AIBU to ask that opposite sex siblings don't share bedroom at XH's?

[shallichangemyname]

We have 4 DCs, two girls 16 and 11, and two boys 13 and 11 (the 11 yos are boy/girl twins). At my home the boys share a room. XH put the twins in together, and I asked him not to as I thought they were too old now for that. He has 3 bedrooms available, so two of the DCs can have their own room and the other two must share. He agreed to change the arrangements. This was back in the summer. Now I've found out that he changed it only for a couple of weeks and then put them back in together and told them all to lie to me about it (in fact DD2 says that he threatened them that if I found out I would stop/reduce contact and he would then have to "drag mummy through the courts" and DS2 has independently confirmed that a similar comment was made to him). I've googled it and public housing law, as well as NSPCC recommendation, is that opposite sex siblings over 10 shouldn't share.

www.reference.com/government-politics/laws-u-k-siblings-sharing-bedroom-41d1d69a5864a28e#
We've had a bit of a row about it. He doesn't see what's wrong with it. He muttered something about putting DS2 on the sofa instead of with his sister. I don't think this is fair, he should have his own bedroom space shouldn't he (when it is available)? I think he is babying the twins to put them in together (they are quite young for their age), and he's prioritising the needs of the older DCs above the needs of the younger ones. Either the girls should share, or the boys, I really don't care and that's his choice (personally I think in in terms of age the boys are a better fit, but I acknowledge that the 13 yo hates sharing with his younger brother).

I feel strongly about this, and the lies. I've told him no overnights (but daytime will continue, so I'm not cutting off contact) until this is resolved. He says he'll take me to court. I don't care, I'll happily tell the judge that I'm content for overnight contact as long as they don't share a room.
For background, XH has spent the last 7 years living abroad and seeing the DCs only 3 or 4 times a year during holidays, so he has a bit of a black hole in his day to day parenting skills.
I don't care if they share for the odd night - eg if one of them is ill, if they go to visit friends/grandparents etc - but I think the home arrangement should be that the twins don't share.

The twins have both told me they'd be embarrassed if their friends knew they were sharing. The 11 yo DD has also just this week started her periods.

AIBU to ask for separate rooms, and AIBU to stop overnights until this is agreed?

Worra when I raised it with him a few months ago (when he moved back here) it was my concern, the children hadn't said anything. I just felt that as they were approaching puberty it would be sensible to start off in a new home with either the boys or the girls sharing. I didn't say anything to the DCs, I didn't involve them. I thought that as parents we could discuss this, and we did, and he told me he saw my point and would change the arrangements. Bear in mind this is the first time in their lives that he has had them for regular contact, before this he has seen them only 4/5 weeks a year during holidays (he lived abroad).

Now that DD2 has started her periods, and when it came out about what he'd told them (to lie to me), I did sit down quietly with each twin, separately, to have a chat to them, and it transpires from this that DD2 feels very strongly about not sharing, DS2 doesn't like it but less so than his sister. DD2 says she has said all this to her F but he isn't listening to her.

I am supportive of contact. It's not something I want to use as a weapon. When we first separated 6/7 years ago (before he moved abroad) at different times one or other of the DCs would refuse to go to see him, and I always encouraged them to go (and made them if they still wouldn't). I have always tried to get him to see more of them - until last year, the most he'd ever had them at one go was 7 days.
I do feel he lacks a little insight and needs to think about the children's needs a bit more - for example, he expected the DCs to fly unaccompanied on a 7 hour flight when the twins were just 6 (Emirates will take unaccompanied minors from that age).
I think the 16 yo and the 13 yo are more vociferous than the twins that they want their own rooms and that he's taking the easy option and is prioritising the older DCs over the younger ones.

I also have b/g twins who are 11.

I think you have to take a step back. There are not enough bedrooms and 2 of the 4 have to share.

Your H thinks it should be the twins, you think it should be the girls or the boys.

Maybe there have been massive tantrums by the older boy or older girl when they've been told by their father that they should share with one of the twins. Maybe he thinks as they go to bed at the same time (presumably) and presuming this is earlier than the older ones, it makes sense. Maybe he just doesn't agree with your concerns.

