To be *livid* at this? Attempted murder of man working to make women's sport fairer

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So not only did Jeska use their unfair advantage to win medals meant for female athletes, but Jeska then tries to murder the man attemting to restore fairness to women's fell running:

www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/transgender-womens-fell-running-champ-8891893

And yet, the BBC decide it's not relevant to the story that Jeska was born male:

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-birmingham-37439875

No, she is a woman, her gender is female. If the issue is that it is unfair for her to compete against other women because of advantages conferred by her biological status then that is a separate issue to her gender.

I would suggest that the hard of thinking around here is not me. You seem to struggle with some basic concepts.

I'm sorry if you don't agree but saying it's unfair that women compete against women is nonsense.. No, people here are very clearly saying that it's unfair that tranwomen compete against women. Those with the benefit of a male physiology, as I have detailed above in terms of VO2 max, male running economy, male lactate threshold, male pelvis etc are at an advantage when competing. Unless you could please specifically explain to me how transition lowers a typical male VO2 max to a typical female one?

"Transwomen are women" is a meaningless, thought terminating cliche. When we're talking physiology and sports, you;ll have to do a lot better than that to convince me. Pelvic anatomy and its impact on stride efficiency isn't subject to someone's thoughts on their gender identity.

unescorted - no. don't twist my words that way. I did NOT say Lauren was in it for the money and you know I didn't.

annalee why does sport have a men's and women's categories?

Because biologically they are different. Men have the advantage so it's not a fair playing field.

Those advantages don't disappear because a man wants to be a woman. It doesn't disappear when taking hormone treatments.

A study shows that transwoman commit crime at the same rate as men. Not as women.

These crimes should not be recorded as crimes committed by women. Yet again, it's about putting women down and distorting the truth about violence committed by men. That is not what society needs.

'If the issue is that it is unfair for her to compete against other women because of advantages conferred by her biological status then that is a separate issue to her gender.'

Quite so. The entire reason women have separate sporting events to men is because of their biology, their sex. It's to do with women's bodies, nothing else. Their 'gender' (whatever that may mean to you) is utterly irrelevant.

I always thought there was a men and not men category so those who feel feminine can run slower so as not to make their mascara run?

We segregate on sex, not gender or an intangible feeling. Otherwise what is the point in segregating at all. So when I say female or woman...I am referring to sex. And as sex is the only factual way of describing male or female biology, then I don't need a qualifier for this.

AnnaLee transwoman are men, biologically.
I'd be curious as to your definition of what a woman is, other than biologically? I mean a proper definition, not just to do with amorphous feelings. And one that doesn't just list a bunch of gender stereotypes.

annalee gender is an artificial social construct. Biology is real, innate, unchangeable.

Sports are not split into masculine and feminine categories, which would be with regard to gender. They are split into male and female, biologically.

Please can you define 'woman' without using gender? Many women do not feel feminine.

We segregate on sex.

Gender means fuck all when it comes to physical differences.

She may be a trans woman but she's not a FEMALE. Never will be.
So should not be competing against females.

Its bloody nonsensical to just keep repaeating trans women are female because its not true and is helping no one!

Transwomen are women. Freedom is slavery. Oceania had always been at war with Eastasia.

I really, really object to the autism being mentioned and not the fact she's a TW.

The implication that the attack was motivated by ASD and not (or also) the fact that they are trans is propaganda. And the fact that the probable motive is being glossed over is horrendous.

Where is the media's responsibility to report honestly here? We really are living in an Orwellian world.

NotYoda

The fact of her being born male has not been left out of the coverage because it's irrelevant, it's been left out because it's uncomfortably relevant

I think this hits the nail on the head for me. I think I saw the headline on Yahoo (not entirely sure of that) and no mention of the sportswoman being transgender. I thought, that sounds odd such a violent crime from a woman with the sporting element too - I'm shocked to find the details of the story on this thread.

I'm interested in the responses of some of the other fell runners. The fact that it doesn't seem to bother some of them that they are racing against someone with obvious physical advantages indicates to me that it's a sport that is mainly done for fun and the winning doesn't matter. It's more of a recreational, getting outdoors thing - that's great. But unfortunately the competitive element must have meant a lot to Jeska and the fact that someone was investigating the issue led to her attempting to murder them. Horrific.

And honestly, it's getting so tiresome when women discussing this issue on a predominantly female site are shouted down all the time for daring to talk about it and analyse what the hell is going on and the impact it's potentially going to have on their lives!

Again if it's this Anna posting on the thread, probably no point in engaging.

www.independent.co.uk/student/news/anna-lee-student-at-lancaster-making-history-in-bid-to-become-first-openly-trans-candidate-to-run-a6891231.html

Well we only know that one other fell runner doesn't object. Who knows what the rest of them feel? They presumably didn't know that Jeska was born male.

It's OK, Anna doesn't seem to have any cogent points to add, other than the usual "transwomen are women" (without a definition of woman) and "you're all hateful" (I paraphrase)

I competed in a world championship of a sport and whilst not in my category, in one of the other categories there was a transwoman who competed against biological women.

The Transwoman was about 25years older then the rest of the women competing and the transwoman still won despite the age gap, the transwoman was so much bigger biologically which was a huge advantage in the sport and there wasn't any amount of training that would make up for it and God knows the other women were training 6 days a week, it just wasn't fair because the biological advantage was too great and many of the women racing were unhappy.

The transwoman is lovely, we've stayed in touch and went out for dinner as a group of athletes at the competition, As much as we are friends I wouldn't be happy competing against her because of her biological advantages we've chatted about this and she understands my view point but she feels couldn't/shouldn't race against men because she would be at a disadvantage due to her hormone treatment it's a very difficult situation but maybe to fully level the playing field there should be trans entries as well as male/female?

Women are socialised not to "care" about women - or not to mention it - it looks too pushy. But lots of women DO care about winning, and will be put off competing if there's little point.

God what an awful story.

I'm happy with transwomen who have gone through a full transition process/legally changed sex to be treated as women in most situations, but sport (plus situations involving vulnerable women such as refuges) should very much be an exception.

is there a journalism body we could complain about mis-reporting?

Her chosen gender - female. Her biology - male.

Not that it matters. According to the government response to the transgender enquiry women will have to compete against biological men who identify as women in sport. So the violent death of this man will be looked at as a killing in the quest for transgender rights. Incredibly sad. A man questing for fairness for women being attacked and killed.

The crime reporting is misleading and completely skews women's crime statistics.

care about women LOL - winning