AIBU to not work for free?!

[PinkyPie80]

Fucking awkward situation I've got myself in. I've name changed as fear this might out me.

I do cakes on the side, not professionally but if it's anyone's birthday etc I will be the one that makes the cakes and I charge for my time to make the cake but not at a professional rate.

We have a family friend that we have known for years. She owns a restaurant and struggled when she first started out so all of our family supported her and brought custom to her restaurant in the form of friends and we recommended her on Facebook etc. She is now successful and doing well.

She asked my mother if she knew anyone that would make her sisters wedding cake. My mum suggested me, the family friend said "money no object" She is foreign and sometimes the language is a barrier so I'm wondering whether my mother misheard her.

Last night my mother and I went to the restaurant to talk about what she wanted. She had cooked us a meal for free so we could sit down and discuss it. Quite an elaborate 2 tier cake with 80 cupcakes. I took the details and at the end she said "don't charge me for the labour, just charge me for the ingredients" I laughed thinking it was a joke but her face was deadpan and she said "I will take you out for a meal afterwards to say Thankyou"

Now because I had just eaten a 3 course meal for free and she is a family friend, I didn't say anything at the time. Came back home and my DH has gone off his tits, saying I can't do all those hours of work for free/a meal.

The wedding is 17th December so she hasn't given me a lot of notice

I have no bloody idea what to do now, what to say!!! Help mumsnet!!

In my view, the meals, wedding presents and invitations to the wedding don't come into it. They are all things you haven't asked for and should not be taken into account as 'payment' or part payment for the cake.

The question to ask yourself is what is the sum you are prepared to do it for (ie £150 or whatever it is you calculate your hours spent at £x/hour) plus the cost of ingredients. Don't overthink it. What is my time worth? Would I be prepared to do this for £150, £200, £250? Whatever it is, there will be a figure.

In your shoes I would feel that the deal has not got off to a good start and would be feeling quite resentful already. And on the day of delivery, after three trips to the venue and a stressful few days trying to do it around the DCs I would be feeling even more resentful. So I would think about that too and make sure the figure I first thought of made it all worth while.

Have you responded to the "family friend" yet OP?

£150 is ridiculously cheap for 80 cupcakes and a 2 tier cake as it is.

we are invited to the wedding that I should do it for free on this occasion
You don't invite someone to a wedding to get a free cake.

Stick to your guns, a call to clarify it. You could even get some quotes from local cake bakers, and say that professionals charge say: £300, I will do this for£150 which is much less than a professional cake baker. If not, refund her meal and don't do it!

Tbf reading your posts, she is taking the piss. I would not want to do her cake or have anything more to do with her tbf.

Give her the £20 for the meal and tell her the price

There's a reason why her buisness is running well in profit - because she cuts the deals as she sees them.

Exactly, pay for the meal you had, and charge her £200 with delivery. Tbf I just wouldn't do that. I payed £80 for an off the shelf M&S wedding cake 13 years ago. She can do that, and get some M&S off the shelf cupcakes too, will probably cost her more than £40 cheeky woman.

As she is your parents friends I would speak to them and explain how much you would normally earn for that amount of work. You could suggest that the making of the cupcakes and cake are a joint present from them and yourselves to her for the wedding and that your parents reimburse you for your time instead of giving the couple a wedding present.

Or tell a white lie and email saying that you have just received a request from a paying customer which you can't afford to turn down. Tell her you can only do one of the items - whichever is easiest for you and include the (slightly inflated) cost of ingredients.

I wouldn't do it. The chances are there'll be bad feelings. Making the cake will be a joyless exercise because as you're putting in the hours you know they won't really appreciate what you've done because they'll be looking for opportunities to criticise.

If you do go ahead, make sure discussions are by email (using text or chatting is asking for trouble), and only go ahead once they clearly agree.

After that when you try to get paid you'll probably have a blood-out-of-a-stone palaver, "what about a meal instead?", "what about x/y/z we've done for you/your parents/someone who lives on your street?". That alone would put me off going ahead.

You know this will probably be a whole series of hassles and moaning and more funny looks. Would you do this for a stranger coming along and effectively announcing "I'm going to be a right pain in the arse, how about it?"

Millie's Cupcakes are £3 each, OP. This woman needs reminding how expensive they are to buy - to expect you to make 80 AND a wedding cake for £40 is ridiculous.

Personally I wouldn't do it, even for £150. It's too much work and too little money.

Sorry, I meant to say I'd do it for someone else for £150, maybe, but I wouldn't do anything for this woman.

If mates rates were done to every person that knew a friend or relative that business would not last. I would not expect mates rates of someone I didn't know just because they know my sister/ cousin/ old friend from school.

I would not do it at all tbh. You could use your time elsewhere and I don't think you'd get your money. Just say no.

If she wanted £80 Millie's cupcakes, she would be paying £240 just for them. Cheeky mare. Just day your busy as you have a lot of paying customers before Christmas.

1 - given its only 4 weeks to the wedding and the piss taking attitude I suspect the person who WAS going to do it has dumped her cheapskate arse!