You don't get to dictate the terms of contact. You can only communicate with him, ask him to communicate with the children. As long as they're not coming to any harm, then unfortunately I think you have to stay out of it and YABVU if you stop overnight stays because its not on your terms. A Judge would frown upon that.

FWIW, I think you're potentially projecting your issues about sharing onto the children. They're 11. Mine share all the time even though they have their own rooms - they frequently ask to have a mattress on the floor of the other so they can be together - have a younger one too and they all love sleeping in the same room.

As the 16 yo is 50:50 in each home I assume he will be able to claim WTC and possibly also housing benefit (I'm a 40% tax payer so not entitled to any of these)
It is very unlikely that he will be able to claim any benefits relating to the children.

I don't care if they share for the odd night - eg if one of them is ill, if they go to visit friends/grandparents etc
So it is OK for them to share when it suits you but not when it suits him??

Why can't your twins share

Well then it won't be long before the twins decide in their own minds that they don't want to visit overnight any more.

So you don't need to stop overnight contact, do you?

You said you always encouraged them to go in the past, (and made them if they still wouldn't).

Well don't make them this time as they're old enough to decide for themselves.

I did sit down quietly with each twin, separately, to have a chat to them, and it transpires from this that DD2 feels very strongly about not sharing

She feels that strongly about it that she had never mentioned it until you 'sat down quietly and had a chat with her about it'?

I really feel you are projecting your feelings onto the dc.

Can the kids not just.... you know.... sleep where they want o? What's he going to do, lock them in the "correct" bedrooms?

I find it weird that people have an issue with opposite sex siblings sharing a room on an occasional basis. My 14 year old dd and 12 year old ds share when we go on holiday in a twin bed hotel room; I am certainly not paying for 3 hotel rooms!

I wonder what people think is going to happen

You are being overly controlling.
What if the roles were reversed and your ex was telling you which of the children should be sharing?
You'd be perfectly within your rights to say 'my house, my rules'. He's within his rights to arrange things as he thinks best. He's not putting anyone in danger. However by bringing the children into such petty disputes you are both causing untold damage. Get over it. Focus on what really matters which isn't who shares with whom. What really matters is that your children are relaxed and comfortable in both homes and they will only be that if they believe that both parents respect the other and will support the decisions they make.
Honestly please let this go and say to the children - 'dads house, dads decision' and end the discussion there.

Tups I know £ is separate from contact, I was replying to a PP's question, not linking the two issues.
Just to be clear, I am not saying I will take him to court. He's saying he'll take me to court. I've said that's fine, I am agreeable to reinstating overnight contact and that's what I'll tell the court, but I want him to rejig the sleeping arrangements - not because of a silly whim on my part but because I feel strongly that pubescent opposite sex siblings should ideally be in separate rooms. I don't see why I would look foolish if this was my position as a Respondent to an application? The NSPCC advice is this: "We would not advise that children of the opposite sex over the age of 10 share a room." There must surely be a reason for this advice? I realise the other thing is public housing law, but again it must be an indication of what is considered to be the right thing?
If there was no other choice, fine, but there is, he has 3 bedrooms to share out between 4 children.
I can see on the one hand how this is interpreted as unreasonable control on my part, but on the flip side it is a genuine concern on lots of different levels.

But what are you actually concerned about op?

Persian you can claim child benefit if you are not the main carer, as long as the other parent isn't claiming. I didn't think you could, but the child benefit people wrote to me when he applied and asked me if I objected to him claiming, I phoned them and said I didn't and they told me that he was entitled to claim. As DD1 is with him 50% I assume he is entitled to WTC (as I am not claiming), and may be entitled to housing benefit as well, but that's not the issue here anyway.

He's saying he'll take me to court.

I don't blame him.

I can't see the court taking very kindly to you stopping contact for this, nor you stating you will only reinstate if what you want is put in place.

Can I ask what are you actually worried about? What do you think could happen if your son and daughter share a room with each other? What is the risk?

