Ex stopping child maintenance while he takes children on holiday.

[Fragglewump]

My ex husband texted me to say that it makes sense to only pay half his child maintenance to me in August as he is taking the children away for 2 weeks so will have them with 'all the costs involved'. I told him that seeing as he has never contributed a single penny towards a school trip/residential or the times I take the children on holiday why should I pay for his holiday. He is 'gobsmacked' by my response.

BadKnee It was the way you phrased it. You just said "you can work more hours", assuming this was automatically possible for the OP. This may apply to you and some others but clearly doesn't to OP or most people in fact (I work free lance but can't just up my hours for two isolated weeks).

My ex pays less than that for our son and he is a prison officer!

Shocked at the people who can see both sides. He's taking his own children on holiday FFS.
He's booked it, he can save up for it. The OP still has almost all of her child related costs while they're away.
Seriously he needs to get a grip (and I say that as someone with experience of paying maintenance).

The only way OP's ex can be 'forced' to pay maintenance whilst he has the children overnight and/or holidays is if the maintenance has been agreed through the CSA or CMS.
OP if your's is an informal agreement it might well be worth going through the CMS. If its already a formal agreement then you need to speak to the agency or court involved.

hardofcleaning XH is self employed so earnings can be made to be quite low. He had another child with OW so reduced maintenance after then (halved it) but was paying more than CSA rate originally, so nothing I can do about it. I think £25 is based on around £12-£13K. I did look it up once.

His partner pays for everything that he can't afford, hence the holidays, flash car, expensive clothing etc, while he refuses to pay anything towards swimming lessons or school uniform as he thinks that the maintenance should cover every single thing that DC needs..

The trouble with self employment is that you can put so many of your everyday expenses through the books, like mobile, computer, motor etc, so he can reduce his earnings a lot.

There's a hell of a lot of duff "legal" advice knocking around these days on MN.

I agree, Collaborate. I really hope people take things they're told with a pinch of salt, since loads of posters give out crackpot advice without a thought to whether it's correct or not.

It's a court order but thinking about it he picks and chooses to suit himself i.e. He applied the csa rule to reduce maintenance when his child was born even though our divorce court order doesn't say that.

It REALLY riles me how many NRPs seem to think that their paltry amount of maintenance actually pays for half the costs of raising children. I'm not sure if there are just tons of genuinely stupid people around, or whether people just bury their heads in the sand, or whether they're just really mean people who would see their child go without rather than fork out themselves.

My ex pays nothing, silly man and he never has them even a night a year (his loss).
If there is a court order about child maintenance then your other half is supposed to follow it. He cannot just change things if he chooses unless he either goes back to court or the CMS (who can override a court order 12 months or more after it is in place in relation to child support) says otherwise.

Mine has 8 weeks school holidays (teacher, privstae schools) every summer and when they were little woudl not have them for even a night in tha tperiod and yet I was working full time and could afford just a week off in that period to take them away on holiday so had to pay 7 weeks of full time childcare, a very expensive business when you work full time.

The CMS amounts are not surprisingly ignored in many many financial consent orders - our court order says I pay/paid 5 sets of school and university fees whoever the children live with which is £50k a year and more. The cost of housing children is huge. Just because someone has his children for 2 nights does mean that your mortgage or rent for the larger place you need because you have the children all the time goes down.

It is time people started paying what they should. I earn 10x more than my ex but he still pays tax and could easily pay something.

It's a court order but thinking about it he picks and chooses to suit himself i.e. He applied the csa rule to reduce maintenance when his child was born even though our divorce court order doesn't say that. Sounds like you have arrears under the order then. You can enforce those (needing leave of the court for those over 12 months old) by applying for an attachment of earnings order. Assuming the order itself is over 12 months old either of you can go to the CSA and get them to replace the order with an assessment - only worthwhile someone doing it if it would alter the assessment to their advantage.

It REALLY riles me how many NRPs seem to think that their paltry amount of maintenance actually pays for half the costs of raising children.

It's not about paying half the costs. It's about paying what the state says you should, whether thats 10%, 50%, 90% or 100%. Someone paying 10% shouldn't be vilified, just as someone paying 90% shouldn't be deified because of it.

And he has made my son by his own ice cream on a family day out

It's only about paying " what the state says you should " if you are a total arse. So do you bring up YOUR kids doing the legal minumim the state says?

I don't, I do everyhthing I can for them. I don't just give them enough food and clothing to keep social services off my back. "

No kids, you cat get any Christmas or birthday presents because I'm not legally madated, to give you them " .

