Not cut out to be a mother

[sailorcherries]

Posting here for traffic, at my wits end.

My DS is 6 and has never slept through the night. Not once. He is also the worst self soother in the world.

During the day he is happy to sit upstairs/downstairs on his own while I potter about but at night time WWIII breaks out regularly.

Despite trying everything (sit in his room and gradually move out the door; sit in my room and return him reassuringly; sit in my room and return him without speaking etc) he will refuse to sleep. He cries, gets out of bed, refuses to talk, scratches himself and makes himself sick. I have tried for months and nothing works. He is upset, I get frustrated and upset - I don't smack etc but let him know his behaviour is not acceptable and tell him that there is consequences the next day (tv time/games cancelled, grounded etc).
In the end I end up sitting near his door and he then falls asleep; after 2 hours of screaming and tantrums. If I sit near his door to begin with he will be quiet but won't settle for at least an hour.

Regardless of when he goes to bed he will wake 3-4 times for no apparent reason, come and find me, and then wake me to take him to bed.

I finally went to the dr and his suggestion was that DS didn't need as much sleep (as nothing suffers through lack of it) and to put him to bed later. This has not addressed the issues at bed time whatsoever.

What is wrong with me? Am I that shit a parent that I can't get the basics right? Will I fuck it up with the next? Is there something wrong with my DS? What the bloody hell do I do? Bed time brings me to tears every single night.

I feel for you all being a step family too, IME it makes parenting harder. My eldest DS is DH's stepson. DS is grown up (allegedly) now, but DH was very critical and I was very defensive, I always felt he thought DS genetically inferior and badly parented when he criticised. It's really important to get your DP on board in understanding the issues, because whether he thinks the issues are caused by you being too soft on him or whatever, you both need to parent together especially as you have a baby on the way.

Ask if he could be prescribed melatonin. It occurs naturally so it's not knock out drops. It may help,him drift off.

He does seem to have anxiety issues so maybe explore if there is something else going on?

This thread is strangely comforting for me. My 5 year old still doesn't sleep through the night and panics and cries if I try to leave him when he's still awake.

Our set-up changes every so often, depending on how exhausted I am and how the younger one (2) is sleeping.

At the moment, our set-up is the following :

Both boys put to bed in my bed. Bedtime stories and lights out. I stay between them until they are both asleep (usually 30-40 minutes)

When I go to bed, DH carries DS1 (5) through to his bed. I co-sleep with the 2 year old (who also doesn't sleep through) and DH sleeps in the 2 year old's (normal sized single) bed in DS1's room.

Frequently, DH finishes the night in DS1's bed.

We had a brief success with a star chart and a present after 7 days for DS1 not waking us up in the night. He still woke but knew he wasn't alone (DH was there) and went back to sleep by himself. It doesn't work when he has one of his frequent nightmares though, then he needs more comfort.

DS1 still begs to stay in my bed all night, but accepts he can't (I have co-slept with both of them before now but I get no sleep as they both cling to me all night).

He loves the book mentionned upthread "what to do when you worry too much". It's a bit too old for him (more for 7-8+ year olds) but I paraphrase it and that's fine. He gets very anxious about monsters, giants and burglars. Every night he cries and asks me if I'm really really really sure that monsters don't exist etc. He is also afraid of the dark.

He is slowly getting better, ever since we discovered he was lactose intolerant aged 4 - cutting out lactose meant he wakes 2-3 times a night instead of 7-8.

qwertie the step family part is hard as DS is obviously still building a relationship with OH and OH has been flung in the deep end with a head strong, demanding child.

Last night OH stayed out of it to stop DS getting mixed messages or upsetting him further. OH has never experienced this before and his own siblings were good sleepers so he doesn't know how to react

Could you record yourself reading some bedtime stories and have them playable to him? If he wakes he can just press play again and listen to you telling him a bedtime story?

Unfortunately neither OH or I could lift DS if he dropped off anywhere other than bed.

When he was born he was on the 98th percentile for height and weight and has steadily remained there. He is almost 4 and a half foot, similar heights and weights to an average 10yo. I'm only a foot taller so cannot lift him, neither can OH as he's a dead weight once asleep.

Sounds like you both have a really good approach to the step family thing, OP

My DS2 has special needs and took many years to settle by himself at night, probably he was at least 8. I felt that he couldn't understand well enough why I was leaving him and in the end I couldn't bring myself to do controlled crying etc. For me it helped just to accept that was the case and plan accordingly. As you are currently exhausted abandon the 2 hour battles, as you are having to give up and sit in the room anyway. For the moment, I would give yourself a break and go straight to the sitting in the room with him. Sit near the door so you can have enough light to see to read or do something you enjoy. Make yourself comfortable with cushions and a cup of tea and treat it as an hour of relaxation. Do this for as long as you need to, until you feel ready to start a new battle. He will eventually get better and it might be this is the easiest course for the moment.