And, is that risk really worth the potential upset/damage that a court battle could cause?

(Note that when things go to court you will have no influence on the outcome)

I doubt any judge would regard 11 yo opposite sex siblings sharing a room as a safeguarding matter or dictate sleeping arrangements to your ex. You may think it's wrong. Your ex doesn't. Neither of your opinions is worth more. So at your house you do one thing, at his he does another. You can't dictate what he does at his house any more than he can tell you what to do at yours. You are being utterly unreasonable.

He sounds like a clueless tosspot who cba to put his children first imo.

My 10/11 dd/ds would HATE to share on a regular basis.

What will be the outcome if he does take you to court?

And would he be trying to get full custody or keep the original arrangement?

Either way it would cost you an awful lot of money for little benefit if the courts did agree with your ex

You are entitled to your strong beliefs / feelings. But these don't over ride the children's rights to see their father.

It's about their welfare , not your opinions.

The court would not accept that some theoretical risk to the children ( which you have not explained ) was so great that it should put aside the children's rights to see him .

Anyway this doesn't affect your child who is 16 . Are your seriously planning to stop the younger ones going to their fathers when the 16yo goes?

Persian you can claim child benefit if you are not the main carer, as long as the other parent isn't claiming
Yes the non main carer can claim the CB but then only that parent can claim CTC and HB for that child.

Giving up the right to claim the CB is a big mistake.

He sounds like a clueless tosspot who cba to put his children first imo.

Errrrr how. Just because he doesn't agree with OP? or are you projecting

The NSPCC advice is this: "We would not advise that children of the opposite sex over the age of 10 share a room."
Have you got a link to that NSPCC advice??

puberty does cause issues in other ways, when lads (and girls) hit that age they need their privacy (without going into too many details) but when the hormones kick in they may feel an urge at times to relieve themselves and sharing with your brother or sister could inhibit you. I know this sounds odd, but at 12 I was like this and so would many others have been. Having said that I wouldn't want to share with anyone, male or female in that situation. Then when your DDs figure starts developing and she needs a bra, getting dressed and undressed is awkward, she shouldn't have to go to the bathroom to get changed.

Tups I'm concerned about lots of things. He's not listening to the younger ones and prioritising the older ones. He agreed he'd sleep them separately when we had quite a reasonable and honest chat about it and then when he was having second thoughts he didn't make any attempt to have a discussion, just changed things and told them to lie to me. I'm really concerned about the lying. DD2 is particularly upset about all of this and wanting to not share with a boy. I'm also concerned that his reaction to things is to be defensive and not to communicate - I am a big communicator, he is big on "my time, my business", so there is no co-parenting at all. This shouldn't be assumed to be an indicator that I am constantly interfering, this is the first time I've ever commented on his arrangements, I mean more general co-parenting (eg helping DD1 choose a sixth form, helping her to choose her A'levels, dealing with school complaining about the behaviour of one of the DCs, stuff like that, I thought we might discuss whether there could be an agreed approach to things like this). I've been dealing with all of this stuff on my own until now, I was delighted when he moved back here, I was looking forward to a more equal co-parenting relationship, but he doesn't seem to want this at all.
It's very easy to say I'm projecting my feelings onto the twins, my conversation with DD2 was really very low key. I started off saying sorry to her that she had felt she had to lie, that was really not fair at all, and I asked her how she really felt about the rooms. If she'd said she didn't care I'd have accepted that. But she looked so sad, saying she didn't like it and "I told Daddy why I don't like it and he wouldn't listen". The conversation developed, I didn't put words in her mouth. I did tell her that she needs to stand up for herself and tell her Daddy how she really feels (her answer to that was a rather sad, that it was pointless because he won't listen).

I agree with a PP that I should take a step back and make it the children's problem for them to sort out, but that's a lot at 11 when you are being told that the older 2 are more important and when you've already tried and failed. Actually I think I would be rather failing as a parent if I just sat back and let it get so bad that DD2 started refusing to go (she said something about this and I ignored/glossed over it because that is NOT what I want).