things her female peers are enjoying.

How can you be female if you're not physically female?

Do you even know what the word female means?

Why group leaders in the same situation should be immediately linked with depraved sexual behaviour.

Nobody has said that.

They are not female. They are boys with gender dysphoria, a clear mental health condition. They are not "trapped in the wrong body". Of course there need to be reasonable adjustments made where appropriate under equality legislation. But it's also right that there should be allowed to be exceptions where female sex segregated spaces exist.

OopsDearyMe

Can you read? Which bit of gender ID will allow ANY man who says he 'feels' like a woman access to women and girls' safe spaces? Doesn't have to be trans, just that Gender ID law leaves the door wide open for abuse by opportunist offenders sneaking in under the trans umbrella.

Plus 80% of dysphoric kids grow out of it (like I said, read the DSM the criteria are lunatic, playing with trucks as a girl does not make you a boy, unless you are saying tomboys are boys?????) and of the 20% remaining, 80% of them turn out to be oridnary LESBIAN OR GAY. Only a tiny, tiny minority turn out to be true dysphorics, and lots of them have profound sexual trauma (disassociation from your body and loathing of your sex being quite common in abused kids) - so even then transition should be the last chance saloon.

As for Lupron the puberty blocker, you should look that up, not only over 600 side effects, but they were fined, the biggest fine ever for corporate pharmaceutical fraud in America ever ... it's a con, it's a big money making machine - life long drugs, surgery and hormones all based on outdated notions of 'masculine' and feminine'.

My sources are easily found, just google, there are crime stats, UN stats, police stats, I've worked in this area. Paedophiles are almost always male. Victims are 5x more likely to be girls. Women hardly ever ever commit sex crimes against kids. I know my stats thanks.

Plus what's wrong with boys wearing dresses and girls being butch???? Honestly, sex just IS, you are male or female, that's a morally neutral fact. Unless you are suggesting the gender stork arrives at birth and arbitrarily assigns your sex (gender isn't real, it's socially constructed and varies from culture to culture and era to era, women don't drive in Saudi, are we saying it's a characteristic common to all women that they can't drive??? No, it's just culture, and it benefits men).

We need to ditch all this talk of gender, replace it with 'personality' - so what if you are an effeminate boy who likes frocks, paints his nails and grows his hair long???? Big deal. What we should not do, is LIE to children, sterilise them, and tell them it is possible to change your sex, it's not.

We just need to widen the bandwith of what, socially, male and female mean rather than insisting gender stereotypes are based in biology, they're NOT.

I'd really encourage you to read the Guides 'Let's talk about Gender' guidance, no daughter of mine would be in that organisation, they've lost their minds!

If you understand the science behind what makes all of us male or female

That would be biological sex, I accept I am female due to my biology however I do not accept gender as a defining trait. I am not a typical woman.

I will also repeat what I stated earlier that my dd has the right to say she does not want to get changed or sleep in the same space as a biological male and this change of policy is removing her right to make that choice.

What ways are there to be female other than physical or biological?

I think Oops is in the 'male/female brain' camp.

Which is bollocks of course. There is no evidence that male brains and females brains are different.

Why are people insisting on comparing being trans and being gay.

Being gay changes nothing physically about you. You are free to be bi or straight at any time you feel that way.

Being trans is more comparable to being anorexic. It's a mental condition where the person wants to physically alter themselves to the detriment of their health and can level life long devastating effects if proper counselling and help isn't offered.

If your sources are easily googled then they clearly must be of sound scientific and unbiased basis. What we are talking about here is it the children or the adults that bother you most.

OK you can't have it both ways, if gender is physical then take away then it follows that to remove physical attributes also removes gender differences. But everyone knows that this is not the case.

So how else do you term the non physical attributes of gender?

Avirgin er the OP clearly linked this with paedophile behaviours.

if gender is physical
Fuck me

So how else do you term the non physical attributes of gender?

I think you'll find the word 'personality' is just fine.

