Burkinis

[TaterTots]

We've all seen the fuss about them, but last night I saw my first one in 'real life', which got me thinking. Also today two of my friends were arguing about them on FB - one against any ban, the other claiming they are a symbol of oppression.

My view has pretty much always been that it's just a different type of swimsuit; no different to some women wearing bikinis and others wearing one-pieces. I'd always thought the bans in places like Cannes were all about the culture/assimilation issue; it hadn't really crossed my mind that the 'modesty' might be being forced on women.

What do you think?

BarbarianMum So if someone who wears it says it's their choice you don't believe them? Why not? Quite surprised too that your friends never told you they are Afghan not Afghani.

Thanks Strawberry I'm sitting here agreeing with all your comments : )

I find it almost impossible to believe that there are women in the UK going around in the Afghan style burqa (the light blue one with mesh eye covering). I have never seen this and I have been in plenty muslim areas. I can only assume it was a long blue somali style jelbab with a niqab that was light blue coloured. There are lots of different ways to cover the hair and your eyes and various names for the garments depending on where you come from but I still cant believe that there are women out there wearing the afghan one in England.

Seeing straight through me i haven't said anything about saving Muslim women

So you know one women who is a CEO and wears a niqab oh ok and all the other roles/positions/jobs that are closed off in our society to them

I don't know of a CEO but thank you for proving my point. I could give any example of a Muslim woman who is happy and satisfied with their role whether that be at work or at home and you will always come back with something negative to say because you have an issue with a woman who chooses to dress a certain way.

I read that wrong

I don't see it as progressive for women no

And like I have said before where is the influence coming from

I would really like to know why what we wear is so interesting to many non Muslims, can anyone enlighten me? Genuine question, I don't have any close non Muslim friends to ask.

Mermaid, I can only speak for myself on this: it's because it's so different from I wear. That's what got my initial notice when I first saw two women wearing burkas in Istanbul, back in 1987. I didn't know what the heck they had on as it was so foreign. (Yes, I know I was the foreigner in this situation. I had read a little about Turkey and its culture before I went there and was informed that headscarves had been banned. I had read nothing about any other covering so it was quite a shock.)

It's only in the last ten years that I have seen any burkas in my city,. (not in the UK). I do see many hijabs (and variations - I know there are many different types of head-cover), at my place of work. It's not yet "normal" where I live.

Thanks Andylion that makes sense to me.

hotdiggedy Me too, even among my Afghan relatives. I normally wear french jelbab and have had it called a burka.

I just had to google 'french jilbab' as I have never heard of it! Any idea why its called french jilbab? Yes, its like the somali style ones or maybe a little like the long one piece things some Iranians wear but still nothing like a burqa!

The style is originally Algerian, they're very popular in France and there's quite a few french jelbab brands now, I guess that's how they ended up with the name, pretty similar to Gulf and Somali overheads like you said. Definitely not a burka!

Bit of peace and love please
Thank you

www.express.co.uk/news/world/703240/Shocking-moment-armed-police-confront-French-woman-wearing-burkini-on-a-beach these images are horrible - this is not just fining but armed officers forcing a woman to strip off her tunic top. It may be legal now but legalising public punishment and humiliation of an woman who was hurting no one and everyone is happy to watch it take place and hound her off the beach. Disturbing and depressing :(

That poor woman

Even if they just wanted to fine her and she chose to remove her clothes, it's a shocking image that will backfire.

How long till the general public decide to start enforcing this kind of thing themselves?

www.express.co.uk/news/world/703240/Shocking-moment-armed-police-confront-French-woman-wearing-burkini-on-a-beach these images are horrible - this is not just fining but armed officers forcing a woman to strip off her tunic top. It may be legal now but legalising public punishment and humiliation of an woman who was hurting no one and everyone is happy to watch it take place and hound her off the beach. Disturbing and depressing sad

I looked at these images earlier with my daughters and we all talked about how astonishing and profound is the sense of entitlement men feel to dictate what women wear and how they appear. French women should be up in arms about this - muslim and non muslim.

That was most likely a French citizen sitting on a beach, wearing a perfectly suitable outfit (very similar to what my extremely fair-skinned husband wear sailing) and a man in uniform ordered her to remove her clothing. It beggars belief that this is being allowed.

The women behind her look uncomfortable with the scene to me - as well they should.

It reminded me of a scene from Saudi or Iran with the male morality police hounding women. It reminded dh of photos of police targetting jews in Germany before the war.

It is also so fucking stupid. If I had instituted that insane law and decided in a burst of further insanity to enforce it, I would have made damned sure only female police offices were on the beaches.

Of course maybe they tried that and the female police offices refused. one has to hope.

Well done France Those images are the quickest way to disenfranchise MORE young Muslims. ISIS will be rubbing their murdering hands with glee.

Well done France . Quickest way ever to disenfranchise MORE young Muslims. ISIS will be rubbing their murdering hands with glee

Absolutely disgusting

4 armed police MEN forcing women to remove their clothes

Yes, definitely boycotting France

Shame on France. Shame.

God, that is shocking.

I may not agree with the inherent inequality that sees Muslim women covering up in a way men aren't expected to.

But to dictate what women wear, and to force them to remove clothing, is completely unacceptable.

What the actual fuck?

Thanks warmastoast this is the first time I have seen that article. How awful for that French woman. Shame on France. It is nothing less than authorised public bullying.

I still do not understand WHY the French are persecuting Muslim women (apart from them being an easily identifiable target). Is it a backlash for the Bastille Day truck massacre? Charlie Hebdo?

I know the French ARE banning full coverings on the beach, but WHY, and also are any non-Muslim covered up women (those in wet suits or chosing to wear trousers and t-shirts rather than bikinis/swim costumes)being similarly targeted.

There is always a reason for any behaviours and I am trying to understand what payoff the French authorities are looking for in their actions, other than scaring women and children.