To push DD to apply to Cambridge?

[AllieinWonderland]

So I'm relatively new to posting on mumsnet, but have been a long time lurker, so if I mix up the lingo a bit then apologies!
DSS1 got 9As 3As at GCSE, 4 high As at AS level, and is on track to exceed his AAA offer for Oxford.
Oldest DD achieved 13A*s 2As and a B at GCSE (the B in music - she had a panic attack in the exam and it was on a tape so she was unable to get the time back) and is looking on track for 5 high As at AS level in French, English lit, history, physics, and art. She is seemingly good at almost everything (triathlons at county level and has previously played and trained younger children in cricket and basketball, plays the cello, the xylophone, and the clarinet, won a local photography competition, always gets lead roles in an amateur dramatics group and solos in choir) yet has always struggled severely with self esteem, and focuses on the things she is bad at: sees her B in music as the end of her chance of going to good universities, can't bake or cook to save her life despite much encouragement and teaching, is awful at tidying (she is happy to do it but ends up gradually making more of a mess and gets flustered. Again, I've tried forms of 'teaching' and noting has worked). These latter two issues have led her to thinking she needs to stay at home for university and she is driving me mad by saying she'll go to the local university, which is really not a very good one at all, and the only others she'll consider are those with offers of "BBC" or below.
She has finally settled on studying English literature, and I took charge and booked her on open days at Warwick, Edinburgh, Cambridge, and Durham, and her school took the 'Oxbridge' candidates to Oxford for a trip. She hated Durham, didn't like Edinburgh, thought Oxford and Warwick were okay, but loved Cambridge.
In spite of this she is refusing to consider applying, says it's a waste of an application.
I don't want to push her, but I do want her to apply because she clearly loved it and is more than capable. All of her teachers have been saying it since before I can remember, and she reads almost constantly.
Aibu to try and change her mind?
Sorry for the lack of coherence here, my mind a bit of a mess!

If she does a gap year I would imagine a few holidays and working in your local Waitrose would be perfect. Going on adventurous trips to somewhere like Napal sounds a bit much.

It sounds like she needs some space and some time.

I still can't believe that anyone thought it was a good idea for her to do 16 GCSE's - you say the school have been supportive but it doesn't sound like it to me. The school sounds pushy.

I don't believe she wants to do Peace studies at Bradford - she sounds like she is winding you up.

I would like her to take a gap year - there is nothing I would like more!

It's not about what you would like though, is it? It's about what's right for her.

The school shouldn't have facilitated it. They're aware of the panic attacks. They shod have said no. Likely the extra points on the league table swayed them.

And I'm afraid I do believe it's the relationship she needs.

Her panic attacks are not 'ordinary' panic attacks - on top of the hyperventilating there is screaming and throwing things and often fainting, and a loss of balance. I did, for a while, try to take a step back in our relationship, and this is when the panic attacks became this way.

Perhaps I am scared to let her go, but since facilitating her attachment and allowing us to be as involved as we are she has improved - she has probably one panic attack a week, which considering there was a four a day phase is a marked improvement.

I do not believe she is ready to leave home. But one of the Cambridge benefits is that my sister lives there, so she would have more support than at, for example, Aberystwyth, where the nearest relative is 40-50 minutes away.

The second you said "I took charge" had me thinking that you need to back the fuck off!

So what if she wants to stay local? So what if she doesnt go to Oxbridge?

Leave her be! Its her life, her choice. If she thinks, later, that she made the wrong decision then she can always reapply as a mature student, but right now you are really not helping. She has no confidence in herself and you are making it worse by showing her how wrong she is.

Let the poor girl decide on what is best for her, although I have to admit that her leaving home and finding out what its like to make her own decisions instead of being railroaded by her mother, would be very good for her.

Oh and FWIW I have a good friend who studied Peace Studies who is now internationally renowned in their field and earning more per year than I could hope to earn in my lifetime.

Push her. If she does go there it will be a huge advantage for her for the rest of her life. However I went there and there were many with eating disorders and buckling under the pressure so only if you think she can handle the pressure as its a huge amount of pressure compared to other universities especially English lit.

Have you read the thread gingerbread?!

The 16 GCSEs- one was self taught Japanese that she entered herself for at the local college, and she'd done 5 GCSEs by the end of year 10, so her year 11 was similar to most others (11 GCSEs in year 11 is not uncommon)

I do not have a superiority complex - the speech marks are due to me not knowing the actual title and highly doubting this is it!

This is a strange thread. Why would you wait so late in the thread to mention her very severe panic attacks It's odd.

If she's having attacks like that once a week she shouldn't go to Oxbridge, not until she's more resilient. I'm sorry she's having such a tough time.

That sounds more like a PTSD flashback than a panic attack. She is traumatised and re-enacting how she felt when she found her dad.

I think you need to deal with that first tbh.

She does need to find peace. Listen to what she is trying to tell herself and you.

I didn't see the panic attacks as totally relevant due to our attitude towards them. She has always told me the last thing she wants is for them to impact her future. When she does have them, she immediately tries to get back to whatever was going on before because she doesn't want to let them consume her life.

www.bradford.ac.uk/study/courses/info/peace-studies-ba-3-years

I would like her to take a gap year - there is nothing I would like more! It is simply something she is refusing to entertain, along with a lot of other options.