2 she KNEW you'd feel obligated if she fed you.

3 she KNOWS how much the ingredients etc cost as she runs a catering business!

4 parents ALSO taking the piss! They shouldn't be volunteering your services without your permission. If someone asks them about doing a cake, they should at most say 'we'll give you ops number/email and she can discuss details with you'.

5 I had a 2 tier cake 20 YEARS ago - £150 no cupcakes! I suspect you're massively undervaluing

Ingredients
Accessories (base, pillars, boxes, topper, cupcake holders)
Fuel costs (cooker/fridge/mixers etc and delivery)

M&s as someone said up thread it would cost her MINIMUM

£160 for 2 tiers - minimally decorated
£75 for 48 cupcakes
£12 for pillars etc
Total £247!

I have 2 friends who do 'cakes on the side' no way would they do her request for less than £175! And she'd be getting a bargain!

I'd pay her for the meal you've already had and tell her to fuck off get real!

why is the cost of the OP's mother's meal being taken into any calculations? She's not helping to make the cake. No-one does work in exchange for a feed for their mum.

OP, please charge your rate, and if the meal she gave you is brought up then you should tell her you didn't realise it was a bribe. If she asks for payment you should say, "ingredients only? £5.75!" as storm suggested.

Stick to your guns - if she wants a cake she has to pay for it being made. Ask her if she thinks a builder would charge for the bricks and mortar only then happily build the wall for free. Why is a cake any different?

Actually here's a thought.

As she owns a restaurant tell her to make the basic cupcakes and the cake and you will do the decorating as you and your parent's wedding present to her sister. That way you avoid the grunt work part of it - she has to get her arse in gear and provide the cakes - and you do the artistic part.

Still annoying to do for free, but does it cut out enough of the work to make it less of a pain?

You are in a very strong position op.

They are up against it, this time of year you could make a fortune in the same time, making Christmas cakes and cupcakes to sell.

Your time is at a premium! They have left this to the last minute, they need to understand that you have a business to run.

Know this... if you take this order for anything less than £200, you'll kick yourself. We all know how picky, difficult and obnoxious the clients are going to be.

It's £200 if confirmed this week, and 50% deposit paid otherwise the price increases by 50% if order isn't placed by the end of Nov.

Or she can find someone else.

Also, OP, you're factoring in driving the cakes over etc - if you're doing that for a pittance, make them pick them up!

In a sense the cost of equivalent cakes from M&S or a 'professional' cake maker running a business is irrelevant - although it does demonstrate what a cheek she has! The only figure that really matters is what YOU are prepared to do them for. The figure that makes your time and hassle and swallowing your bad feeling about the whole thing worth it.

If it were me, the bad feeling I'd have towards her (and possibly my parents for getting me into this in the first place) would long outlast £150....

This cake is for DM's friend's DS? I wouldn't even do mates rates for her. People don't want to pay the money and and like to get something for nothing, although I've also noticed that if something is cut price or not paid for they aren't what you could call grateful. Say no, and don't let anyone volunteer your services again.

The more I read, the more I think that making this cake at all - even for £1,000 would be like jumping into a snakepit.

This woman has a HUGE sense of entitlement.

Even if you made the cake for 40 quid, she would find something to complain about - and probably use this to only pay you for half the ingredients.

If you try to charge her an economic price, she will be a NIGHTMARE from start to finish. Unless you get your money up front you will not get paid, and I'll bet she will badmouth you everywhere anyway.

I suspect that no matter what you do, your parents friendship with her will have a cloud over it (whether you don't do it, or whether you don't do it to her "unknown-but-ridiculously-high-specifications"). She will leave her wishes nebulous so that whatever you do she can say it wasn't what she wanted, OR make them SO specific that the slightest deviation will be a cause for contention. ("I wanted lilac-coloured roses on it - these are lavender-coloured.")

Step away now. Back up carefully and then run like hell!

Op they are pisstakers, I would not do it for them. As they will have to pay fir it, they will be problem customers, and will find fault with it. Your parents are wrong to offer your services. I woukd tell the bride tgat you are not a professional cake maker, that it is beyond your capabilities, and in such little timeframe.

OP, do you actually want the job? It seems a load of trouble.

The wedding is a week before Christmas - that's a lot of work to be doing unpaid when you presumably have other things to be doing for Christmas?

Just say now you've realized what's required you're not able to make the commitment, and wish them luck in finding someone else who can meet their needs. It must be a big wedding if they want that much cake, I wonder if there's a story as to why they've left it till only a month before it to sort the cake out.

She works in the business - she knows what ingredients cost and she knows how long things take to do, so by refusing to pay for your time/labour she knows she's being beyond cheeky. I wonder why, as someone in the trade, she doesn't have professional contacts to use at mates rates rather than a friend of a friend scenario - maybe everyone else knows what she's like.

Also, don't let your parents volunteer you for things like this again - you should be the one choosing to whom you offer mates rates or free services, not them.

I absolutely love the suggestion of offering $5.75 to cover the cost of the meal she gave you!