To be so upset, worried and angry at son

[dogsdieinhotcars]

Son is 16. Text about 21:00 saying he's staying at a friend's. Someone I don't know. So I say no, don't know them or parents. He's 16 (just). He says everyone is so he is. I'm saying no. Where are you? Says somewhere vague about 3 miles away. I insist. He continues to say nonsense about why and can't get back coz he got there by taxi. Basically I ring him. Tell him he has to get home. Where are you? Asks his friend who laughs and says somewhere about 6 miles away. I am angry and shout telling him I need an address to pick him up. He won't give it. Don't know! Puts phone down. I text. His dad texts saying you Ave until 22:00 to tell us the address. He must turn his phone off after I text how disrespectful he is being. And he has not answered nor text since. I have gone through anger, to hurt and now fear. I am so worried and yet immensely disappointed. I never raised him to be like this. I have to work at 07:00 and I am so churned and anxious. He is still my child, and I thought he was a friend to me. I don't know what to do.

Italiangreyhound Wed 30-Nov-16 09:04:12
math what would a boundary be without a rule to enforce it rules help us know about boundaries and what happens when they are broken

They are different things altogether.

Boundaries are your sense of who you are and who others are. When you have good boundaries you can distinguish your thoughts and feelings from those of others. You do not manipulate, violate or use other people. You do not project.

They are not the general rules a family or a couple or parents and children abide by. They are the limits and rules you set for yourself within a relationship.

People who are very aloof have rigid boundaries. They are over protective of themselves.

People who get over-involved with others have porous boundaries. They do not protect themselves enough and they are not careful to protect others. They project, manipulate, over share, seek to control, and blame.

People with healthy boundaries otoh accept it when others say 'No' to them and they can say 'No' to others themselves. They communicate directly and honestly their wants and needs. They own their feelings and their reality. They do not force others to maintain their equilibrium.

This is why the lost friendship thing is so unhealthy. It may well be that the early description of the DS as a 'follower' is also unhealthy - is DS really a follower or does he simply do things that his parents do not want him to do and they assume that he could not possibly have agency...

Phrases like:
'How could you do this after all I have done for you...?',
'You make me feel anxious',
'You make me so angry',
'I thought we were friends!'
...are indicators of unhealthy boundaries.
When you tell a child or a teen that they have that sort of power over your feelings you are:
(1) manipulating them,
(2) burdening them with a responsibility for your feelings that is actually yours,
(3) teaching them to feel responsible for other people's feelings (and that other people have power over their feeling)s,
(4) forcing them to be 'perfect' in their relationship with you (and they will seek to be 'perfect' in order to secure the love of others in due course),
(5) giving frightening power to a child or teen, causing insecurity,
(6) blaming.

Parents who confidently parent own their own feelings and do not attempt to change behaviour by presenting themselves as victims of their children who stay out late or all night, or who get into trouble of one kind or another.

(There are cases where children have mental health or emotional problems and parents are truly abused - that is not what I am talking about here).

Jesus math you really do read an awful lot into one comment made by a father to his son (not the OP) in the heat of the moment in response to some bad behaviour. Sure it wasn't the best thing to say, and maybe the situation wasn't handled perfectly, but it really doesn't deserve a huge parenting lecture. Most of us fuck up from time to time, and then we sit down and talk it through with our children with no harm caused to anyone.

Math very interesting. Although, I think you may be extrapolating too much here on a family you don't know. We all say things in the heat of the moment.

nooka "In my experience good friends do give safety advice and freak out if you are planning to do something stupid. Why wouldn't you? Teenage friends may have different ideas as to what is safe and what is not but why wouldn't they care about their friend's safety? My kids care about their friends, and I really hope that's not unusual."

I agree, to a point. My friend at 16 could easily have put me in a dangerous situation where I was pressured into sex. Because her ideas what was acceptable or normal/desirable were different to mine.

She was in a relationship and wanted me to go on holiday with her, her boyfriend, and another guy. The guys were older than us.She was assuming I would want to run around naked and have sex with her boyfriend's friend.

This was planned without my knowledge! Luckily, I found out what was planned and backed out of the holiday.

My dd would not be going on holiday with unknown men at 16 (or staying the night out, if possible!), but if it had happened to me I might have told my parents it was just me and my friend on holiday.

I am going to try and practise the art of open questioning! Not "Is it just you and XZY?" But rather, "Tell me what is planned? If my parents had asked that they would have known the holiday could not be just the two of us! Luckily, it never got as far as lying to my parents!

cant help thinking that there will be a DIL on MN in 10 or 15 years talking about her PITA MIL who demands to know that her PFBs pants are being ironed and wont give the grandchild back as DIL isnt looking after it properly.......

Nooka, it was a very 'off' thing to say to the DS, and it was reported by the OP as if it was the most obvious and reasonable choice of response to this situation. People don't just text random, out-of-nowhere stuff to each other in times of crisis. (Or what they perceive to be a crisis).
ItalianGreyhound - when you have time to type something and press send, and nobody is standing in front of you threatening your personal safety, you tend to say what you really mean, or you say something that is well in character - in this case manipulative, an attempt to induce guilt.