But you're the parent. Her idea about being too old is ridiculous. The majority of private school students will take a gap year. I don't know anyone who didn't take one.

If she ends up at Oxbridge she'll be in college with third years and mature students anyway.

It's much more important that she goes to uni confident and relaxed than that she goes superyoung. It's a positive disadvantage if she's very close to her mum and worried about being away from home.

I can see you are trying to encourage your daughter to achieve the best that you know she is capable of. I think that most of us mums want that, albeit in different areas of life. A year out is a option for her to rebuild her focus & drive again & to gain life experience which is invaluable.
I wish her all the very best!

RIGHT. I'm taking charge here.

Stop the university tail chasing RIGHT NOW. Yes. That's BOTH of you.

My DD has just taken A2s & her results are (because it's now Wednesday) tomorrow. One of her friends declined to apply to university as she wanted to ASM in the local theatre. In March this year - yes, after all the places were technically offered, she changed her mind and applied to Manchester who offered her a place.

So for goodness sake STOP.

If you must do something, look at adjustment places. Its the opposite of clearing which gives candidates the chance to apply to better universities if they're results are better than expected.

You have six months. Stop every thing. RIGHT NOW.

I didn't see the panic attacks as totally relevant

Well given that they are stopping her from living her life, I would say that they are very relevant.

This girl has been through one of the most traumatic things she can go through. My husband was 25 when he found his housemate dead from suicide and he still, 30 years later, suffers flashbacks. And you dont think its relevant?!

The fact that you've described your relationship as so codependent is totally relevant to her wanting to stay at home for uni. Her having panic attacks at least one a week is very relevant to her not wanting to go away to uni. Mental health issues are massively relevant as to whether or not she should be pushed to apply for a top uni.

We are perhaps focusing on the wrong things, because I have always allowed her to be in control of what we look at. If she says she wants to look at universities and wants my help, then I do just that.

My DH took a big role in trying to tackle the panic attacks about six months ago (signing her up for new types of therapy/counselling/CBT/ always asking her about them) and she found that highly pressurising and stressful, so we took it out of the limelight, as though they need tackling they are not something that is going to go away by intense focus, but rather, I feel, by an overall strengthening of her character. I believe if she applies to five universities she doesn't believe she can get into (for example Warwick, Nottingham, Exeter, Aberystwyth, York) she is highly likely to get into them - not many students have her academic record, and I believe that would boost her confidence.

That's not uncommon with traumatic experiences- to try to push them away and get on with things. It's not unhealthy, but it can be counter productive to take on to much.

Trauma creates a different type of memory than usual experiences. Re-experiencing them to bring them into narrative memory is how the brain tries to heal itself. Until the traumatic memory is fully processed and integrated, the flashbacks will keep occurring. It's one thing to experience one at home/in a familiar setting/around peo-ple who know how to handle it. Another thing in a strange place surrounded by strangers. Being treated with hostility/agrees soon/hostility during or soon after a flashback can really set a person's recovery back rapidly and severely.

Maybe the flashbacks are highly relevant, because that is what is in part leading her to want to say close to home for University? She doesn't;t want to have to go through that on her own/around strangers, or have to explain it/deal with the consequences after? Flashbacks round the unsympathetic could be really damaging, psychologically and in terms of her standing with others (both socially and educationally).

I do not believe she is ready to leave home

You're right, she's not. If, ultimately, she wants to go to Cambridge and your sister's there, all well and good. But that's a decision to be taken further down the line when she's ready.

I believe if she applies to five universities she doesn't believe she can get into (for example Warwick, Nottingham, Exeter, Aberystwyth, York) she is highly likely to get into them - not many students have her academic record, and I believe that would boost her confidence.

Or she'll be in for months of waiting on high alert for a rejection every day.

Yet they are not actually stopping her from living her life, because that is something she is determined to avoid. If she feels panicked, she walks straight into the situation because she believes that's the best way to cope. After she's calmed, even if she still feels jittery, she returns to her lesson or activity or just goes and does something else. She doesn't want the panic attacks to infringe on her life in such a way.

Not uni but AS results this week. I wanted to take dd to get said results and she wanted to go with her bf. I felt upset but didnt argue with her and asked a wise Mner on here who stated the obvious. Let her go with her bf and then ask her; to text or call youi as she'll possibly be upset.
I've taken this advice on board and realised it's dds future and life not mine I'll wait for her call or text comfort her if shes upset and we'll go from there.
She is the person taking exams not me and I'll give advice but from two steps back. I don't want to push her away so she feels unable to discuss things.
It's her life and if she is happy and healthy exam results are a bonus. My apron strings are slowly untying and she'll be an adult in 2 months.

OP - if it makes you feel any better about backing off from your daughter's choices, I am in a very competitive profession where the standard applicant now has a high 1st class degree from a top 5 university and also often has a distinction in a masters. We would absolutely consider an application from somebody with 16 GCSEs at your daughter's grades who has chosen to go to her local university and study Peace Studies for personal reasons, as long as she did well in her degree and in any postgraduate study. Your daughter is not shutting off any options given her situation. I think you need to trust that she is the intelligent girl you think she is, and let her make her own decisions in her own time.

Please just love her and support her. Let her come to you with questions and worries. Whatever you do, don't push her into anything. I also think you need to stop with all the university visits and suggestions. Let her lead the way now.