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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To say to the council - you deal with it

189 replies

Lazyjane76 · 19/12/2016 11:37

I have been with my partner for 22 years, his relationship with his mum has been difficult over the years. He grew up with her threatening suicide regularly, at 9 she would tell him she would be dead when he returned from school. In the last few years he has managed a reasonable relationship with her, visiting once a week.
He has a brother who is severely disabled and lives in supported accommodation, he has behavioural problems and becomes aggressive when he drinks.
Last Sunday his mum had a brain haemorrhage. She was in intensive care where her condition kept improving and then deteriorating. She passed away on Wednesday.
All week we'd been told different things as her condition kept changing. this is no ones fault but we went from speaking about organ donation to rehabilitation to sitting at her bedside as she passed.
I'm obviously upset but I'm very angry.
She was 63, she brought up her 2 sons alone - my partner and his brother with severe learning difficulties. She cared for her disabled mum too. She had significant health problems - almost completely deaf, high blood pressure, asthma, depression and osteoarthritis from lifting her own mother out of a wheelchair. She used to have life insurance but cancelled it because she had to pay bedroom tax and couldn't afford it. She begged to move into a smaller property for years.
Eventually she moved to a council bungalow.
Over the last few years she has been systematically bullied by the DWP into getting a job. She had a 'fit for work' appointment a month ago, 1 year from her retirement where after her assessment she was told that she 'might get better'. Friday we were at her bungalow and a letter came informing her that she had to attend another assessment to assess her capability.
She has 19p in her bank account, she has a partner of 25 years who is a pensioner but they didn't live together.
We have no money,we work but live payday to payday. The council have said we need to borrow the money for a funeral from "somewhere". Where? And should we? My partner is pragmatic, in his opinion his mum passed on Sunday it just took until Wednesday for her body to catch up.
Does everyone else have thousands in the back that they can use for this?
As far as the council is concerned it's my partner's responsibility as next of kin, her partner doesn't count.
Am I being unreasonable to make the council pay?

OP posts:
Original poster
Lazyjane76 · 19/12/2016 14:43

expatinscotland - exactly, we're not doing this for shits and giggles

OP posts:
Original poster
Lazyjane76 · 19/12/2016 14:44

gabsdot - I don't want to approach a charity, they're stretched enough as it is and charity should be there for the living

OP posts:
lovelearning · 19/12/2016 14:53

There are loads of things I object my taxes paying for.But paying for the funeral of someone who has literally 19 pennies to her name is not going to be one of them.

+EnglishNotBingo

Boolovessulley · 19/12/2016 14:56

Op
I haven't read the whole thread but I would urge you to consider leaving the body to medical science.
My dd1 is a science student and you really would be helping future generations as they do need bodies to do their research,
Sorry to sound cold.

It's not upto her partner if he's not paying for the funeral.
Seriously you would be doing a good thing.

Daisyfrumps · 19/12/2016 15:14

It's not that easy Boolovessulley

Original poster
Lazyjane76 · 19/12/2016 15:22

BakeOffBiscuits - that's a disgrace but sadly I'm not shocked

OP posts:
Original poster
Lazyjane76 · 19/12/2016 15:23

deblet Thanks for the advice

OP posts:
Original poster
Lazyjane76 · 19/12/2016 15:25

Boolovessulley - it's not cold at all, it's just not as simple as you would think

OP posts:
CheshireChat · 19/12/2016 15:44

I really hope you get things sorted as I know from my mum how stressful it can be to deal with the grief and at the same time to try and figure something out.

It's one of the reasons it annoys me when people say it doesn't matter if you're poor or rich, you still have to deal with the pain. Yeah, you still grieve but you're spared a whole lot of hassle if you can just pay for some things. Even if just getting takeaways while you pull yourself together.

Original poster
Lazyjane76 · 19/12/2016 15:53

CheshireChat - you're so right, not being able to just take some timeout from all the stress to just be, is so hard.

OP posts:
BraveDancing · 19/12/2016 16:16

I think it's already been suggested, but Quaker Social Action are a charity that help with funeral poverty. If you give them a call, at the very least I am sure they can offer advice.

Upanddownroundandround · 19/12/2016 16:37

I'm sorry you are having to deal with all this. It sounds awful on top of grieving and shock.

I would note what another poser said about being careful about not signing anything.

If it came to it ultimately refusing to accept responsibility financially for the body will not stop you having a memorial service of your own for her at a minimal cost. You don't need the body for a memorial service to allow people to say goodbye and sharing memories.

Secondly you said in your op my partner and his brother with severe learning difficulties. She cared for her disabled mum too. If your DP has a brother then why is the responsbility only your DP's. I understand that mentally he may not be able to take on any responsibility but if he claims any kind of benefit then can you not claim for the funeral in his name with his permission but with you completing the paperwork and organisation. Obviously this may not be as easy as it seems but from a claim point of view, if he has benefits then he should be able to to claim as he is the decreased person's son the same as your DP? It's just a thought, I have no knowledge in this area.

Hope it gets sorted soon for you and your DP.

GooseFriend · 19/12/2016 16:38

Hi OP, what a horrid situation, many condolences. I think you may be too late for a medical donation. I already have this set up with my will and it all had to be sorted before death. This is because the body has to be stored in a certain way and checked within a short space of time and they may still turn it down if the condition etc isn't right.

