To wonder why some people are in denial about their weight?

[penciltop]

Not criticising anyone here but just wondering.

I had a morbidly obese friend who says she is that size because she is muscular and has 'big bones'. I don't comment but she clearly has a lot of fat on her body and she does overeat.

I have come across other people too who say people are healthier these days so are going to be bigger. People say it is because of genetics. Everyone is overweight in their family and that is the reason they are.

I know weight loss isn't easy - trying to lose weight myself! - but surely pretending it is because of reasons outside of your control isn't going to help. People keep telling me I am fine and I don't need to lose weight. Err yes I do according to BMI. I am in the overweight category

Not denying the reasons for people who have real medical reasons such as disabilities or because of medication

I was slim all my life and before I got ill with a BMI at the lowest end of the health range. Then I got ill; unable to walk and pumped full of high dose steroids. I had a massive moon face. My life was turned upside down and suddenly, I was water logged and bloated too. Yes, I had "dietary adjusments". If you're on long term high dose steroids, it's almost always because you have a horrible disease. Let's lay off the patient blaming, eh?! Funnily enough, once they agreed funding for the drugs that are £10k a year, I was able to move more and I lost the weight. It was very hard. Honestly, if I'd been shamed at that point in my illness, I might very well have thrown myself off a very tall building.

My mother is borderline anorexic, usually size 6-8. She was given steroids and ballooned up to a size 14. Ahhh yes, the weight gain was because of all the invisible biscuits she suddenly started eating

Candy yours is a prime example of them goalpost moving to suit their wallet.

If the NHS is so concerned about weight they should have okayed the £10k treatment to begin with.

Time for the executives higher up to put their money where their mouths are instead of releasing hand wringing press articles about obesity every couple of months.

Hope you are better now Candy

Radio 4 programme this morning - "The Life Scientific" talked about genes and how different people metabolize fat differently and sugars differently. Basically, they agreed that it's a lottery and life is unfair. Some people can eat more and burn it off quicker.

Vanilla is your mum ok now That must have been very hard for her especially considering the ED.

Im a size 14 and have to work hard to stay at this size.

""The Life Scientific" talked about genes and how different people metabolize fat differently and sugars differently. Basically, they agreed that it's a lottery and life is unfair."

Did they explain why most of the people with the unlucky genes just by coincidence live in countries with a bad diet and so many of the ones with the lucky genes live in countries with a good diet?

Do you see what I'm getting at? The reason why we have an obesity crisis is clearly not to do with our genes, unless you think people in 'fat' countries (US, UK, the others on the list I posted upthread) have completely different genes to those in the thin countries and the same with poorer areas v richer areas.

Do you see what I'm getting at? The reason why we have an obesity crisis is clearly not to do with our genes, unless you think people in 'fat' countries (US, UK, the others on the list I posted upthread) have completely different genes to those in the thin countries and the same with poorer areas v richer areas

It is a combination of genes and behaviours.

Let's say someone had genes which make them pre disposed to obesity. They won't get fat if they are living in a famine. However, under the right circumstances they will put on weight far more easily than someone who is not genetically predisposed disposed to obesity.

"Did they explain why most of the people with the unlucky genes just by coincidence live in countries with a bad diet and so many of the ones with the lucky genes live in countries with a good diet? "

Do people really still trot this out? Its one step away from "I guess there were none of these bad genes in the concentration camps then!"

It doesnt take a genius to see that if you metabolise sugar and fats far more efficiently than your neighbour, but live in a country where these things are scarce, then the effect is not going to be as obvious as in a country where they are in everything we eat. Its the same as saying you have a magic stone that protects you from penguin attacks when you dont live somewhere that penguins are!

It also isnt hard to see that in countries where people are dying of starvation, the ones that are surviving may well be the ones who have these genes - its been a survival trait for thousands of years to be able to make the absolute most of what calories you can get. If youre a naturally thin person somewhere thats prone to famine then youre at a disadvantage when then next one rolls around.

I am fat and have pcos as well. But I have also eaten too much. Sometimes I do make sarcastic remarks if people ask me if I know that I need to lose weight. Maybe other people do this as well?

I once had a colleague telling me to stop drinking fizzy drinks bevause that made her lose weight. I only ever drink water and unsweetened tea....

Stormtrader That's true, the slimmer countries like Japan begin to put on weight and become unhealthy as soon as the west's diet becomes more prevalent there . The stats for cancer and other diseases also worsen.

Ref. the mediteranean diet; I am on it and I encourage dh to take plenty of olive oil to help his arthritis, that keeps his health better despite his weight.

Life Scientific on Radio 4

Is it true that some people put on weight more easily than others? And if so why? It's a question that's close to many of our hearts. And it's a question that medical researcher, Professor Sadaf Farooqi is trying to answer. In 1997, Sadaf noticed that two children she was studying lacked the hormone leptin. From there, she went on to discover the first single gene defect that causes obesity. For most us, how much we eat is within our control. But for children with this rare inherited condition and, it turned out, several other rare genetic disorders, the evidence is clear. A voracious appetite is not a lifestyle choice: it's a biological response to brains signalling starvation. Sadaf tells Jim how she discovered ten rare genetic disorders that cause severe childhood obesity and what this means for the rest of us.

She found that only 1-2% of children lacked leptin that caused childhood obesity. The remaining obesity was due to other factors.

I once had a colleague telling me to stop drinking fizzy drinks bevause that made her lose weight. I only ever drink water and unsweetened tea....

Snap! I hate fizzy drinks with a passion...I'd rather drink tap water.

