To not want my PIL to pay for my DC private school fees?

[swimmerforlife]

For context, I get along with DH's parents perfectly well, they are absolutely loaded though and DH (along with his siblings) were privately educated from reception onwards. I grew up on the breadline and was state educated for all my schooling.

It was always the plan for our dc to be state educated as we couldn't afford private fees, however the subject of schools came up in conversation over the weekend and PIL offered to pay for both DS1 and DS2 fees if we decided to go private (DS1 will be 4 early next year).

DH now desperately wants DS1 to be privately educated and is willing to accept PIL offer as he thrived in private school, whilst I am not totally against private schooling, I feel my DSs will learn and be educated just as well at state. After all I am University educated...

Also, I don't want to feel I / DH or the DSs 'owe' PIL anything because the paid for our DSs private education, I really don't want to have that hanging over our heads for the next 20+ years.

Besides, DH had no qualms with our DCs being state educated before PILs offer. Now DH has gone and changed his mind after everything was practically agreed.

AIBU?

Could you provide supporting evidence for the statement that many of our teachers feel more like policemen than teachers on a daily basis?

Umm what sort of evidence do you need?

Shall I go back twenty years and try and track down all the teachers I have ever spoken too who have mentioned this? Names, DOB? Address?

If you opened your eyes and mind you would understand and realise this. I don't know how someone can be on so many threads, bear witness to so many testimonials on this matter and still persist that reality is different!

Its everywhere. Maybe you dont know any teachers?

I have teachers in my own family, I live surrounded by loads of teachers and ex teachers, I have friends who have become teachers, friends who have left teaching!

Does every one of them sit down and bemoan a life in the class room?
No, but many do - complain - at times, of crowd control - violence and disruption YES.
Our school is great it really is but even last year DD class had huge issues with disruptive children. Massive issues leading to moving dc into the other group and more which I cant mention. It went on all year. The teacher massively struggled!

I would check out your local schools before you say no to them. sadly my son is now homeschooled, we cant afford private education and our local school are awful. :-( I would have never considered private education until I started looking at our local schools. However in some areas state funded schools are fab and if that is the case in your area then thats fab. I dont think yabu because I wouldnt be comfortable either tbh, altho now my sons school placement has broken down I'd give anything to be able to send him to our local small/ forest type school. good luck on whatever you decide, I hope your dh and pils are all open to talking about the options and supportive of your decisions.

We were worried my children would feel like the 'poor' children in a private school

Our PIL pay our DCs fees, and I was very worried about our children feeling like this. We aren't 'poor' but nor are we wealthy. It hasn't been an issue in the slightest, in fact the majority of people there are like us - have grandparents paying, on bursaries, or are making significant lifestyle sacrifices to afford the fees. There are expensive trips, but not everyone goes on them, and our local state school has just as costly ones.

It wouldn't be the case if they were going to one of the super-expensive elite private schools I'm sure, but don't discount all private schools because you feel like all the other kids will have better houses, more material goods etc, because it's often not the case.

Why would they need to go to a private primary school? Whatever you think about private schools surely they can go to a state primary school, unless the ones around you are really really terrible (unlikely?). My own thoughts are that early schooling is yes reading and writing but also socialising with children from all backgrounds, cultural, religious, different nationalities etc - but also that they go to a local school so their friends live nearby they all go together etc. Secondary school is a different issue. But in the first instance why not just defer the issue and if they want to offer money, accept it as a university fees fund. You can fill in the middle bit in 10 years time!

YABU
As a maths teacher at a private school (but was educated at state schools) I see both sides. Lots of our pupils are funded by aunts, uncles, grandparents, friends of the family etc. The only issues arise when there is already a family conflict - only then does the 'but we pay the fees so we have a say in how you raise your child' becomes an issue. For the vast majority the option of smaller class sizes, more sport, music and other extra-curricular opportunities at private school is the deciding factor. There are good (and bad) teachers in every school. I would suggest visiting all options (with DS1 & DS2) and find the school that is the best fit for them - regardless of whether it is state or private. If it feels right to you and your little ones, then it will be the right choice.

