Furious: Girl Guides now admitting boys

[shinynewusername]

Sorry for DM link but this is important. Brownies and Guides are going to admit boys if they identify as girls. Girls will have to share 'single sex' facilities including tents & changing rooms with them. Parents won't be told. Oh, and men who identify as women can become Brownie & Guide leaders, where they will get to supervise girls in those tents, changing rooms etc.

How is this possible? There is an epidemic of sexual abuse. We are still in the fall-out of Rotherham, Saville etc yet we are enabling men to have access to every safe space for girls. AIBU?

Meant can't be racist obviously, not can.

This whole "identify as female" when you are male can just fuck off
It is not OK to misappropriate in this way.any more than it would it be for an able bodied person to "identify as having a disability" and use a group or facility specifically for someone with a disability.
or for a white woman to join a Nubian women's group because she "identifies as black"
Identifying as something is not really a thing. This is fetishism and a removal of safe spaces for women and girls.

I think they should admit boys whether or not they identify as girls.
All the girls at beavers, cubs and scouts don't identify as boys.
we can't expect equality for one group over another irrespective of however they identify themselves.

SWOT

Yes of course there will be people who hate women and people who hate men. It's one of the reasons both sexes should be legally allowed to gather together with members of their own sex.

Your links just show, like mine that there are a lot of fucked up people out there. One of the most basic safeguards for women and children is to allow them their own space. That is becoming illegal. Whether you personally feel as though that's a great thing, you can't possibly think that that is how most people feel. Otherwise we would simply have the abolition of sex segregation completely, if that's what most people wanted.

I haven't seen huge campaigns for the abolition of sex segregation until transactivists. You don't see people marching up and down asking to outlaw it, until transactivists.

By engaging with a TRA on line. The merest hint of a question, will get you blocked at best and threatened at worst. It's not confined to handful of people.

gillybeanz scouts and guides are different organisations and they aren't affiliated with each other in any way.

Scouts made the decision to accept girls because of falling numbers. Nobody forced them to accept girls.

However guides never had the falling numbers problem so they have never needed to accept boys.

I think they should admit boys whether or not they identify as girls.
All the girls at beavers, cubs and scouts don't identify as boys.
we can't expect equality for one group over another irrespective of however they identify themselves.

Have you RTFT?
Because beavers and cubs are mixed-sex, not single sex (they chose to admit girls because their numbers were dropping, not to be inclusive).
GG's point of being is to empower girls and young women and break down gender stereotypes.
Check out their mission page.

I have no idea how gay and trans are in any way comparable. One is about who you love, being free to love a member of your own sex. The other means spending your entire life in a state of cognitive dissonance and requiring other people to do the same. It may also include chest binding, removing healthy tissue, taking cross sex hormones for long periods of time.

Meant can't be racist obviously, not can.

No I didn't. I was right the first time.

I wonder if this will happen at Cheltenham Ladies' College or Eton?

I think we should have safe spaces for ALL children, segregation just creates inequalities. If a so called 'predator' 14 year old boy is pretending to be a girl so he can get in a tent with a girl and rape her then he shouldn't be allowed in a tent with other boys either. Everyone should be treated equally and protected equally. Male/Female segregation should be consigned to the last century.

SWOT - yep, my issue is exactly that - teenage pregnancy. And STIs.

My child is currently only interested in her pets, but, if she is gay, well, less chance of her getting the clap.

She needs to be kept away from penises at 13 years old. That's just common sense.

This has been asked several times now, and nobody has answered.

Could a white boy identify as a black boy, and join a group that's been set up to help and empower black boys?

The Rachel Dolezal case came up around the same time as Caitlyn Jenner, and even though it has exactly the same implications for self-identity, it seems to have been forgotten.

Rachel "identified" as a black woman, and reached a high position in an organisation for black people. This was wholeheartedly considered as bad. Racial appropriation. Despicable. Yet men are supported for identifying as women, to the extent that women's rights are being eroded.

If there were hoards of similarly "black identifying" white people clamouring for access to spaces set aside for black people, would the rights and feelings of those black people be overlooked, the way it's happening with women and girls? I doubt it.

If a so called 'predator' 14 year old boy is pretending to be a girl so he can get in a tent with a girl and rape her then he shouldn't be allowed in a tent with other boys either.

That argument would only work if boys and men were being raped in equal numbers to girls and women.

The majority of rape victims are girls and women.

The majority of rapists rape girls and women, not boys and men.

Everyone should be treated equally and protected equally.

But you can only do that if everyone is on equal footing to begin with.

If you're going to go down the road of demanding that everyone should always be treated the same without taking into consideration the circumstances or background of that individual or group of individuals then you are in affect creating a more unequal society.

There's actually a great meme that explains this much better than I can. I'll try and find it.

Guides is single sex because boys have male socialisation and their presence has a negative effect on the experience for the girls. If you don't subscribe to this idea, and believe that mixed sex everything is better, you can send your daughters to scouts or many of the other mixed organisations. Transwomen and transgirls who campaign for admittance into female only groups and spaces are displaying male entitlement. Effectively males are preventing females from gathering together as a sex. I simply cannot understand why so many on here do not get this and are happily throwing away women's rights. It beggars belief.

Here it is.

Here it is.

Equality of outcome instead of equality of opportunity so then wouldnt it be classed as a matriarchy not a patriarchy so you're not after equality but advantage?

Today 16:26 MercyMyJewels

I wonder if this will happen at Cheltenham Ladies' College or Eton?

It's an interesting one. Strangely one of the only areas where you are allowed to discriminate against a trans-person is that of primogeniture. A woman is not allowed to identify as a man and claim the title reserved for the first born male (her brother). Funny that. Nothing to do with what men want at all!

I have a disability (ASD) and because of this my manager has made adjustments at work for me in order for me to do my job.

Other people I work with aren't disabled therefore they don't have these adjustments in place because they don't need them.

If we were going to go down the route you're suggesting Suppermummy02 and say everyone should be treated equally and protected equally, in other words treating everyone the same no matter what their circumstances, then that would mean saying that either I'm not allowed to have reasonable adjustments put in place to help me or that all my colleagues should also have the same adjustments that I have even though they don't need them.

Except that wouldn't be equal or be fair would it? All it would mean is that my coworkers would have an unfair lead and as a result would produce some very unfair and unequal results.

Suppermummy has the correct line for CHILDREN, and ideally for all but this won't be the case.
They are within a restricted age grouping and (GG/Scout) regulations cover effectively the issues relevant to this.
The wider issues are important but the attempt here is to label anyone 'male' as bad and dangerous.
Untangle the arguments and you might get somewhere.

Where's the advantage in that meme poster? All three can see over the wall therefore they are all equal.

The third image that goes with that poster is the one where the fence has been removed altogether.

Avirginlitthecandle
But what if they "identified as having a disability"
Surely that would be ok?

Some of these replies are just ignorant and nasty. Genuine question - you people obviously haven't bothered doing any research on the subject so why come here with your pearls clutched.

The scientifically observed fact is that gender identity results from a complicated manifestation of hormones the impact of which isn't purely determined by the chromosomes you possess but by epigenetic that are determined in utero. These comments are just plain ignorant and ill informed.