Trump has won 😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭

[jdoe8]

WTF have I woken up to? Everyone is calling it for trump 😭😭😭😭😭

I'm still have trouble sleeping after brexit and now this 😭😭😭😭

FTSE due to open 4% lower on pre trading, well done.

"Brexit - normal people rebelled against the unified view from the traditional parties, parties who had lied to them over and over."

The people who swung the vote in Brexit were people who had never engaged with the political debate prior to this, which is why the result was so difficult to predict.

They are the people who have no idea what ACTUAL promises politicians make because they don't read policy documents, or coherent analysis of current issues. They couldn't tell you what actual promises politicians make because they're not interested in listening to political debate. Many were people who never gave a shit about democracy until they believed that taking part in a vote would allow them to kick foreigners out of the UK and have a better chance for jobs and housing. Where were those voters in general elections, demanding MP's address the lack of social housing? Where were the voices raised in protest about the increase in casual working and zero hours contracts?

The cries of 'politicians don't do anything for the poor' -well, no you numpty, because YOU DON'T VOTE!

uneducated = not so clever = answered the referendum question wrong

I know people who voted both leave and remain and we have Oxbridge on both sides down to manual laborers on both sides and all those in between. All arguments were usually valid apart from the " I don't want more expensive holidays"

I don't understand any discourse that has to include such an equation unless the background premise is to eventually take the vote away from people some people do not deem intelligent enough?

I may not agree with someone else's position but I usually understand it.
So its an anathema to me - to chuck the dunces hat on people who have different needs and feel differently to us.
Do such people think we all have to be the same?.

C4 News just now: "The White House, he will tread the same floors as Lincoln, Roosevelt and Obama" - that sounds so.... wrong. Donald Trump.

DH stays in Trump hotels when he works in the US, his company books them for him. He always brings the chocolates back for me. Strange times. I can't stop Obama's words "he's not fit for office" ringing in my ears.

Winter, are you still arguing that trump had a big appeal to Muslim voters?

been used as useful idiots

Oh yes - the useful idiots

No, Mr. President, you just can't do that.." going on behind the scenes when he takes office

Listening to the radio this am two things sprung to mind 1) Dr Strangeglove and 2) The heavy reminders from various constitutional experts that the founders knew a man like Trump would come along one day and therefore there are many checks to keep someone from doing too much damage.

I find the idea Americans are worried about how much damage their own President will do to their country extraordinary

I wonder if President SexPest will get quickly bored, actually. He only likes the contest and the conquest, not the being.

birdy

Did I mention the Muslim man from Bradford who came on radio this afternoon to say he was thrilled?
I dont understand why anyone would think Muslims are a group who think the same?

How? Why?

On Paxman's program about Trump/Clinton (bbc) one of Trumps biggest advocates was Muslim, highly respected in his community for doing much charity work, he said something like " I know Trump doesn't mean he wants to ban all Muslims and I have a family I want to keep safe, therefore I agree with trying to understand whats going on with ISIS fanatics". He appeared on stage with him at many rallies.

I am using these as illustrations that contrary to what some posters may think - the situation really isnt black and white.

Whatever stance you take on this - surely you can understand this?

You are talking about individuals as though they cancel out trends!

They don't.

Anyone with a smudge of interest in politics will be fascinated by who voted what- I can't understand this fear of analysis.

Also, dh left school at 16, voted remain- that clearly doesn't change the fact that overall those with lower educational attainment tended to vote leave whereas the higher the ed the more likely to vote remain.

Trends are fine when they are acknowledged as simply that.

It's the snideness that lets the sober a analysis down in my opinion.

I liked this comment posted on the Spectator website today:

Steve Jacks • 3 hours ago
Personally, I voted Trump in no small part as an up-yours to the Media. For 18 months they've thrown impartiality out the window, fed us an undiluted diet of propaganda where Trump was compared, unfavorably, to a certain German dictator. He was sexist, racist, xenophobic, chauvinistic, heck, just plain Evil. He was portrayed as the Devil himself, or maybe a bit worse. And anyone with the temerity to like him in any way was a deplorable, despicable human being, bigoted, nasty, thick, 'non-college educated' (aka bigoted, nasty and thick) - We were near-ordered not to vote for him. The (in)Tolerant Left love all diversity except diversity of opinion, and we were left in no doubt that there was only one acceptable view, one acceptable candidate, if you didn't want to be tarred and feathered. Relentlessly insulting half the country, while with a straight face insisting that He was the divisive candidate. Hey, I like an underdog.