" the law doesn't say I have to send to you to swimming lessons /cubs /football so you are not going "

Why should RP ( mostly women ) be expected to devote their lives to their children's welfare while NRP ( mostly men ) do the legal minimum ?

k1ristina - well said

My ex pays £30pw for our 16yo ds -when he lost his job last year he stopped the money for 6 months. No explanation (until I chased one) no apology.
I was just expected to say "oh no problem" - despite the fact he has 2 other kids with his new wife. Do u think all of his financial commitments to his new family stopped whilst he was out of work? (I might add he has a well paid job and so does his wife, they are not on the breadline) - of course not!

He then started his own business and it seems is doing well. Never has he offered to pay back the money he missed out on.
I've never gone through the csa just relied on our own agreement.

Worst mistake of my life.

I suspect it's the latter, Hedgehog.

I also think that some posters overlook the fact that solicitors, courts and even the CMS cost money that some parents simply don't have.

The first 10 years of maintainence, at the rate I've been awarded it won't even equal what I've already spent on legal fees!

My XH pays £60 a month for our daughter. He sees her once a year for the day (his choice.)
He is semi-retired and supply teaches. Now remarried with another child.
Recently he saw our daughter on his annual daily visit and discovered that she was going on holiday next year with his other older daughter.
He promised to help her save for it and that he would put money in her account every month.
Guess what. He has loftily informed me that he will now only be paying me £30 a month for her maintenance as he is putting the other £30 a month in her account!
Words fail me.
I said no. Still waiting for a response.
Fantastic behaviour for a former head teacher.

CMS base their assessment on parents' income in the previous full tax year, ending 5th April.
If you think XP is expecting a pay rise, it might be in your interests to wait until 6th April before you contact them. Maintenance payments are due from when they start to process your claim, 2-3 weeks later.

wroly, I don't understand why second wives and girl friends are prepared to be with men like this. DO the men lie to the new women? I have not taken up a second date with a couple of men because they were showing off how much they evaded paying money that was due to their children. I would rather they were impoverished because every last penny went to the children (which is what most of us mothers do and the better fathers).

The idea there is some state minimum which is the right sum is weird to me too. I choose to pay a huge lot more than that never mind school and university costs, help with property plsu of course the hour by hour stuff like washing their underwear.

In some ways it has been liberating that he pays nothing and virtually does not see them. (He did manage some Christmas money this year for a change but only for for less than half the children which in itself is weird.

For example if you remarry a man like this surely you'd ask how much do you pay towards your children? Will you be funding their university costs? Who pays for their shoes? How much of their washing do you do a week? Or even why do you never take them on holiday> May be the women do ask and the men lie.

Out of interest, if absent father pays full CSA recommended amount, should he have to also pay haircuts (only time it's done), school uniforms and shoes every year, and school trips? He sees kids for 12 weeks over year, lives abroad and works full time whilst mum is stay at home carer for younger child (not his who has mild sn)

Enormous I agree that I don't understand how subsequent partners can be with men like this, but of course you have to remember that they will have been fed a lot of bullshit and therefore be completely on the side of their partner. They do the "poor little me, she's such a bitch" routine and the new partners swallow it up

It has certainly made me look at what I would expect from any future partners who had children and I would be encouraging them to pay proper maintenance and to have regular contact with their children.

I take it that as he has 'all the costs involved' the DC will be turning up to go on holiday with just the clothes they are wearing.

BadKnee
Two weeks away mean you save on childcare, you can work more hours, you are free of the "work" of having kids so there are financial upsides.

No, thats not how childcare works.
Not all workplaces have overtime available. And you cant always take if if you claim Tax Credits anyway.

If it is through CSA, then the reduction is based on the number of nights per year that he has them, not on a month-by-month basis. I very much doubt adding perhaps 10 extra days (I presume he would have had some weekends in August anyway) is going to put him in the next category of average nights per week.

If you have a private agreement, well, he has agreed to pay you a certain amount every month - he cannot pick and choose if that suits him or not. We do not only pay half our child maintenance in August, and we also have my stepson for two weeks of the month. Nor do we take a quarter off it in December.

He sounds like an absolute arsehole. I'd be contacting the CSA and getting them to recalculate his payments. Twat.

ditzy given that full CSA rarely comes close to 50% of the cost of raising a child I don't think its unreasonable for NRP to also aditionally pay for the odd thing here or there if the children are with them at the time. Haircuts, uniform and shoes don't equate to anything like the cost the RP will be shouldering constantly when that uniform is lost /turn / grown out of etc. There are so many costs incurred when you are the RP - just incidentals when you are out with them, a charity thing for school etc. I don't think its unreasonable for the NRP to dip into their pocket a little more when the kids are with them, no.