To be sick of the perfect modern parent brigade!?

[Toofondofcake]

If I get a flaming here oh well but I hope I'm not the only one who feels this way.

I'm sick of hearing other women/parents lecturing others on parenting techniques in a properly pretentious and judgey way. It always seems to be something like "we don't discipline, putting your child in timeout is abuse". Or "my child Star only wears gender neutral clothing as I won't impose society's gender constructs on them" or "clothes don't matters my 8 year old can wear whatever she likes".

I respect other people parent in very different ways but I can't stand seeing people preaching parenting lectures at others. I just want to scream " your DAUGHTER isn't spirited She's a bully! And letting her wear her dance leotard to the park isn't progressive and changing society, it's October and it's freezing and inappropriate".

Sorry for ranting. This is my scream into a pillow place.

"crunchy" - what's the provenance of that descriptor then? I've heard (in Australia) of hippy types being called "crusty", which I fear may relate to their hygiene but really don't know - is it the same sort of thing?

I'm not one, btw. I might entertain some "crusty/crunchy" ideas, such as bf'ing til 2, co-sleeping etc. but when it comes to discipline and who's in charge, it's very clear that it is Me. (DH favours the whole disney dad approach which pisses me off massively! but he is improving a bit now the boys are bigger)

tanith you might be right the nastiness might be frustration and they become loony keyboard warriors and shouf others down. I also worry about parenting styles it is putting an awful lot of pressure on parent and child to perform and when they dont get the results they want it stresses them out.

Some of the nastiest comments I have ever seen have been on Gentle Parenting pages.

Completely agree Mrs D

I'll call them the "Sweetie Police", parents, but call them a more non pc title at home. But you know the parents that look at you stunned if you offer their child a sweet or an ice cream, like your offering them crystal meth. And announce things like, by the way our children don't eat in McDonald's, we'll, it's not real food, is it, like they are somehow superior to parents that bring their children there. Oh, and the real sting in the tale is, that their children seem to be an authority on adult topics, that really shouldn't be discussed when they ate within earshot. But this type of parenting allows a child to but in on an adult talking without any correction from said parents. All very odd. An eight year old talking to me like he's forty five. Yuck......

I often respond to posts on this kind of topic because I am aghast at what bringing up children has turned into.
A pp was correct when she said that 'parenting' was a modern invention - parents used to just bring up the kids in the best way they could.
I remember watching a TV programme about 'surrendered wives' and it strikes me that a lot of modern parenting should be renamed surrendered parenting, because it seems is if -bizarrely - life asyou knew it stops as soon as baby comes along.
I am not talking about parents not making reasonable adjustment s to accommodate the new arrival, but completely surrounding themselves to their baby.
It always amazes me how hard new mums make life for themselves - co-sleeping, baby-led bedtimes, routine frowned upon, feeding on demand, baby napping on mum ... I could go on and on.

Shit parenting is shit parenting. Has fuck all to do with what style you choose or what class you come from to do shit parenting in. The only thing in common with all these shit parents is that they fail to control their dc. The reasons are different,
The Religious parents who think their dc must be good because they are religious.
The excuses parents of 'Spirited girls' think girls can do no wrong.
The excuses parents of rough and tumble boys think all boys need to toughen up.
The lazy parents who insist that is how all DC behave.
The super strict parents who install utter fear into their dc who then rebel the second their parent turns their back.
I could go on and on, but they all seem to get this vacant stare as their dc misbehave, cunts.
We have a kind of mutual respect thing in our house, so the dc get a say in many things and shock horror have opinions. But they are also aware we have final say, and often understand why their idea was right or wrong. They know no means no and to consider the consequences of their actions. My DC 5&7 have both just had lovely so proud reports/awards from school both focusing on their very good behaviour and polite nature. Sadly this often leaves them victims to the dc of shit parents. My dc know lots of swear words, they also know they don't repeat them and if the are caught swearing in school they will be in just as much trouble from us.

cathf Sat 29-Oct-16 16:48:08

"A pp was correct when she said that 'parenting' was a modern invention - parents used to just bring up the kids in the best way they could."

As pp have pointed out, parenting books have been around for a long time. Locke wrote one in the 17th century, Rousseau wrote one in the 18th. Dr Spock's book on Baby and Child Care, which went into its 9th edition in 2012, was first published in 1946. As the Anne of Green Gables books show, the ideas of "gentle parenting" were certainly to be found in parenting books in the first half of the 20th century.

The main difference with today is that far more people read messages on Facebook than ever read books and magazines in the earlier centuries.

As for co-sleeping and baby napping on mother, these have just been the normal way of bringing up babies since times immemorial in most cultures. The ideal of baby feeding at specified hours is almost certainly a result of the industrial revolution, the idea of baby sleeping in a separate room the result of increased affluence from the mid-20th century onwards.

And btw not all mothers find co-sleeping and baby-led weaning make for more work: it depends on both baby and mother. Some find they get a better quality of sleep when sharing a bed with a young child: I certainly did. If your back muscles are in reasonable nick, carrying a baby around in a sling (as mothers have done since time immemorial) is probably far less effort than putting baby down and picking her up.

Definitely wasn't using the word brigade in a daily mail kind of way it is just the term that pops into my head when I'm around these particular women (and some men).

I do think that it's often the crunchier types who behave this way but by no means is that always the case.