I work in Manhattan and one of the partners - typical New York liberal, certain he's right, and wrong about everything - went down to Pennsylvania to help get the Democratic vote out. He took a bullet proof vest with him. Yes, he figured a trip into America where, horror of horrors, some actual American people lived, meant he needed a flak jacket. And then they wonder why they lost.

sportinguista Wed 09-Nov-16 15:01:18

^^ Yes interesting article but in many respects the same old re hash of the same points, the left have abandoned their base, basically and do not listen anymore. What school is churning out so many people who cannot think critically but believe their own view is 100% correct?

user1471439240 Wed 09-Nov-16 15:05:00

I agree, its going to be terrifying to see what happens in the EU next year.

blogs.spectator.co.uk/2016/11/sneering-response-trumps-victory-reveals-exactly-won/

Rumour has it that the USA is going to replace the Star Spangled Banner with the Benny Hill theme Yakity Sak

Waterwitch, the terms 'flyover states' and 'rednecks' have been around for a very long time! That's a rubbish article, lazy writing, predictable right wing reactionary tosh.

And anyone with the temerity to like him in any way was a deplorable, despicable human being, bigoted, nasty, thick, 'non-college educated' (aka bigoted, nasty and thick) - We were near-ordered not to vote for him. The (in)Tolerant Left love all diversity except diversity of opinion, and we were left in no doubt that there was only one acceptable view, one acceptable candidate, if you didn't want to be tarred and feathered

Wow.

We are all saying the same things.

You are talking about individuals as though they cancel out trends!

And you seem to be talking about various minorities as though they all share the same views and are not individuals and are one great big samey mass!

Some people from minorities voted for Brexit, and some voted for Trump. Its just not as simple as chucking people into boxes like this.

No we're not, we are saying sexist, misogynist, racist, disablist, homophobic, which is exactly what he is, on his own speeches, by his own admission.

And if you voted Trump, then you are those things above. Also, there were many Republicans who voted Clinton precisely for the reasons I have said.

It's bizarre that anyone interested in politics would not want to look at voting trends/patterns.

Really Can't understand it.

There was a massive fundamentalist Christian vote for trump - can we mention that or is it cancelled out because you know a Christian who voted Clinton?

I honestly don't understand why any muslim/latino people voted for him. Or women, come to that.

However, it's worth noting that a) Hilary won the popular vote, and b) poor people/minorities are less likely to vote. Hilary didn't get all the minorities/poor vote that she had hoped for. (from the Michael Moore article).

I honestly don't understand why any muslim/latino people voted for him. Or women, come to that

Because they are poor, dis enfranchised and desperate? They will vote for anyone they think will improve their lot in life? Obama, nice as he is has done nothing for them?

birdy are your posts addressing me? You sound very het up. I ask because I am unaware of declaring an interest in politics, that you seem to be challenging, so apologies if your not addressing me.
But if you are...you sound like one of the types of people I and others are referencing, ie - perhaps you think I am not educated enough in politics to comment?

But he IS demonstrably sexist, misogynist, racist, disablist, homophobic, he is all those things by HIS OWN ADMISSION. If you vote for that it means those things are OK in your book. They are not OK for me.
That's what is comes down to, you have chosen a man who hates women, minorities, gays, the weak and disabled. There's no dressing it up as anything else. I can't respect someone who does that as a decent human.

Winter nails it.....
Poverty knows neither skin colour, sex nor religous bent.
Rich people have used Cultural Marxism to silence debate, to further their financial gains.
This is what the enlightened have realised.
It may be a bitter pill to swallow, scant realisation does that to a person.

And you seem to be talking about various minorities as though they all share the same views and are not individuals and are one great big samey mass! [Wintersnigh] This is an appropriate criticism of many posts here imo.

People whose communities are fairly recent immigrants to the US can also be misogynistic, xenophobic, homophobic, etc. This can include hispanic culture, and muslim culture. Same goes for minority attitudes (i.e. African American and Asian American). Social conservatism and/or xenophobia, misogyny, homophobia, etc., can also run quite deep in the rest of society of course. It is quite wrong to lump everyone who on paper looks marginalised into the social liberal category.

There is a good deal of 'othering' of people going on in this thread and many others here on MN.

Ok you're not interested in politics .

The trump vote looks as though it came from white, middle class, middle age males - very very few minorities voted for him.

The poorest and 'disenfranchised' did not vote trump - they actually voted for Clinton.

These are clear patterns or trends.