It really feels like there should be a charity for this purpose and I'm sad you're having to deal with this as well as all your emotions and your Dp's and Christmas! Urgh!

I hope the CAB or PALS at the hospital can help.

Gatekeeper · 19/12/2016 16:53

Have a look at British Gas energy trust grants. They offer financial assistance for all manner of hardship cases including funerals

Janey50 · 19/12/2016 16:57

Sorry I can't offer any advice OP. My sympathies to you. A similar thing happened to me when my DM passed away 5 years ago. I am on long-term sickness and disability benefits (I am registered disabled and have several worsening health conditions). My older brother works part-time. He cannot work full time as he has a heart condition and a spinal problem. He receives the minimum wage. When my mum died,we applied to the council for a grant/loan for funeral costs,as neither my DB or I were in a position to pay nearly 2 grand,which was the lowest price we could find. We were refused point-blank. They said there 'must be another relative(s) who could pay,plus my brother was working,and they don't normally pay out to people who are in employment. The only other living relatives my DM has were 3 cousin's,whom had had no contact with her for 40 years,so we could hardly start asking THEM to pay. We appealed the decision,but the answer was still no. We ended up borrowing the money from my brother's girlfriend and paying it back to her over the next 12 months. It was a wholly unpleasant experience at an already stressful time. Bastard council

cherrycrumblecustard · 19/12/2016 16:58

They are really quite convinced everyone has a huge extended family, aren't they!

Janey50 · 19/12/2016 17:08

After reading some of the comments on this thread regarding dealings with local councils,I have come to the conclusion that council offices are staffed by people who are completely out of touch with reality,and live in cloud cuckoo land. They really do think that everyone without exception,has a huge,extended family who will always step in in times of need, whether it's coughing up money for a funeral,or providing accommodation for a family of 7 people. Ditto the DWP. As for sending letters to someone who has DIED,telling them they need to attend an assessment of fitness to work,FFS. I am incredulous at their utter stupidity.

Original poster
Lazyjane76 · 19/12/2016 17:15

Thanks for all the responses everyone, know that I am reading and digesting them all. With regards to DPs brother because of his disability and alcohol/behavioural problems his money is restricted. He gets £5 a day and his benefits are kept under a court of protection order.
We have an appointment tomorrow to register the death and speak to the council about the funeral or lack of. I'm ready for a battle - well my mind is, my body is saying "give me a rest"!

OP posts:
Original poster
Lazyjane76 · 19/12/2016 17:16

Janey50 - your experience sounds dreadful, was a Public Health Funeral not an option?

OP posts:
expatinscotland · 19/12/2016 17:46

You just tell them over and over. 'We have no money and we cannot get money. We cannot take responsibility for disposal of her remains. We have no money and we cannot get money.'

WiddlinDiddlin · 19/12/2016 18:28

I am sorry you are in this situation, it is horrible.

For all those suggesting leaving the body to medical science - they cannot do this now, that requires arrangements put in place before the person dies and is much harder than you might think. It is NOT possible to do this once the person has passed, no where, to be brutal, wants a decomposing human body.

For the OP keep speaking to the council, making your point you do not have the money you cannot find the money - but also research and see if you can find an undertaker to JUST cremate her - no coffin, no service, no anything else, literally dispose of the body and get quotes for the costs of that.

The reason I say this is, if you don't it is likely the council will give her their 'paupers funeral' and it will cost MORE than this and they will then hound YOU for the money from here to bloody eternity racking up CCJs and bailiffs along the way.

I realise you don't have the money for anything but unfortunately thats what will happen and it will end up costing more money that you don't have!

expatinscotland · 19/12/2016 18:42

'The reason I say this is, if you don't it is likely the council will give her their 'paupers funeral' and it will cost MORE than this and they will then hound YOU for the money from here to bloody eternity racking up CCJs and bailiffs along the way.'

Don't see how they can legally force a person to pay for a funeral. If she had an estate, I can see their going after that.

Original poster
Lazyjane76 · 19/12/2016 19:11

WiddlinDiddlin - can they chase us for money for a funeral we haven't signed for? Shock

OP posts:
Upanddownroundandround · 19/12/2016 19:45

With regards to DPs brother because of his disability and alcohol/behavioural problems his money is restricted. He gets £5 a day and his benefits are kept under a court of protection order.
Yes but the money would not go to him would it? I really don't know but I would be very surprised if they just transferred over some cash. Would it not be on an invoice basis? Anyway just thoughts really but I think it would be worth enquiring as DB is as much a next of kin as your DP. Do hope it gets sorted.

Daisyfrumps · 19/12/2016 19:48

I wonder if the circa £1000 fee for 'direct cremation' could have been even less in our case - if the undertaker could have transported the body to the crematorium direct from the hospital mortuary. Here was our quote:-

The cost includes removal from (hospital), sorting out the paperwork and provision of a simple cardboard coffin. The cost is £675. In addition, you will have the cost of the crematorium. (Crematorium) charge £450 for their basic cremation service (no service, organist etc.). So you are looking at at total cost of £1125 assuming that there is a Coroner's post mortem.