Still doesn't explain why someone who in all ways but physical, is female should be prevented from all the things her female peers are enjoying

There is literally no way to be female other than physically. Female means xx chromosomes, vagina, uterus, ovaries, smaller skeletal frame, higher body fat %, lower testosterone, higher oestrogen etc etc. That is the only way to be female. Trans girls are male. They are boys. Until they are 16 and can take artificial cross sex hormones they are biologically identical to all other boys.

Surely under sex discrimination rules they wouldn't be allowed to prevent any boy wanting to join anyway. What if that boy lived in an area where there were no cubs or scouts and the only option was brownies or guides?

Stop assuming that every boy or man is a rapist or pervert and every homosexual wants to molest children. You are a bigot and belong in another era when people were beaten up or worse killed for being different!!!

A virgin currently the male / female brain theory is not fully defined enough for me to agree or disagree, however we can term gender by the male and female hormones as we all begin life with a nub that depending on the amount of hormone released and when will become our sex organs and then later another flush of hormones will link our brain in line with these. Easy to see then how a person given the wrong hormone could become misaligned with their physical body.

Gender isn't physical! Fuck me. Sex is physical, and sex is what female and male are referring to. There is no way to be female other than by being, well, female.
Gender is a set of behaviours, expectations, preferences which are artificially ascribed to male and female people. Your trans girls are boys who are attracted to 'girls' toys, clothing and behaviours and who may also have mental distress about their sex organs. Boys who hate having a penis and who love pink and sparkles are still boys.

Not sure how we strayed from the OP tbh. Which was not about transexuality.

The OP however appeared to be against trans people being permitted to work within girl guiding or trans children to join e group.

Plus what's wrong with boys wearing dresses and girls being butch????

I think this is my main problem with the whole thing. I am yet to read an account from a trans person that doesn't revolve entirely around gender stereotypes.

A boy who likes pink sparkly things and prefers to play with dolls than with toy guns or swords is not a girl who was born into the wrong body. He is a boy who likes dolls and pink sparkly things.

A girl who likes to climb trees and get dirty and play with toy cars is not a boy who was born into the wrong body. She is a girl who likes to climb trees, get dirty and play with toy cars.

I've heard people argue that it is damaging to not allow children to identify as the gender they want.

Personally I think it's far more damaging to push the message that you have to be a girl in order to play with dolls.

Oops Deary Me

The internet is awash with crime statistics, go and look. Paedophiles are MEN, girls are 5x more likely to be victims than girls. Google is yur friend. You are implying I'm lying, I'm not lying.

I did NOT say gender is physical, I said quite the opposite. I said GENDER IS NOT REAL, but socially constructed. Gender has NO basis in BIOLOGY.

SEX IS REAL, male female. And that is the beginning and the end of what makes a girl or a boy or a man or a woman.

The rest is just PERSONALITY.

Gender is a socially constructed hierarchy that benefits men and disadvantages women, it's the sexist system by which women are oppressed, and the root of women's oppression is THEIR BIOLOGY.

I understand biology thanks (don't say intersex that just proves not disproves the binary). And where babies come from.

Transwomen are men. Trans men are women. Nobody should be transed in childhood.

Gender ID makes bad laws that means that women lose all their safe spaces. As discussed, in India where women have no protection of sex segregated spaces, 97% of all sex crime is OPPORTUNIST. Here in the UK where we do have sex segregation, only 10% of sex crime is opportunist. The key is OPPORTUNITY.

Telling children they can change sex is a LIE. We need to change society, not children's normal, natural healthy bodies.

Anorexics believe they are fat, they have an unshakeable belief and feeling they are fat. They are identify as fat. Nobody is bloody campaigning for gastric bands for anorexics, putting the rest of us on a diet, and forcing us to collude with their MENTAL ILLNESS that they are fat. They are not fat.

Similarly, boys can't be girls and girls can't be boys.

if gender is physical

It's not. It's a social construct.

dearyme the hormone wash theory is bollocks. Brains cannot be a different sex to the body.