This isn't true. The healthier you are, the cheaper you are.

Go on, population level evidence of that please. Other than the DM.

If youre a naturally thin person somewhere thats prone to famine then youre at a disadvantage when then next one rolls around.

I've also read that women are generally better able to survive famine than men are.

Go on, population level evidence of that please. Other than the DM.

Does it need a citation? Isn't it obvious that if you are healthy, you spend far less time at the GPs, having tests at the hospital, requiring the use of carers and nurses etc?

I realise that this is just my opinion so am happy to be proved wrong.

Helena she has rheumatoid arthritis so she'll be on steroids for a long time

I'd love to start a thread about why some people are in denial about wearing their judgey pants.

It's not being overweight that is costing NHS money, it's being obese or morbidly obese.

According to some scientific studies, overweight people live the longest and morbidly obese/underweight are fairly parallel if I recall correctly.

These threads go round in circles imo. Some people overeat, some people don't. If everyone was a 'healthy' weight something else would be an epidemic. We're all living longer which is another massive strain.

Mental health is the key imo. Prevention rather than cure and help rather than criticism. We could do with spending more money on mental health from an early age. Then we might not see so many of the physical symptoms. I'm not just talking about obesity, that's just one part of the symptom.

Costs of obesity are high:

www.theguardian.com/society/2014/nov/20/obesity-bigger-cost-than-war-and-terror

Non-daily mail link

www.noo.org.uk/NOO_about_obesity/economics

Estimates of the direct costs to the NHS for treating overweight and obesity, and related morbidity in England, have ranged from £479.3 million in 1998 [1] to £4.2 billion in 2007 [2]. Estimates of the indirect costs (those costs arising from the impact of obesity on the wider economy such as loss of productivity) over the same time period ranged between £2.6 billion [1] and £15.8 billion.[2]

Modelled projections suggest that indirect costs could be as much as £27 billion by 2015 [2]. In 2006/07, obesity and obesity-related illness was estimated to have cost £148 million in inpatient stays in England [3]. In Scotland, the total societal cost of obesity and overweight in 2007/08 was estimated to be between £600 million and £1.4 billion [4], the NHS cost may have contributed as much as £312 million.

Costs of obesity are high????????

It warrants me posting this again then.

If the NHS is so concerned about weight they should have okayed Candys £10k treatment to begin with.

Time for the executives higher up to put their money where their mouths are instead of releasing hand wringing press articles about obesity every couple of months while moving the goalposts to suit the NHS wallet!

Does it need a citation? Isn't it obvious that if you are healthy, you spend far less time at the GPs, having tests at the hospital, requiring the use of carers and nurses etc?

Er yes, because healthy people LIVE LONGER. So will visit the GP over more years, visit the GP when very elderly and claim more pensions. It is often cited as being 'obvious' it quite simply isn't.

And by the way the Guardian is on a par with the DM for utter bullshit, just from the other angle. That said at least there is another one, which says itself that the studies are hard to compare because they are set up with different parameters.

www.noo.org.uk/uploads/doc/vid_8575_Burdenofobesity151110MG.pdf

The Economic Burden of Obesity - non DM and non Guardian

www.noo.org.uk/securefiles/170125_1411Making%20the%20case%20for%20tackling%20obesity%20reference%20sheet-0308116.pdf

On average, obese people take four extra sick days per year

Harvey S, N. Glozier N, Carlton O. Mykletun A, Henderson M, Hotop M,
Holland-Elliott K. Obesity and sickness absence: results from the CHAP
study. Occupational Medicine. 2010. 60,5:362-368

Obesity is associated with an increased risk of developing a number of
chronic diseases and conditions including: type 2 diabetes, coronary heart disease, hypertension and stroke, asthma, depression, metabolic syndrome, dyslipidaemia, certain cancers, gastro-oesophageal reflux disease, gallbladder disease, reproductive problems, osteoarthritis and back pain, obstructive sleep apnoea, breathlessness, and psychological distress. Most of the complications of obesity can be reduced by weight loss.

National Institute for Health and Care Excellence. Obesity. Clinical Knowledge
Summary. October 2012.

Findings of large pooling studies used for the Global Burden of Disease 2013 show consistent risks as BMI reached more than 23 kg/m2, and especially for cardiovascular disease, cancer, diabetes, osteoarthritis, and chronic kidney disease.

Ng M, Fleming T, Robinson M et al. Global, regional, and national prevalence of overweight and obesity in children and adults during 1980–2013: a systematic analysis for the Global Burden of Disease Study 2013. The Lancet. 2014(384)9945:766-781.

*Does it need a citation? Isn't it obvious that if you are healthy, you spend far less time at the GPs, having tests at the hospital, requiring the use of carers and nurses etc?

I realise that this is just my opinion so am happy to be proved wrong.*

Not obvious at all. Having a heart attack at 70 is fairly cheap compared to someone who will spend 25 years going back to the GP with ankle pain, osteoporosis, digestive issues. Claim their winter fuel allowance and state pension for decades, then develop dementia and need 24 hour care in a nursing home. I would definitely need to see a citation to convince me fat people are expensive.

Well if the burden is that much then one person being on steroids or other meds that affect weight is one too many.

The faux concern and hand wringing about obesity is a smokescreen. Its really about cost which is why the NHS chooses the cheapest option for treatment as in Candys case.

penciltop i will tell you this. IF the NHS tried the same thing with me IF i happened to get ill the newspaper headline would be something like this.

"Slimmer who lost ten stone now has to undergo steroid treatment despite other more expensive option available"

Because you can bet your arse i would go to the press.