In the same group the leader (male) whilst singing wheels on the bus with parents and kids stopped everyone at the mummies part and said very seriously "wait hang on what progressive thing can the mothers be doing on the bus?" Many of the parents considered this seriously for a moment and came up empty of suggestions which was when I tentatively said "erm to be honest, I do chat on the bus. So can't the mummies still chatter on the bus?" Met with a huge mutter of approval by most of the mums and silence by the others who identify as "progressive/modern". I must have seemed a Neanderthal.

And Cory, I totally agree on those points.

I strongly disagree with our anecdotal evidence that it is crunchy types, I really do think shit parenting is is quite even between styles and classes. If I really wanted too pick on a type it would be the 'Being religious automatically makes us superior group', and that covers all religions and denominations.

Sorry but baby napping on my lap is my excuse to sit down, have a break and MN! It most definitely is not making my life harder - I can justify doing feck all for a bit and make DH pick up the slack for a bit

Likewise bedsharing and slings are both things I do because they make our lives easier. It also makes my children happy, which I kind of like . I never set out to bedshare - in fact the midwife ordered suggested it after a week of 45 minutes only sleeps from dd1 left me hallucinating. She slept much better if I wasn't trying to put her in the bloody moses basket or cot all the time. Likewise slings.

And I'm justifying my choices in the face of disapproval yet again.

I'm a little bit cynical about the whole "performance parenting" thing. This is my theory - and I haven't tested it out on anyone in RL! I think one of the big things about having children is that it is a huge social leveller. Everyone - rich or poor, educated or not - goes through much the same thing in terms of coming to terms with looking after a child. We're all in the same boat. Personally, I love the fact that being with small children means you can have an almost instant rapport with a huge range of people. I'm someone who gets teased for being "a bit posh", despite my denials - so I can only assume that is what people I meet randomly might think. But the "kids eh?"/"When's it wine o'clock?"/"Only three hours to bedtime!" type of comment is always a huge icebreaker. Now - I wonder if some people feel the reverse of this. They want to feel special and important and don't like the fact that having children makes them the same as most other people. They like to be important and special because they are better educated (or whatever) and they want other people to recognise this. So - they preach on about their wonderful parenting methods because they think it makes them look important and "better" than your average mum or dad on the street. Because they think they are and they want others to recognise that rather than seeing them as "one of them".

That's my cod psychology, anyway, for what it's worth....!

Natalia, I could go along with that train of thought. Also I think social media has a lot to do with it - the desire to Project a image of the perfect family, when reality is very different. People seem to have such a need for validation now. I do wonder how these people will fill their time once the babies are gone.

"People seem to have such a need for validation now."

They do. Some of them meet it by endless talking about how clueless the younger generation of parents are.

"I do wonder how these people will fill their time once the babies are gone." See above.

Cory, my kids are grown up. I don't think the younger generation are clueless in general, the same as everyone else.

I have no problem with people being different in their approach to bringing up their kids. I do have a problem with people that take no responsibility for their children's behaviour and expects the world to indulge them like they do.

I still have kids Cory. I'm not sure I'm the older generation just yet ...

We've always favoured the Seventies style parenting that we experienced growing up.

A sort of vaguely benign neglect, but when we do put our foot down, our DDs damned well behave. We give them some leeway over things, but we do not tolerate any openly disrespectful behaviour. Ever.

We like our DDs to be happy, but have never been in the habit of trying to curry favour with them. And, if sometimes we have to step in and say/do something our DDs don't like ...well, that's life [shrugs]

We love them both very much, and they know it. But we have never been blind to their faults, and we have never treated them like the whole universe revolves around them [shudder]

I do see where you're coming from, OP.
What I struggle with is the 'labelling' of every aspect of raising your dc.
The dream feed, self soothing, blw etc.
FFS
It's all stuff which parents have done since the beginning of time, but because now it's been given a label by some self confessed expert twat it's assumed that this generation are the ones who've invented this stuff.
Dream feed is lifting your baby and giving them a feed at about11pm (and has been since the beginning of time).
Self soothing is your baby going to sleep on its own,
Blw is the one that makes me laugh the most. That's lunchtime then. Seriously, our dc who had a mixture of spoon feeding and finger foods - they genuinely haven't lost out. It's just another crazy label - and seriously, there are books written about this shit?
And people pay to read them?

I couldn't give a shit about other's parenting, I know I'm right for my child.

i dunno. I quite admire people who have ideas about how they are gonna do parenting and give it a go. At least they care and are trying their best. There are people out there who couldnt give two hoots about their own children. That upsets me more. Whenever i see a parent being a bit OTT about their attachment parenting style or whatever, i just tell myself that it is actually an expression of love and thats got to be positive in some way. Even if its not what i would do.

So true, Punk.

All we had was some dubious Miriam Stoppard books. And I took those with a large pinch of salt because what did she know about my kids?

I wasn't until I came on here that I knew there was such s thing as 'parenting'. Our DCs just fitted in as new members of the family. Which in our case meant co/sleeping, no routine (who has time for that) BF until they weaned themselves (easier), eating the same food as the rest of us and being perfectly happy to be looked after by whoever was around. As I was generally working 10 to 12 hour days, I would never have seen by DCs if they had had a 'bedtime'. Different families do things differently, because that works for them. It really doesn't matter. I'm sure I might have had a different approach had I been a SAHP.

Does it affect you ? no ! JUST smile and ignore . YABU

I remember my mums parenting book of choice was Dr Spock and because her own mother and indeed father were useless the elderly neighbours (a good smack doesn't do them any harm!) or doctor (elderly female types) really the advice in 70s was minimal to say the best!