As you've described it, your PIL offering to pay, if you decide to go Private is a very generous offer. You've not mentioned any strings, so why assume there will be?

Unless you have wonderful state schools locally and little competition for places, why not look into it further? It can't hurt, and may be a very pleasant surprise for you. Ultimately, it isn't about you, but what's best for your DCs. Don't pass it up without some serious consideration first.

" merrymouse Thu 06-Oct-16 08:46:29
Academically selective schools for 4 year olds are basically screening out children who it will be difficult to teach. The kind of child they want would also do well in most reception classes. (As I suspect the OP knows having been to a state school, and, given age of child, probably more recently than some posters)."

Yes, so why would a parent who can ensure their child is not in a class with less bright and disruptive over children turn down the chance to improve their bright 4 year old's education? It's like saying we can afford good steak but we will feed it on junk food all day surely?

Me2017- part of education is understanding and empathizing with other people. The emotional health of our society depends on this. The segregation you favour ensures the opposite. Our children will have to work with and for all sorts of people. They may have to make decisions affecting all sorts of people- if they have only experienced people like themselves, how will they be able to do this.
We need to equip our children emotionally and socially, not just academically.

What does your DH think? As he was privately educated, he may have good experience to know what he would prefer after you both have visited both state and private.

In our experience, my DH was privately educated until senior school and I was state schooled until secondary whereby I was sent to a convent for just girls. Our experience led us to explore the opportunities at a range of schools and we could see the benefits of both. One of my biggest concerns was to make sure the friends DD makes at school will very likely continue to the next school as I found it very hard to get into friendships at age 11 when the girls were so close knit.

We made our choice of school for DD after many school visits and we found our first choice school had the happiest kids, most confident, creative and we wanted to go there ourselves. The teachers are amazingly inspirational and it wasn't about the grades but the fact that the kids can think for themselves and solve problems. The atmosphere was educational and challenging and they were inspired to do great things.

I do think the issue of who is paying for a private school and then ultimately the control issues that come along with it, can be hard though as I would not like my ILs to provide in such a way as we do not share the same beliefs and values. However, if you do get on better with them and would be happy for their input, then you could be going on the most exciting adventure to find the best school ever for your kids. One that they would love to go to every day, state or private, but you explored all the opportunities with their best interests at heart.

part of education is understanding and empathizing with other people

Surely that's not the schools job above and beyond the parents? I think true empathy is innate anyway.

Having said that we kept my dd3 in state education for lots of reasons but one was that she is so accepting and sympathetic with all kinds of kids, naughty, troubled, sad, struggling. There's certainly not such a wide variety of people at the private school my other dds went to. Quite stifling really.

It is not a given that a state school is more diverse than a private school. IME many state schools have extraordinarily narrow cultural frames of reference.

"It's like saying we can afford good steak but we will feed it on junk food all day surely?"

More unthinking condemnation of state education.......

Passing money along is quite a good way of avoiding it all disappearing in inheritance tax! If you decide not to accept why not ask PIL to set up a trust to fund uni education? You have no choice but to pay for that and who knows what it will cost when your children are at that stage?

I can afford steak, but I still keep eating my quorn burgers. Those pesky principles again.

I could afford to buy overpriced ready meals in Waitrose. But I use Lidl and end up with good nutritious food.

I trained and worked as a maths & science teacher and then worked as a supply teacher in primary and comprehensive and secondary schools and infant schools and special needs schools in nine different education authorities during my teaching work days.

My mum worked in one comprehensive for 35 years. I have relatives who are currently teachers.

In my case my son was born with a cleft palate and a genetic disorder meaning he had speech problems and was small and warned off playing contact sports by the medics. He was also musically and intellectually gifted and until he was 7 was undiagnosed ADD and later we found out he was also on the autistic spectrum (what is known by some people as Asperger's) to begin with he tried to get on in the state system of education but no matter how hard we all tried to co-operate with the various schools, it always boiled down to the same thing - his complex personality combining immature social skills, adult level maths & english skills, prodigy level computer and music skills was not something that could be nurtured in a state system that had limited resources.