At age 6, I would have thought you would be able to talk and reason with your Ds. In your heart, do you feel that he is taking you for a ride or do you think he is genuinely upset / frightened / unable to understand why you are leaving him? Rather than punishment, have you tried any type of reward system for him staying in bed and settling down?

Audiobooks have been a godsend for me with my Ds2. Even now (aged 15) I still leave him at night with one on (which then switches itself off after 20-30min) and then he settles down. Originally they worked to distract from the fact that I was leaving. If nothing else, maybe they would fill an hour or so if he just isn't tired enough to go to sleep or if you need to be somewhere else.

Sorry you are going through this. I know it's hard, but it will get better. Now my teenage Ds2 can sleep from 8pm until 9am the next day!

We have tried reward charts and the only thing that never got a sticker would be sleep related ones.

He understands I'm not leaving, knows I wi be back and we've even counted the steps from his bed to mine (7 for me and 10 for him). He just can't calm down.

He's agreed to pick out bed time books tonight and I'll read and then he can quietly read for an hour so I can work (7 steps away on my bed). Then when it's book down time I'll sit in the hall (his bed faces his door in to the hall). Fingers crossed!

My DS is 7yo and has never liked sleeping on his own. He refused to even be put down as a baby and still ends up in our bed most nights.

But he definitely doesn't need as much sleep as other DC. Unlike some of our friends' good sleepers, he can function no problem the day after a late night and doesn't turn into a psycho if kept up after his bedtime. So there are benefits

The easiest bedtimes for DS are when we tuck him up with his kindle. He will watch TV or a movie for a while then switch it off and go to sleep. If he's left with a book, or with nothing, he can stay awake for hours. We only allow the kindle on weekends and holidays, because it seems like 'bad parenting' to allow it on a school night, but if bedtimes were as hard as you describe I would do it every night without hesitation.

Maybe taking the heat out of bedtime by letting your son play, read, watch TV in his room with no pressure to lay in bed on his own and try to sleep will change the cycle? Not stressing about all the traditional bedtime 'rules' for a while might make a difference?

But I'm the last person who should be giving advice on sleep. Nothing I ever tried with DS 'worked' and I suffer terribly with insomnia myself. If you're a bad mother, so am I

Good luck, I hope something works and it improves soon. Nightly battles must be horrible for both of you.

I would definitely say you have a very anxious and needy children there rather than 'just' a headstrong demanding one. 'Demanding' sounds like you think he's doing it deliberately, but that's not the sense I'm getting from your other posts.

Possibly you'll need to swap rooms, so your dp and the baby go in your son's room and you have two single beds in your room in place of a double - a gap between beds should stop him kicking you awake all night!
I know, I know, it's not family life as anyone would imagine, but sleep (for you, I mean) is actually a physical need, and has to be a priority.
Other than that, I'd second the idea of switching focus from him sleeping to him letting you sleep.
Finally, have you tried any of the dawn/sunset clock lights? For DS (now 19) although the dawn setting doesn't have much effect, the slow sunset setting is much more sleep-friendly than suddenly turning a light off.

I'm sorry if this has already been mentioned, but have you actually tried talking to him and asking him why he has such trouble getting to sleep? And explaining that he is preventing you from sleeping also. I find if I sit down with my DD (just turned 5) and reason things out with her, she is very receptive and things do improve.

If you have exhausted everything you can think of, then it may be worth getting in touch with a sleep expert. A friend of mine used one and swears by her... worth a try at least.

Good luck OP

It all sounds so tense, angry and frustrating.

Ignore me if not helpful but I would try to make bedtimes enjoyable by snuggling up altogether with a funny book (David Walliams' are good if you put in funny accents), keep calm and co sleep.

When the book has ended you say ok sleepy time now or just close your eyes and if you need to, keep a light on and no longer engage/ read a book of your choice/give him a book to continue reading if he wants to.

The important thing is for you to keep calm and if you are tired say please could you keep quiet while mummy sleeps? So he has the option of reading or snuggling up next to you.

You could say he can snuggle up in bed with you if he is really quiet and doesn't wake the baby...

I have a 10 yr old ds who co sleeps and there is never any angst regarding bedtimes, he is bright and academic just anxious in the dark which he' ll probably naturally grow out of.

Don't even say 'bed time' if that causes anguish. Just go up to bed when you feel like it and rest and follow your own pattern which he can join in with. Just make sure there is nothing on downstairs that would make him want to stay up.

Take away gadgets early if he is dependent on them and only give them to him in the morning if he was quiet the night before so there is consequences for his actions but no punishment.