Everything else the OP said about the relationship indicates that this text was the real deal, very characteristic of the parents' approach.

Alreadytaken -
Actually mathanxiety I suspect the teenagers you know who get into serious trouble are the ones whose parents were equally convinced their parenting was perfect.

I am sure I have never claimed my parenting is perfect. I certainly do not feel that way about it.

The OP otoh is a parent who sees no issues at all with her approach, and I wish her well with that.

This is just anecdotal, but one of the most messed-up people I know is a niece of mine who was brought up by parents who had a conniption at the mere thought of nail polish on 9 yo girls. She got a Barbie as a birthday gift once from a friend, and it nearly drove them over the edge. You can turn the big wide world into a cornucopia of forbidden fruit very easily. Once a child realises that the really little things that a parent lost sleep over are really, really small and unimportant things, the rest of the parent's judgement is very easily questioned.

Math you are obsessed with this thread. Take a breather love

Who exactly are you, Fivegoldrings?

Math you seem to know a lot about this family.

Who are any us!

You can tell a fair amount about a family, how they communicate and their assumptions and expectations from a fairly detailed description of assumptions, expectations and communication.

Math I am sure some of your posts have some sensible things to say but the way you are expressing your views is really off-putting, IMHO!

Dogsdieinhotcars really hope all is OK with your son. Hope you will find the right way forward.

Math I mean you are sounding very judgmental of the OP.

There is a difference between judgement of the OP and proposing that she and her DH have issues in their relationship with their son and their approach to communication with him. Maybe this is an 'eye of the beholder' thing?

The OP herself seems to be calling people who think she could have done a better job of handling the incident "haters of me and my husband" so I am not sure the eye of that particular beholder is reliable.

There is no judgement implied. A long post is not necessarily a lecture. A post that occupies a good deal of space on the screen because of spacing choice is not necessarily even a long post.

I think unfair extrapolations have been made by some.

Off to bed. (me I mean, that was not an instruction!)

Jesus there are some sanctimonious Posts on here.

Now there is a long lecturing post about it not it not being a long lecturing post.

Six sentences is a long post?

Six lines of text?

Maybe the problem is attention span.

math you are lecturing - and coming across as pretty obsessed. That make me think something went so seriously wrong in your parenting that you now have to convince yourself that your way was the only way. Well to me not teaching your children that they have an effect on how others feel - yes, even how their parents feel - is neglectful parenting so perhaps that is where you went wrong.

The boy is 16 - immature and NOT an adult. You want to force children to become adult before their brains are ready. But he is becoming an adult and therefore needs to learn that actually he can upset, worry, make people angry and that is a power he has to control if he wants to have good relationships - not just with parents but with anyone. When he stays out all night with his mates and doesnt phone his wife that relationship isnt going to last.

You seem to be really concerned that if 16 year old children are not allowed total freedom their relationship with their parents is ruined. Well all the ones I know who were not allowed total freedom at 16 have grown into responsible adults leading normal lives while some of the ones allowed to do whatever they please are now homeless and/or on drugs. Sometimes prioritising a great relationship with your child can ruin their lives.

Not all 16 year olds are immature..

I don't know whose posts you have been confusing with mine, Alreadytaken.

A 'great relationship' with your child doesn't necessarily mean that you consider your child your friend. A parent acting as such can have a great relationship with her child, and the child can still enjoy plenty of freedom.

Any parent who insinuates to his or her child that one single incident entails the loss of 'friendship' with the parent is carrying on a relationship that has a lot going awry in it.

There is a huge difference between that and teaching your children to be empathetic, to put themselves in the shoes of others, and that what they do and say can have an effect on others. The difference is that the child in this case was held responsible for maintaining the relationship. This is as you yourself insist, a child, after all.

I've met many 16 year olds who think they are mature, however we're talking about one boy staying out, drinking, switching off his phone.

math talking to you reminds me of the phrase you can’t teach a pig to dance; it’s a waste of your time and it irritates the pig. Your dictatorial list included (3) teaching them to feel responsible for other people's feelings (and that other people have power over their feeling)s

'Responsible for other people's feelings' is not the same thing as 'having an effect on others'. It is a really big difference.

As I stated - "...the child in this case was held responsible for maintaining the relationship. This is as you yourself insist, a child, after all."

You can choose to misread what I said as much as you like (or maybe you can't help it) - it doesn't alter what I said.

as I said - cant teach a pig to dance.

I thought math'S post was fascinating. I had not considered boundaries and rules before.

In general my parents were very good, but I it when they asked me (in voices filled with emotion) "where did we go wrong?!" When they were telling me off. It was the implication that my
Life was a total fuck up because they had messed up, and that my very being was their responsibility, that I had no part in forming my personality, but I should feel lots of guilt for making them unhappy.

(I was a pretty good student, good uni, then good job. No drugs, no major behavioural problems. Quite boring, really.)

But the boundary thing has really Struck a chord. I realise that I avoid using that kind of language with my own DC but I could see a time where it could be tempting and I would avoid it.

Thinking carefully about these issues, like maths does, does not scream 'over-invested' to me. She just seems Insightful.

Alreadytaken - it wasn't your finest moment. Though I tend to be an optimist.