He was bullied by teachers and pupils alike and it was harming him. He was left with permanent emotional damage.
I pulled him out of school after trying for far too long to make it work. We then looked into private schooling and at the time my husband was earning enough to cover the fees.
All fee paying schools are not equal. You are just as likely to find a crap private school as you are are a state one - the only difference is you have to pay through the nose and the accents of the bullies and rubbish teachers are posher.
Luckily we found an amazing prep school - it wasn't even the most expensive - but it was excellent and had a brilliant reputation and when we went along to the interview and talked to the staff they recognised my son had ADHD and reccommended a leading specialist in the field.
He went to see the specialist - was diagnosed and given ritalin and that transformed his day to day life. He started at the prep school and for a couple of years things were as good as could be hoped for.
Then we had a downturn in finances and had to pull him from the school and I homeschooled him instead.
We had a couple of goes at getting him back into state school because he seemed so much more able to cope after the good experience at prep school but it didn't work out and we remained with home schooling.
If we'd had an option to keep him in the school where he was happy and progressing I would have grabbed it with both hands.
He's now in his twenties and despite being incredibly bright has no GCSEs nor A levels. We managed to get him through some basic quals so he had enough points to get into university but again it didn't work out due to his Asperger's not having been spotted. I have no doubt had he remained in the private system it would have been spotted earlier and he would have been properly supported.
I don't understand why people are so against private education and yet are perfectly happy to pay for nursery places.
I myself went to private school from the age of 2 - 5 and that was because I was described as 'precocious' and I needed to be learning. Turns out I am also on the AS but the penny didn't drop for me until I was in my fifties. My siblings went to private school between the ages of ten and twelve because they were falling behind and benefitted from a couple of years with smaller classes and then went back into the state system having gained new friends.
I think it is best to do whatever is right for the child. If you have good state schools and your kids are strong, have no sign of any learning difficulties or giftedness and fit in easily with other kids then you will probably be fine sticking with state education. But if there is any hint they may be slightly 'quirky' or have any special needs then a good private school might be best. You know them better than anyone.

It's more like saying I could afford Harrods food Hall, but why bother when someone is giving you Waitrose food for nothing.

"and your kids are strong, have no sign of any learning difficulties or giftedness and fit in easily with other kids then you will probably be fine sticking with state education. But if there is any hint they may be slightly 'quirky' or have any special needs then a good private school might be best"

So basically, stare school's fine for the cannon fodder............

In my experience (limited, like everyone else's) state schools are better at supporting children with additional learning needs - who may not even be welcome in a school who relies on high results to generate fees.

Private school education isn't necessarily the best education, it really depends on the child. I got a D N U at A level private education, but my sister and brother both got 3 A s at A Level at the local comprehensive. They have gone on to get better jobs than I etc. Your choice obviously but private education comes with other things too, expensive school trips and out of school activities for some and also the need/perception for the child to keep up with their peers as well. Can you afford the extras if the PILs only pay the basic main fees? Lots to think about.

This is an incredibly generous gesture, accept it wi

Flipping phone.
... With appreciation, the chances of your child thriving are greatly increased now. Don't look your gift horse in the mouth.

haven't read the thread too long. Could you ask them to set up a uni fund instead? Send them to state schools but have the money available to pay for further education, I dread to think how much that will be by the time they are 18.

Flowery

'I also find it difficult to believe that anyone would genuinely under absolutely no circumstances send their children to a private school'.

Are you joking? There are many of us who wouldn't under any circumstances do this because we don't agree with it.

And there are also may who would, but can't afford it.

As someone else has just said if 25% of the parents in the catchment area of her local state school sent their kids there instead of private, there would be such an improvement.

I'm also sick of posters saying well we live in an unfair, unequal society that isn't going to change any time soon so we just have to do what's right for our DC's education. No, and nothing will EVER change with attitudes like that.

"Are you joking? There are many of us who wouldn't under any circumstances do this because we don't agree with it."

Of course I'm not joking, why would I be joking? Did you read the rest of my post?

In those circumstances I described, I think many people who disagree with private schooling would use it anyway rather than put their child through that. You might not, but I think many would.