Good luck x

Lots of good advice on this thread, love reading everyone's siggestions.
Another idea which is also a big commitment but how so rewarding is getting a dog. I slept with my dog a big part of my childhood and loved it.

Suggestions

Your description of your son is screaming ASD and/or Gifted & Talented.

I would pursue an assessment if you're not already doing so, and try melatonin in the meantime.

You can also create a social story around sleep. "Sometimes when it is night I have trouble sleeping. Here are some things I can do instead of waking mummy" with pictures of reading, playing a game on the tablet, watch a show, get a snack etc.

Oh and feeling that you're not cut out to be a mother is a classic symptom of having a child with ASD!!!

Lots of sympathy OP.
It doesn't sound like he's doing this on purpose. If funds allow I think I'd be organising an assessment with a top notch child psychologist. I'd also recommend this book as a bit of an eye opener.

One thing you haven't mentioned trying is early waking. Have you tried breaking his sleep cycle by waking him after 2 hrs briefly? Probably won't work but worth a shot.
I'd make his room as nice as possible and let him listen to stories and let him control his sleep time. And try melatonin.

It's not you. You're a great mum. But you need to kick and scream til you get some help. Good luck OP.

My demanding I mean demanding behaviour, as it it demands a lot of time - never wanting to be alone etc. Not that I think he's doing this for attention.

gynopedies we can't get a dog - no one is in during the day and we have two cats already haha!
Our normal bed time routine is a bath, out and dried, teeth, snuggling up for a story and them bam ... WWIII! He is fine throughout all of this, will gladly go up for a bath knowing what comes next. It is the minute I try to leave while he is awake.

I'm not even sure it is the dark that scares him, as I said the hall light is on and he has 3 night lights of varying strengths. We also tried leaving his light on too!

I initially went to the drs to try and get melatonin and, chocolate teapot that he was gave us that sound advice! Our surgery is odd, there is no set dr after the original left and instead you are seen by whomever is free. Might try a different dr this time round and see if I can appeal. I'll also speak to my MW, as I have an appt next week and see if she can refer me to anyone, even a HV who might be able to do something.

It does really seem to be about being separated from you, as opposed to anything else.

I wonder if he's scared of something like burglars or a fire or you sneaking out and leaving him alone in the house, that he can't articulate.

Seems to me that you need to get to the bottom of why he is so terrified to be apart from you in order to sort this out.

No advice but wanted to say you are not alone, this sounds very much like my DD.

It has only really dawned on me now that she simply is a night owl, she does not need to go to sleep by 8, her time to get to sleep is 9-9.30. Shock horror!!!!

But bedtime has been a long drawn out process that is frustrating and depressing. We are trying to change things now by taking away the expectation of going to sleep, but she must be in bed with her choice of book/drawing/comic/puzzle book. She'll do this for 30minutes or so and then come and get me. I then have to lay with her till the point of her dropping off then I can go with the promise of returning and mist times she's fallen asleep.

I know people must think this is mad, but it's what my DD needs and yes sometimes I get angry about it but I also have accepted it and anyone who criticises me has no idea of the time and effort I've put in and the heartache!

Good Luck!

I think the psychological explanations for anxiety etc in case of asd or similar is barking up wrong tree without professional and specialist input.
If you have a brain that can't fall asleep the way normal brains do you'd be anxious about sleep. That's all really.
I know it's not set in stone that this is the issue in your case but I remember how unhelpful neurotypical sleep and anxiety advice is when you are tackling issues that are rooted in autism.

In terms of tackling the gp in our case it's only the pead and the camhs Dr's that can prescribe melatonin. I'm not sure if it varies by health care trust but it's a big hurdle for a very safe medication. Good luck

I've definitely not classed my son as anything. As I said, he has his quirks that aren't like some children but seems similar to others.
There's been no issues with socialising, school work, extra curricular activities. Just, quirks, for lack of a better word haha.

As I said during the day he doesn't scream or tantrum and could sit for maybe 10/15 minutes until he came to find me (cooking, cleaning etc). At night time though the minute I'm out his sights or he knows I'll be leaving his room it's an utter meltdown. Even if he didn't sleep but lay there the way he does during the day, without getting in to a tizz, I know he'd fall asleep as I'd be in within 10 minutes for reassurance.

One of mine was like this up until the age of 8.5. I couldn't leave the room until he'd nodded off. He'd also, always, end up in our bed at some point in the night, kicking, wriggling and snuffing so much that I never had an unbroken nights sleep. I thought it would never end.

I don't know what finally worked (other than him growing up a bit) but the routine now is bath (not every night), a story read by me, two long songs, low lights on and the radio tuned (very low) to Classic fm or Radio 3. It's left on all night so that if he does wake up he won't be afraid (he's another one scared to go upstairs on his own). Story tapes seem to spark his imagination and don't settle him.